Emma~ Jane Austen ~ March - April Book Club Online

[bellamarie]

The Book Club Online is  the oldest  book club on the Internet, begun in 1996, open to everyone.  We offer cordial discussions of one book a month,  24/7 and  enjoy the company of readers from all over the world.  Everyone is welcome.

March/April Book Club Online

Emma
by Jane Austen

"I am going to take a heroine whom no one but myself will much like”  Jane Austen of Emma. Will you like her, the heroine who Austen claimed was most like herself, and who inspired a movie called "Clueless"? If not, there's lots more to like in this classic novel of love, misdirection, and social class.

Schedule

March 1-5  Part I:  Chapters 1-7
March 6 - 12 Part I:  Chapters 8-17
March 13  Part I:  Chapter 18, Part II Chapter 1-6
March 19  Part II: Chapter 7-13 
March 23  Part II: Chapters 14-18 Part III Chapters 1-4
March 27  Part III: Chapter 5-9
March 30  Part III: Chapter 10-end

QUESTIONS VOLUME II CHAPTERS 7-13

1. Does the fact that frank Churchill goes to London to get his hair cut change your opinion of him? Why or why not?

2. Why does Emma not want to go to the Coles? Do such class distinctions exist where you live? What is their basis? Why did her opinion of the Coles change when she got there?

3. Did Emma do wrong when she shared her suspicions of Jane Fairfax with Frank? What do you think of his efforts to tease Jane about them in chapter X?

4. Who do you think the piano came from? What do Jane's reactions while people are talking about it tell you?

5. Is Emma falling in love with Frank Churchill? Is it possible not to know if you're in love or not?

6. "A mind lively and at ease, can do with seeing nothing, and can see nothing that does not answer." Do you agree?

7. Harriet, tempted by everything and swayed by half a word, was always very long at a purchase." Have you ever gone shopping with a friend like that? How did it work out?

Text of Emma ~~~ Emma review ~~~ Austen related books ~~~ Jane Austen biography

Discussion Leader: JoanK

Barb, I agree, Frank and Jane do indeed need their time away.  I got the impression they would be living in the Chruchill estate, since he would inherit it, once the elder Mr. Churchill, passes on.

One of my most favorite parts of this entire story, lies in the conversation of Emma and Mr. Knightley, speaking of Mrs. Weston's new baby girl.

Chapter 53

Mrs. Weston's friends were all made happy by her safety, and if the satisfaction of her well-doing could be increased to Emma, it was by knowing her to be the mother of a little girl.  She had been decided in wishing for a Miss Weston.  She would not acknowledge that it was with any view of making a match for her, hereafter, with either of Isabella's sons; but she was convinced that a daughter would suit both father and mother best.  It would be a great comfort to Mr. Weston, as he grew older__and even Mr. Weston might be growing older ten years hence__to have his fireside enlivened by the sports and nonsense, the freaks and the fancies of a child never banished from home; and Mrs. Weston__no one could doubt that a daughter would be most to her; and it would be quite a pity that anyone who so well knew how to teach, should not have their powers in exercise again.  

"She has the advantage, you know, of practicing on me,"  she continued__"like La Baronne d' Almane on La Contesse d' Ostalis, in Madame de Genlis' "Adelaide and Theodore,' and we shall now see her own little Adelaide educated on a more perfect plan.""

"That is,"  replied Mr. Knightley, "she will indulge her even  more than she did you, and believe that she does not indulge her at all.  It will be the only difference."  "Poor child!"  cried Emma; "at that rate what will become of her?"  "Nothing very bad.  The fate of thousands.  She will be disagreeable in infancy, and correct herself as she grows older.  I am losing all my bitterness against spoilt children, my dearest Emma.  I, who am owing all my happiness to you, would not it be horrible ingratitude in me to be severe on them?"  Emma laughed, and replied:  "But I had the assistance of all your endeavors to counteract the indulgence of other people.  I doubt whether my own sense would have corrected me without it."  "Do you?  I have no doubt.  Nature gave you understanding:  Miss Taylor gave you principles.  You must have done well.  My interference was quite as likely to do harm as good.  It was very natural for you to feel that it was done in a disagreeable manner.  I do not believe I did you any good.  The good was all to myself, by making you an object of the tenderest affection to me.  I could not think about you so much without doting on you, faults and all; and by dint of fancying so many errors, have been in love with you ever since you were thirteen at least."

"I am sure your were of use to me," cried Emma.  "I was very often influenced rightly by you__oftener than I would own at the time.  I am very sure you did me good.  And if poor little Anna Weston is to be spoiled, it will be the greatest humanity in you to do as much for her as you have done for me, except falling in love with her when she is thirteen."

"How often, when you were a girl, have you said to me, with one of your saucy looks__"Mr. Knightley, I am going to do so-and-so; papa says I may,' or 'I have Miss Taylor's leave'__something which, you knew, I did not approve.  In such cases my interference was giving you two bad feelings instead of one.  

