So Happy Together ~ with Author Maryann McFadden ~ August 15

[bellamarie]

So Happy TOGETHER with Author Maryann McFadden

We are honored to have author Maryann McFadden join us for an in-depth conversation about her book! Join us today!

Discussion Schedule:

Aug15 to Aug 20--Read and discuss- Prologue thru Chap 12
Aug 21 thru Aug 26--Read & discuss-Chap 13 thru Chap 25
Aug 27 thru Sept 1-- R&D--Chap 26 thru 38
Sept 2 thru 5--R&D--Chap 39 thru Epilogue  [/font]


Discussion Leader: Adoannie


There are so many dynamics going on in just the first few chapters I can barely keep up.  Each character immediately has a place and purpose and are so very complex.  Dysfunctional is surely the word for this family, but then again I agree with Annie, that ALL families have a degree of dysfunction in their lives, even the ones who appear to be the picture perfect family in public.

I am not sure I like John being a part of the storyline.  He seems out of place and too conveniently in sync with Claire's aspirations.  He is the "too good to be true" character and too obvious where this is headed.  We all seem to agree Rick is not well suited for the chaos in Claire's family.  I don't think that makes him a bad person, I think some people are cut out for handling these type of situations and then there are those who have not experienced family matters such as these, who have their lives all planned out and are not capable of accepting or adjusting to things that don't fit into their plans.

I'm not even so sure Claire, Fanny, or Joe are ready for all the issues they are facing, but because they have gone through the abandoned father issue they are more perpared to deal with it.  Amy has so much growing up and maturing to do.  I don't fault her not knowing what to do with having a baby.  I like how she is at least trying. I sense there is going to be a whole lot of sadness and hurt in store for this family, which means its headed our way.  

Alf, I must say I can tell you did the very best you could.  Daughters can be very complicated in the best of situations.  It seems our author has done a realistic job in capturing the emotions, reactions and consequences with all these situations.  Kudos to Maryann.

[JoanR]

I couldn't stop myself and have read too far ahead so am fearful of saying too much!  This I can say though:  Bellamarie has these folks nailed!  John is a bit too convenient.  It's not remarkable that he is attractive and compatible but it's awfully convenient that his professional interests are so compatible (spelling?) as well.

Rick is controlling, narrow-minded and politically incorrect!  Away with him, I say!!

My heart goes out to Claire's parents.  Their situation comes a tad too close to home here.

As for Amy,  I really can't understand how she could seemingly have been ignoring the existence of the little life kicking her in the middle.  That's pretty hard to do!  The only preparation she seems to have made is to turn up on her mother's doorstep.  I think she has a way to go before she can really relate to her own child.


This book doesn't let you go - you have to find out what happens to all these folks!

[MaryannMcFadden]

I simply love how engaged everyone is in this, and your very  different perspectives on the characters. And I honestly can't wait to see how your thoughts progress as we get further into the story.

While there seems to be this desire for Amy to run away, it truly is out of fear--that she simply isn't a good enough, strong enough, person to handle it. And of course her track record proves it. Her father having absolutely nothing to do with her for 20 years, also makes her believe she is not worth much. She obviously has a lot of growing up to do.

Yes, the song is HAPPY TOGETHER by the Turtles, and it did not really have anything to do with the title, except that I was thinking of using it for another book and my publisher loved it, and wanted to use it, and in the end, it worked in an ironic way!

[ANNIE]

Read Chapters 13 through 25 and Discuss from Aug 21 to Aug 26.

Tomorrow is the final day for the first 12 chapters and we must move on to more of the story as it moves from a loving new grandmother, Claire, giving Rose her first bath, to  some heavy decision making by one confused lady who stands in the middle of these needy people and knows she is the one that they depend on for answers in their mixed up lives.  What to do, what to do!

[ginny]

Before we leave this section, I have yet another reaction. I had lunch  with a friend  today and over lunch we discussed Rick and his cryptic statement about getting what you think you deserve.

My friend  has not read the book, but being a positive person in outlook, she came up with  perhaps Rick is saying that you need to  think more of yourself (to Claire), to aim higher in life so you can get what you  think you deserve.

Had not thought of that, Rick is down on my likeometer, but I'll keep it in mind for this next set;  as JoanR says, we must find out.

2005? The Turtles? Surely that song is older? Beach Boys?  Surely it's more than 5 years old, I seem to remember it from WAY long ago. Yes that's it, good for you Ann, bouncy little thing isn't it?  hahaha Mrssherlock.

[Finnabair]

"Happy Together" is a 1967 song from The Turtles' album of the same name. Released in February of 1967, the song knocked The Beatles' "Penny Lane" out of the #1 slot for three weeks on the Billboard Hot 100.[1] It was the group's only chart-topper. "Happy Together" reached #12 on the UK Singles Chart in April 1967.[2] The song was written by Gary Bonner and Alan Gordon, former members of a band known as The Magicians.[1] The song had been rejected a dozen times before The Turtles were offered it, and the demo acetate was worn out.[3]

Wikipedia

[ginny]

HA!! Thank you Finnabar!

Maryann, did you have another title initially in mind? Did you start with a title initially or did  the title come last as you were writing the book? We can see the  publisher liked So Happy Together, what was your original thought for this book?

I  understand you have a heck of a story on your journey to being a published writer. Would this be a good time to tell us about it? My goddaughter would like to get a book published. (Isn't she only 4 years old though?  How time flies!)

What advice would you give an author who wants to see their dream of publishing a book realized?


 How does it FEEL to see your own book in print?

[MaryannMcFadden]

Somehow I lost a post from yesterday, and now, after babysitting my 9 month old granddaughter overnight, I can't remember what I wrote! Apologies!

So...I've kind of had a week like Claire's, lots of family demands, very little time to work or do anything for me, and there are moments when I think...It sure would be nice to get away from all this and have the kind of life lots of people my age do, start living for themselves.

Everyone has breaking points, and sometimes I do, too. But, right now, little Julia is singing and playing and she is the biggest love and joy, and I'm reminded that life is just this: messy, beautiful, chaotic, heartbreaking, and joyful. And we just have to roll with the punches.

[ANNIE]

Before we go on, we seem to have missed what has happened to Joe when he fell and Fanny's depression when she thinks about their life from now on.  His Parkinson's isn't going to get any better and she isn't going to get any younger while taking care of him.  Many women face challenge today as they seem to be the care givers at the end of their partner's life.  Seems like the son seems to think they should go into a tri-care community but not near him.  And maybe they should think of Claire adding a room to her house for them.  He doesn't want them in California. 
And what does anyone think will happen when Joe's PT, Seth, mentions a Buddhist term to of  "Its all just Dukkha" and Fannie wonders how she should know about Buddhism.  Hmmm, wonder that's all about??

[pedln]

Dukkha

From the wikipedia blurb -- it sounds like it refers to or includes things unpleasant.

[ANNIE]

Pedl'n,
Unpleasant but something one doesn't need to get upset about???  That's sort of the Buddhist approach to life, isn't it?  Choose what you can deal with in life?? Ignore the rest??  Its all 'dukka'!!

[MaryannMcFadden]

RE: DUHKHA

In a book I read from time to time, called BUDDHISM PLAIN AND SIMPLE,  it says that duhkha is not easily translatable. It's often translated as "suffering," but according to this book that only gets at part of what the word means. It's also often translated as the opposite of "satisfaction" which most would assume is "dissatisfaction," which still doesn't quite hit the mark, according to this author.

Duhkha actually comes from a Sanskrit word that refers to "a wheel out of kilter," and the first truth of the buddha-dharma likens human life to this out of kilter wheel.

It goes on and on, too long to paraphrase or copy here. But the message is that we need to be present in the moment, we need to really SEE our lives.

I hope that helps.

[ALF43]

OMG- I am tired and want to comment on Duktah.  I promise to return tomorrow. 

[ANNIE]

Wasn't that a kindness on John Poole's part in giving Meyer's picture to Claire!  Well, we all know or think we know where this it is going.  Makes me want to read the book now, right to the end.  Can't wait to see how this all comes about.

Oh, Maryann, I think I have this all wrong when is comes to Buddhism.  I thought Dukkha would mean "Don't sweat the small stuff.  Its all small stuff!"  Well, obviously I don't understand Buddhism.  Oh well!

When I was reading the chapter about the party that Rick suggested, I suddenly felt as though I was one of the guests and could feel all that occurred.  It certainly wasn't hard to do.  I know it wasn't meant to be humorous but right from the beginning,  it seemed that we were all headed for a fall.   The "human honesty"  of all the party guests was palpable.  Baby Rose seems to know how to get attention when necessary.  Aren't all babies that way!  Just scream and someone will come running!   
Another thing that stands out is Rick's kindness to Missy about dancing with her at the the wedding but his reluctance when it came to holding the baby.  And then, Claire notices,  his look of horror as the whole family and guests dissolved into bedlam.  That can happen anytime, anywhere, in all big get togethers. 