"What an amiable creature I was!  No wonder you should hold my speeches in such affectionate remembrance."  
"'Mr. Knightley,' you always called me.  'Mr. Knightley'; and, from habit, it has not so very formal a sound.  And yet it is formal.  I want you to call me something else, but I do not know what."  "I remember once calling you 'George,' in one of my amiable fits, about ten years ago.  I did it because I thought it would offend you; but, as you made no objection, I never did it again."  "And cannot you call me 'George' now?"  "Impossible!  I never can call you anything but 'Mr. Knightley.'  I will not promise even to equal the elegant terseness of Mrs. Elton, by calling you Mr. K. but I will promise,"  she added presently, laughing and blushing, "I will promise to call you by your Christian name.  I do not say when, but perhaps you may guess where__ in the building in which N. takes M. for better, for worse."

Oh, how this made me so very happy!  The two of them acknowledging their banter throughout the years, doing so to irritate the other, with affection attached.  Austen in her true form!

[Halcyon]

Bellamarie  in the building in which N. takes M. for better, for worse."

Who are N. and M.?

[JoanK]

One thing you can say for Frank: he is about the only person in the story with a sense of humor and fun. the story needs that to lighten it up.

But his fun is a mean fun: Emma catches it, in her mean remark about Miss Bates. But she feels real remorse, which Frank may not.

I worry for Jane in the marriage: I've seen husbands who do that kind of mean teasing of their wives in public situations where it's difficult for the wives to answer back. But the fact that Jane was willing to break it off, in spite of the fact it doomed her to a governess job, and answer him back at the picnic gives me hope for her not allowing that kind of mistreatment from him in the future.

[JoanK]

The second shock: when Harriet reveals that it's Mr. Knightley she now loves, and has reason to believe that he cares for her.

This is the pivotal moment of the book. Emma has an epiphany: she really is able to examine her heart for the first time. She realizes that she loves Mr. Knightley, but much more than that. When she sees the possible consequences of what she has done to Harriet, she not only laments what it will mean to her, she sees all the flaws of arrogance in what she has been doing.

Austen's novels are about who marries whom. But they are also primarily about character, as many of her titles show. "Pride and Prejudice". "Sense and Sensibility" (we would probably say logic versus emotion), Persuasion" (about how open we should be to being persuaded by others). Her heroines all have character flaws which they have to overcome before they can be happy. They must undergo trials until they have this realization.

This, in itself, was a radical innovation. The ideal at the time was that the heroine be perfect.

Austen did not come up with a one word title to describe Emma's flaw in the title. If you had to, what would it be?

[Halcyon]

JoanK asked:
Austen did not come up with a one word title to describe Emma's flaw in the title. If you had to, what would it be?

Youth
Indulged

I don't really see these as flaws though.  I think Emma is willing to take responsibility for her part in wrongdoings.

[BarbStAubrey]

To me a title could have been 'The Blossoming of Emma"

[Jonathan]

'Who are N. and M.?' Halcyon asks. Wouldn't they be the man and woman who are exchanging vows in the marriage chapel?

Another exceptional quote from Chapter 53, Bellamarie. Will Emma never learn?

'She had been decided in wishing for a Miss Weston.  She would not acknowledge that it was with any view of making a match for her, hereafter....'

It's still the first thing that comes to her mind, despite her dubious experience with matchmaking. Except for her matchmaking she might never have married Mr. Knightley. She was not going to lose him. Does anyone marry for love in the book? Except Harriet and Frank Churchill. Frank is the most difficult character to understand. Waiting for Mrs. Churchill to die before making his move. Alas.

Wishing for a girl reveals another significant thing about Emma. Her devotion to her father and her duty to be a comfort to him. Never will she marry Mr. Knightley unless he comes to live at Hartfield House.  We've come full circle. In the beginning it was Mr. Woodhouse, Emma, and Mr. Knightley at the Hartfield hearth, and so it is in the end.

I've been so busy the last few days. Today I went for my Driver's test, compulsory at 80, and every two years thereafter. It includes a vision assessment, a review of driving rules, and something they call cognitive testing. What, the examiner wanted to know, do we do to stay mentally alert? What an opportunity for me. Read Jane Austen, I told them. A dandy discussion followed as each announced their favorite Austen novel. We all passed the test.

I believe Mr. Knightley married because it was expected of him, after reading Pride And Predjudice.

[bellamarie]

If I were to write a title for the book, instead of Emma, using Austen's style, it would be:

Pompous and Pampered

I see more than one character being pompous, and pampered throughout the book, but Emma, the protagonist, is of course pampered by her father and Miss Taylor,  and Mrs. Elton was surely pompous.  

Oh Jonathan I have to respectfully disagree with you.  The love between Emma and Mr. Knightley is overwhelming.  He admits he began falling in love with Emma when she was thirteen.  She with her banter, was too unaware of love to know she has been in love with him for possibly ever.  When Mrs. Weston suggested Jane and Mr. Knightley may be a match, and also when Harriet confessed to having feelings for Mr. Knightley, Emma's reactions was nothing but a woman in love.