Most of the time, much of what is written in this chapter happens quieter and sneakier.  One doesn't hear about the little disagreements that occurred until the next day or the next week.  I can remember at our son's wedding when, unbeknownst to most of the guests,  my 80yr old aunt mildly announced her political preference for Bill Clinton and my mom laying her out with just  a few words about her preferences and ending it with, "This isn't the place to talk politics".  Never gave Aunt Grace a chance to defend herself.

[Finnabair]

One point I caught was that Rick suggested the party, and Claire hops right to it.  Sigh.  Why do we women do these kinds of things?

[ALF43]

Maryann-  I love the visual "clues" you set up in the story.
"He'd (John Poole) pulled his shirt back on and there were dark blotches where it CLUNG to wet skin." 

oh-h-h - A real woman's guy he is noticing how sad Claire looked and giving her that book for inspiration.

Finnabair-I understand why Claire jumped at the chance to have a party, like Rick had suggested.  He found the best in any situation, she mused, even if it was totally self-serving (for his business dealings.)
I laughed when Amy introduced herself and said "hey you're my new dad."  That cracked me up being a single woman for 12 years, I can just imagine what a couple of guys I dated would have done if one of my kids had said that-- he'd be gone in a heart beat.
Rick's not much of the "daddy" type, nor the baby type particularly when he eyed Claire in her pretty pink sundress.

[ALF43]

Maryann- I love the feeling of "family" and contentment that Fanny feels when she witnessed her two children together.  Everything has been falling apart for that dear woman and now she joyfully put that sadness behind her for just a moment.
That was short lived as everything "spun out of control" shortly there after as brother and fiance argued politics, the baby wailed, Joe had an accident and began to cry and Claire saw the look of revulsion on Rick's face.
 OMG I have lived this scene.

[ginny]

Love all the comments here, I had completely missed Rick suggesting the party!

This is an interesting section and certainly ends with a wow! Liam is coming!! Almost a cliff hanger, makes you want to read on.

Amy seems so happy,  but Fanny isn't, I find her character interesting. Joe shares his past with Claire and not her, how does she know he's shared his past?  There are interesting dynamics in all the characters and their relationships with each other.

To me this section seems to be about potential, the entire thing is about potential, finding your own self. I'm trying to see how each one (besides the baby of course) is going to be what they want to be. (Im trying to juggle this and a 3 year old so it may be  incoherent.)

She is horrified that the awful Liam is coming but does not say so. How interesting that is, and what it says about being a grandmother. I could talk on that one all day.

I was interested in the T shape foot placement  for those with Parkinson's, I did not know that, is that true? I will file it away under Useful Stuff to Know.

I don't know enough about photography to comment on the black and white versus color issue, is that what's normally thought? That black and white photos are undeveloped (pardon the pun hahaha) of a more mature photography skill in color?

I liked Claire's disappointment in the course initially and her seeking out the instructor to say so, that's really proactive for her.

Meanwhile Rick is excited about his real estate development, uninterested in the canal preservation and very excited about his golf tournament, he might even win! Is in a hurry to get off the phone, having made the perfunctory "haven't forgotten you" call.

I wil be shocked if they end up together, but somehow  John Poole is almost too good to be true. I keep telling myself this IS what Claire wants, to be married, etc., to share her life with somebody else, this is going to be interesting. So she's in her 40's too?

When we started the tension was in, to me, fear. Fear of the unknown, fear of dealing with circumstances. Now each of the characters is actually stepping out, do you agree or do you see something else? Each has pushed a little bit, even unwillingly, the boundaries of comfort. So I have to ask myself what is providing the tension now? Because there IS tension.

Do you think Claire made a good decision to take her parents along?

[serenesheila]

I am enjoying this book.  IMO Rick is a total control freak!  He seems to constantly be telling Claire what to do, and what not to do, as well as how she should feel, and what she will enjoy.  PLEASE!  Her unwillingness to disagree with him, and not confront him, will breed anger, I expect.

Claire's well layed plans, have certainly exploded.  Her daughter, her parents, and her granddaughter, in addition to John Poole, to whom she rented her home, for the summer.  I have had periods in my life when my plans have exploded, too.

In fact, last April, my 48 y/o daughter moved back in with me.  She brought her little Yorkie, and the family desert tortoise with her.  Jodi has been unemployed for more than a year.  She hasn't been able to find a job.  My quiet life has been quite disrupted.  She is working part time.  She also decided to take a class at the nearby junior college, for 8 weeks this summer.

She has both a BA and a MA, but education doesn't seem to necessisarily guarantee a job.  So, she has decided to learn to design web pages, and upgrade her computer skills.  So, she is at school, today.  She also has classes Monday through Thursday.  She has applied for a grant, and I am paying for her books.  I am grateful to have enough money to be able to do that.  But, giving her free room and board, is cutting into my savings regiem, for whatever I have in store in my final years.

Sheuka


N

[bellamarie]

Oh my heavens I was so shocked, happy, and uncertain about Claire's decision to take Amy, baby Rose and her parents along with her.  Wow, she is suppose to have taken this class and time alone for herself finally and look how it has turned out.  I understand how she could not bare leaving her parents in that assisted living home.  Poor Fanny is losing all the life out of her just having to live there and be drugged with antidepressants.  I was feeling depressed just reading how her life has changed.


Maryanne how in Hades were you able to write this book with all these characters going through so much without crying as you typed?  I seriously feel so close to the situations that I had to put the book down because I found  myself feeling so sad.  Then I read your post # 47, and I am more convinced than ever that you are in my head, living my life.  LOLOL  You wrote every word and feeling above that I have been experiencing this past week.  I've been so busy I didn't know which way was up, and yes, I stopped and took a second to hug my little 2 yr old grandson Zakary, who just graduated to a toddler bed and said, "This is what its all about."

So...now I ask myself where on earth is everyone's life going to turn out?  Claire is taking on way too much, where is her breaking point?  I know I feel mine near from time to time and my hubby and I say, we have to take a week end away.  Rick, now this man seems to be living for himself and would love to include Claire into his world, but......we all can see this is NOT going to go the way they intended.  He is already one step out the door, with the lets wait and see how all this goes.  We all know what that means.  Claire is desperately wanting to hang on to the life she so was thinking she wanted with Rick.  Yet, there is no way she can have that life and it include her family and all their needs.

It seems my thoughts of John Poole were spot on, he almost kissed her.  Well, of course he did.  lolol  I've read too  many Danielle Steele books to see the handwriting on the wall early on when Mr. nonchalant, too good looking, built and caring comes along.  So do we root for John and Claire?  It is pretty obvious that would make her life simple.  She would probably not retire from teaching just yet and continue in some way with her photography.  

As for the brother,  I say,  "Ingrate!"  There is always that one family member who thinks they have the best solution and answers to all the problems and have the income to supply the quick fixes, so long as it does not interupt their own lives.  Grrr...he loves looking like the doting son in Fanny's eyes by making the obligatory phone calls, driving in on his white horse and then leaving all the mess to Claire.

Amy is rising up to the challenge and does care very much for her grandparents.  The fact she was able to be aware of the home drugging Fanny from her experience from working in a home was quite impressive.  She is really keeping a close eye on her grandmother and that captures my heart.  So many times mothers and daughters are so close alike they just can't seem to get along but the grandmother seems to be the resting spot.  The go to person for both mother/daughter.  I love this relationship between Fanny and Amy.

Okay enough for now....sorry so lengthy, I was so busy these past few days I thought I'd better get in now while my thoughts are fresh and I don't forget them.  lolol  Early Alzheimer's, I think not just overload.  lol

p.s.  Maryanne, can you tell I am a writer also?  I could go on and on.....lololol Oh...but I did!!!  lolol  

[bellamarie]

Okay just one more thought....I don't see Rick as a control freak at all.  He offers Claire a life she seems to think she wants.  He seems very self centered and goes for what he wants, and it seems he continues to be working to achieve the end result which is to be able for him and Claire to retire and live the perfect lives they want, she aspiring to her photography and he loves his golf.  He suggested she have the party, which I think was a good idea, even if it ended in a calamity.  I was laughing out loud at all the things happening, and someone like Rick would have horror on their face.  LOLOLOL  I would have paid a million bucks to see that in real life, but then again, I think I have a few times in my years of family get togethers.  Every wedding reception we all held our breaths for the  night to end without some kind of a blow up.  Italians have high emotions especially at family functions and believe me our family lived up to the Mama Mia exclamation.  I think we are all seeing Rick is not the right match for Claire so its easy to criticize him.  I don't see him as a bad guy, he really does seem to love Claire and we have to consider she sure does seem to love him, or at least the idea of what her life would be like with him.  What's that saying, "Be careful what you wish for."  My thought is this....does every book have to end with the girl gets Mr. Wonderful for it to be a happily ever after?  Maybe, just maybe...Claire may see she doesn't need any man in her life to be happy, maybe just maybe she can be happy and has been happy achieving her goals in photography and teach.  Maybe, just maybe, Claire is growing up, right along with Amy.  Okay, now I am done!

Ciao~

p.s. Sereneshelia, just waned to say many families are experiencing what you and your daughter are going through with this economy in such a mess.  Experience nor education matters as much in the job fields today.  It's sad, and I pray it gets better in the future. 

[mabel1015j]

Hi All - i just got my book yesterday. I won't spend a lot of time going over the first 12 chapts, but just a few comments.........

Re: the "teacher-thing" - being able to retire at 50 or 55 came later than the time when i was in college and going into teaching. So, catching that "brass-ring" was not in the tho'ts of the people around me, in the mid-60's. I think we thought it almost a "do-gooder," quite respectable job, that we were doing something FOR our communities.

It was the thinking of many that it was a good profession to be in. Teachers had more respect in the community then than they do now, and it was a positive idea at the time to get a job that had security. That was considered a good thing by our parents who had lived thru the Depression. Interesting to me how that has somehow turned into a bad thing to do - that we should look for a career that will "fulfill" us should now be the highest criteria and we have some how sold-out if we are looking for security. And even more so, that would make us bad teachers. I obviously disagree w/ that premise. I taught for 7 yrs in the 60's and one yr in the early 80's in public high schools and i must say that almost every one i knew in the profession cared about doing a good job and cared about the students. There were, of course, some who were just putting in time, as in all jobs.

When i went to community college teaching, i had some of those students who someone had told them it was a good idea to get a college degree, so THEY were just putting in time to get to that end objective. And i had some students who were not there to learn but to get those all important good grades, not so they had a good education, but so they could move on to a "good college." Since those trad'l college-age students took mostly the day courses, i preferred to teach in the evening where i was more likely to have students who really wanted to get an education and were ages 18 - 76. I heard the frustrations of those professors who were teaching the day courses and had students who wouldn't read the assignments, didn't come to class prepared in any way and many prof's who were just sick of the politics of academia - they were sometimes just putting in time. Students are sometimes high, obnoxious, self-centered, entitled and rude, not the student you and i went to school with. Therefore, i would caution you to not fall for the rhetoric against teacher unions as their just wanting to live "high on the hog,"  and being selfish and uncaring. Teachers need a lot more protection today than they did decades ago.

Oops, i guess i did drag that out and this is a little more than a "few comments" that i meant to write.

BTW - none of my critcisms of characters should be construed as criticism of the way the author wrote the story. Characters that raise frustrations mean a more interesting story.

All of these women characters need a good assertiveness training course. They blame everybody else for their not doing what they wish to do and took no control of their own lives as they lived them and now whine about it. "I'll do such-and-such when i get rid of these other responsibilities......................." Nobody tells us that we will always have responsibility for other people/to other people for all of our lives. And nobody tells us that we will always keep secrets from our parents and from our  children, either protecting them or ourselves, or that those secrets  frequently come to the fore somewhere down the line of our lives.

This family has the habit of "walking out" of every uncomfortable situation. Most of them have "run away" sev'l times in their lives. Mabey Amy's therapist can help them break that pattern. Granted it is sometimes better to walk away, but these folks seem to never talk in an adult way to each other - of course, as i said, that makes for a more interesting story........................lol....................jean

[ANNIE]

"Nobody tells us that we will always have responsibility for other people/to other people for all of our lives. And nobody tells us that we will always keep secrets from our parents and from our  children, either protecting them or ourselves, or that those secrets  frequently come to the fore somewhere down the line of our lives."

You are so right, Jean.  When my children were just entering school back in the '60's, I kept saying we need to start parenting classes for these kids in kindergarten and keep it part of the curriculum throughout their first 12 yrs of schooling.  I was struggling to be a good parent and found it much more difficult than I expected.  The school authorities thought it not necessary so it never happened.
 
In today's world, I am glad to see parents seeking help for their inept parenting and other problems.  Its a different world out there and they deserve all the help they need.

[mrssherlock]

Sheila:  You have lots of company these days.  Both my children, unemployed, are living with me; it takes nagging, too, to get things done, they are just unaware not uncaring.  Not how I pictured my retirement at all!  School grants are a help but . . .

[MaryannMcFadden]

Well, I missed alot in the day I didn't hop on. We are having my littlest granddaughter's baptism party at my house today, with 40+ people, so yesterday was very busy.

First, photography. Black and white has been considered more "artistic," not really "less developed." And it's Claire's comfort zone, because that's where she was trained, so she was reluctant to stay on the course.

And yes, at times this was a tough book to write, as I am in the thick of this sandwich generation thing, and was afraid of making it too real. But I didn't want to gloss over a very serious situation so many people are living through.

Of course Claire took her parents. In the end, it was what she had to do, for herself. She loves her parents and saw her mother slipping away. And she made a rash decision, which we'll have to see how it turns out.

Don't you just love Provincetown? I fell in love with it, and it became for me, the perfect setting for this book.

Ok, gotta run, probably won't be back on until tomorrow, a big day for Julia Rose!

[ALF43]

Maryann-

And yes, at times this was a tough book to write, as I am in the thick of this sandwich generation thing, and was afraid of making it too real. But I didn't want to gloss over a very serious situation so many people are living through.

Yes, sometimes when you are living a situation Maryann it becomes much easier to relate your story.  The only problem with that is the affected  members of your family are concerned with the account that you tell.

That is an apt statement- the sandwich generation.  It is happening to most of us, I fear.  If not living in close proximity, the challenges of growing old, parenting and maturing are still present and PRESSING!
I think that we all do the best that we can for one another, most times, as Serene Sheila and MsSherlock can tell you.
It is so sad for me that we all live in this fractured environment, many of us, so far from our loved ones and can not be there to lend that constant support. It saddens me that most times it has to be via the telephone or Inet that we give our encourgement and moral support to those in need.

[ALF43]

And I might add- sometimes it is a darned good thing that I live so far away.

[MaryannMcFadden]

Oh I know what you mean! My daughter used to live just a mile away and would drop in with the baby every day! I work from home, so when they dropped in, work stopped! They are now about 30 min away, a healthy distance, and now there are 3 little ones, and another on the way, so at least I get a call before they come LOL!

But truthfully, I know I'm lucky to have both my parents still alive, and in the same town where I live. My son and his wife, and my brother and sister are both here, too. This "extended family" as it's now being called, used to be the norm. So many of my girlfriends tell me how fortunate I am, as their parents are gone, and they long for grandchildren. I guess we all long for balance, and that's where the Buddhism comes in for me (and Fanny!)

I almost forgot, that T step with Parkinsons really works. My mother-in-law has had it for 20 yrs, is now late stage, and it was the jump start that often got her going when she stalls.

[ANNIE]

The sandwich generation, hmmmm!  Let's see that would make me and MDH the peanut butter??or the chopped liver?  Well, I wouldn't go that far.  Tee hee

We returned to our hometown about 12 years ago just so we could be near our son and his family since they didn't want to move to Atlanta where we lived.  It is wearing sometimes but also a lot of joy.  We wanted to see their four children grow up and really be in the thick of their lives and WE ARE!  Its been soccer grandparents, scout grans, church grans,  plus sleep overs, Pinewood Derbies,etc etc. ever since we arrived.  And we have really enjoyed seeing them grow and mature.
  
Due to some medical problems of their oldest son, we have had him living with us for the last 16 months.  Up at 5:30 every morning to get him out the door to catch the 6:40 school bus and helping with homework has been a real eye opener.  School is certainly different than when we were there. They can do their work on the computer and send it to the teacher!!
Nathan is a nice young man at the age 14/15 and pleasant, so he and I have quite a bond.  He will be back home for the beginning of school, freshman year,  and as my daughter says, "You get to go through the empty nest thing again, Mom!"   Thanks, dear daughter!  Sleeping later will be very nice

My question here is:  Are we the bread or the peanut butter??  or somtimes both??/b]

[ginny]

And I think I would be interested to know how this book developed? Did you start out with a particular goal in mind when writing it, Maryann, or did you let the characters take you where they  wanted to go?

Do you use the dreaded "outline?" I've never been able to outline anything, personally.

[pedln]

Those of you with family living near are very fortunate indeed.  My four children (and six grands) live busy involved lives on the east or west coast, and I'm in the middle of the country.  And they spend their vacation time in the mountains or on the beach.  I'm always welcome anytime I want to visit, but there is a limit to how much one wants to travel.  This summer , after three trips in as many months, I had to say enough, no Seattle this summer.

Finally caught up with the appropriate chapters.  Claire is brave, but perhaps a bit foolhardy? But I must digress to the description of Provincetown and the surrounding area.  What a treat.  After reading about it last night I had to rush to the maps this morning.  How can you drive through a town and then see it again.  Absolutely fascinating.  I don't think I've ever been farther than Barnstable and that was eons ago.  Provincetown is one place I want to see before I die.

Claire is doing the right thing, I think, and she is admirable.  But Amy is my favorite.  And I just can't warm up to Fanny like the rest of you.

[ALF43]

Annie, after this summer I will go for the chopped liver name.

The greatest truth is told on pg. 129, IMO.  “When you’re a parent, you can never win.”

[ALF43]

Maryann- how was 'lil Julia Rose on her special day yesterday?

  A couple of questions for you.
1.   Do you have a real interest in Astrology when writing about the Perseids?  Did you witness them at their peak activity this month?  The meteor count was roughly 50 per hour.
 
 oh-h how romatic that would be to just lie quietly next to someone and witness a beautiful Perseid meteor shower that produce some of the brightest of all meteor showers.

2.  Do you have the passion for photography as Claire does?

 

[mabel1015j]

I keep asking the question "how does Claire keep thinking  she is going to be able to go to ARizona when (if) the time comes?"

It was smart of Maryann to have Rick out of touch thru most of this, what a complication he would have made if Claire had to deal w/ him being present, but w/ being on the fringes, he's just the right amount of complexity to be interesting.

I laughed at the paragraph mentioning how he is always late. I have a husband and a dgt who drive my son and me nuts because they are always late. Altho, i must say my husband has improved much since our courting days. I used to come to Jersey from Harrisburg on the bus on week-ends and i always told him i would be in a half hour before i was going to arrive and still i sometimes had to wait for him. I learned that it was just a habit w/ his family, that you never depended on any specific time for doing something. Now, how my dgt grew up w/ the same habit when she lived w/ me for 18 yrs?!?.......... I don't understand that at all............are genes that strong??

I haven't been in P-town for 39 yrs, so i'm enjoying thinking about it again.

Yes, i am happy to have both my son and dgt living w/in 20 mins of us, especially now that they both have children and they seem to enjoy coming to visit about once a week, or so. I generally have each g-child one day a week for a couple hrs, which is just the right amount of time. I had forgotten how much energy it takes to look after an infant. I think of them as just eating and sleeping, but there is a lot of mental energy involved and then when they are toodlers it's even more so. Thank goodness Mother Nature made them so cute, they grab our hearts and don't let go no matter how tiring they can be.

We have friends who are considering moving 3 states away from their g-children when they completely retire - i just don't understand that. Once you've had the opportunity to watch them start to grow up, how can you volutarily move away from that? On the other hand, i have dear friends who have lived in Indiana for the last 30 yrs whose children & grands live in NC and Montana, so every 2 mos they are at one or the other children's homes for a visit. Fortunately they are capable - economically and phsyically able to do that at the moment. ............jean

[MaryannMcFadden]

Yes, I hate outlines, so I don't really outline the entire book. I start with the characters, throw them into situations, and see where they take me. Sometimes that makes it harder, but overall, I think it makes it more enjoyable for me, as I want them to be as realistic as possible, not molded to fit an outline.

I didn't get to see the Perseid's this year, as our skies were overcast both nights. But I have watched many times. Also, several years ago, the Leonid meteor shower in November was particularly spectacular, and we were up half the night sitting at the local airstrip, away from all the lights of town, and it was amazing, 50 an hour or so!

I loved photography, but I've gotten away from it over the years, and would love to one day have my own darkroom again. Or simply the time to experiment with and get more serious in digital format.

I'm so glad you're enjoying the setting! I want to take my readers away--and me, too!

[Lucylibr]

I was impressed by the speed with which Claire made the decision to take her parents to Provincetown. At the beginning of Chapter 23 she is going to see them "one more time" "to assure herself...they'd be fine" (page 165).
On the next page, she tells her father that both of them are going with her. I'm sure she has had this in the back of her mind for a while and she has been pondering it. The statement that they ARE going "came out as a sob," a detail that I think, Mary Ann, is perfect. All the love she has for her parents and her daughter and grandchild are expressed here, while little is said about the difficulty of taking this group, getting them ready, etc., is said.  It's a brilliant decision, to bring everyone into a new and beautiful setting where they can evaluate their lives and relationships.

[bellamarie]

Oh dear Jean I think you are possibly being a bit too hard on the women characters.  Fanny, Claire and Amy are all doing the best they can in the situations they have found themselves in.  My heart goes out to each of them. 

Maryanne, yes indeed I love the setting of Provincetown.  For our 40th Anniversary coming up in May 2011 my hubby and I are planning a trip to Cape Cod.  I have never been to the East coast and have longed to see it, so we decided to forego Hawaii, Bahamas, or Sandals beaches and will share our special event on Marha's Vineyard, and now I feel I must see Provincetown.

At one time or another each of my three grown children returned to the nest after testing their flying wings as they became adults.  Each time one of them needed love, support, comfort and a soft place to come home to we agreed but put a time limit on it.  Each one of them respected that and met the time frame.  I believe we must always be there for our adult kids and grandchildren but we MUST never enable them or allow them overtax our lives.  I did not cook, clean or pick up after them when they returned, it was not a part of the deal.  lol  My hubby and I let them know that we must continue with our lives because we had already gone through the empty nest syndrome.  I have provided free day care for all my grandkids for 14 yrs now and I wouldn't have it any other way. 

I think Claire and Fanny know that if they are there for Amy during this time in her life it will teach her, and provide her the necessary time to grow up, and develop the skills she needs for herself, and her little baby Rose.   I have concerns, but I also have faith and hope this family is going to figure things out in Provincetown.  I see it as "Promisetown."

[ANNIE]

Maryann,
I,too, am bowled over at the speed with which Claire made those decisions to take the family along with her as there was no other way she would have left town.  I think that living in a whole new atmosphere (with the light of Cape Cod present every day) will maybe make them sit up and see the garden of their lives.  They do have so much promise especially the three women.  Joe?  I'm not too sure about. But he's not well and I will wait and see what happens to him.

Probably 20 years ago, I was told about Perseid Showers and while I was up in Ithaca,NY, my daugher , her husband and their two children and myself spent several hours after midnight laying on a hill out in front of their hilltop home, gazing at the beauty of the August sky.  What fun and certainly better than the 4th of July fireworks because it was nature at its stunning best.

Did you know that there are heavy meteor showers throughout August??  Sounds like you might have the same problem in NJ as we do in OH, overcast often.   I was lucky enough to take myself out to the country 3 yrs ago after midnight to see this natural show.  One year I took our oldest gran, Nathan, with me.  He too loved it.  Never ceases to amaze me.

We were lucky enough to attend a talk by the professor who runs the huge telescope up in Delaware, OH, where folks gather on the lawns all year round trying to learn how to use their telescopes.  They are mentored by his students.  His enthusiasm just spills over the whole crowd.

Your interest in Buddhism is in line with my daughter's.  She has been fascinated with that philosophy for several years now and it seems to satisfy her.

[MaryannMcFadden]

I almost forgot to reply: Julia's baptism was beautiful! Of course it rained, so we had to have the party inside, but we managed. It was my favorite kind of day, surrounded by family, enjoying my beautiful granddaughters.

So...the best is yet to come! So glad many of you are falling in love with the Cape. It's got such diversity in its landscape, so if you go, try to see different parts of it, such as Chatham, and Woods Hole and of course Provincetown.

As for where are we in this sandwich generation? Fanny is soon about to tell you 

[mabel1015j]

Belle - you are probably right about my being too hard on the women. I try really hard not to be judgemental about the real people in my life, so maybe it's easy to be too judgemental of these fictional characters. But i do think they've all been too-passive and avoiding in their lives together.

I agree w/ alot of what you have said in posts #59 and 60.

Annie - i agree completely about the need for parenting classes in public schools. However, i wonder it you can have non-parents, especially young people, really understand what it is going to be like to be responsible for someone else for - at least - the next 20 yrs, and after that feel guilty about whether you did all you could do to help them to adulthood.

As to Claire's continuing to think about she and Rick being married and going west - I see that as her "dream" for herself, leaving the trials she is living now and enjoying her own life, as we all, i think, have dreams in our heads about what could be different for us. BUT, i haven't had an inkling that she knows that is a dream, not to be reality.

I do like what appears to be the growing-up of Amy and hope that Claire gives her more and more responsibility for the baby. .......jean