Her matchmaking is over, it was a mere sentiment of wanting Mrs. Weston's precious baby girl to have the best possible when she grows up.  Austen was bringing this back to us, so it would bring about the cute comments of Mr. Knightley being there as well, for sweet Anna Weston, as he was for her, but not fall in love with her at thirteen.  It was a sweet, and loving part in the book.

As for Emma never marrying Mr. Knightley if they would have to leave Hartfield and her father...yet one more loving tribute to the loyal daughter she is, and hopes for Mr. Weston to have with his dear daughter.  Mr. Knightley loves this quality in Emma.  He loves Mr. Wood house as well, and would never consider separating them, or himself from Mr. Woodhouse.  This is undying, true love.....not expectation.  

I fear you have been taken in by the harsh, unkind remarks Mrs. Elton shares of her opinion of the marriage.  

Mr. Knightley's heart belonged to Emma for years, and I suspect he would have waited a lifetime for her, or never married at all if he could not have her.  It's true Austen form, the two end up together out of love.

[bellamarie]

Halcyon, the M and N stand for:


An allusion in Emma which is not a charade or a riddle

In the passage from Emma in which Emma Woodhouse promises to call Mr. Knightley by his first name "in the building in which N. takes M." for her wedded husband "for better, for worse", Jane Austen is directly quoting from the "Form of Solemnization of Matrimony" (i.e. wedding ceremony) from the Church of England Book of Common Prayer.

In this prayer book, when a person's name is to be said as part of a ceremony (such as baptism, etc.), then the place where the person's name should be said is generally indicated by the letter "N.", which stands for Latin nomen "name" (insofar as it stands for anything at all).

In the earlier versions of the prayerbook, this "N." occurred wherever either the man's name or the woman's name was to be spoken as part of the wedding ceremony. In most later editions of the prayerbook, in order to prevent any possible confusion as to where the man's name was to be spoken, and where the woman's name, two different letters have been used -- "M." was introduced to mark places where the man's name should be said, while "N." was left to mark places where the woman's name should be said. The differentiation was probably done in this way merely because the man's name is usually said before the woman's name in the ceremony, and "M." comes before "N." in the alphabet; as far as I'm aware, there is no deeper significance to the particular choice of letters for the man's and woman's names, and the letter "M." doesn't seem to abbreviate anything (in the way that "N." can be said to abbreviate nomen). (One ingenious suggestion, that "M." and "N." were intended to stand for Latin maritus "husband" and nupta "bride", must remain rather doubtful.)

Remember that "M." and "N." are never actually part of the ceremony as such (never spoken aloud), but are merely convenient little written markers to help tell the minister what he should say as part of the ceremony.

[JoanK]

JONATHAN: "What, the examiner wanted to know, do we do to stay mentally alert? What an opportunity for me. Read Jane Austen, I told them."

How absolutely wonderful!!!!

BELLAMARIE: fancy your knowing that! I skated right over that reference.

Emma's fault that hits us in the face is her snobbishness about class. This too is gentled by the end of the book, as she is willing to have the Martins to Highbury.

There is a message in the book that people need to "know their place". This is probably Austen, not Emma. Remember, this was part of the taken for granted of her class at the time, and part of their defense against a changing world. Just as in America it was taken for granted by whites that people of color were inferior.

[JoanK]

I like the names. Now, for your thought: how did Austen manage to lead us down the garden path again and again (well, some of us, anyway. I was clueless, the first time I read the book). Even after the surprise of Mr. Elton, , like Emma, kept misunderstanding the situation.

[Halcyon]

Bellamarie, Thank you for the prayer book information.

JoanK,  You mentioned snobbishness as being part of the cultue of the time. What does everyone think about Mr. Knightley being snobby?  More, less or the same as Emma?

[JoanK]

Good question!

[bellamarie]

JoanK.,

There is a message in the book that people need to "know their place".

If this is so, then why did Emma want Harriet to marry above her suspected illegitimate birth?  

I did not see Emma as a snob, she was intuitive to Jane being reserved, and rightfully so, and she could clearly see Mrs. Elton was a social climber, and did not want to be close to her. Emma befriended Harriet, who was certainly under the expected class.  

I did not feel Mr. Knightley was a snob either, he went out of his way to talk to Harriet, and Mr. Martin.  He also talked with his servants and respected them, especially his housemaid, who he told Mrs. Elton would be upset, should he allow any other to help with his alfresco party.

Mrs. Elton was surely a snob.

Wondering about themes and messages, as JoanK.mentioned, I did a bit of a search, and I happened to come across these couple of sites, and thought them interesting.  So glad I did not read them before finishing the book.  

http://www.sparknotes.com/lit/emma/themes.html

http://www.cliffsnotes.com/literature/e/emma/critical-essays/theme-of-emma

[PatH]

So glad I did not read them before finishing the book.

Yes, that would have spoiled the fun.

Those are good notes, especially the Spark Notes.  One of their themes, "the confined nature of women's existence", has always struck me strongly in this book.  The notes speak of the "almost claustrophobic" scope of action, and I've always felt it to be somewhat oppressive.  Emma is rich and privileged, but she is playing out her life in the small area close enough to walk, amid a very small cast of characters--nothing wrong with most of them, but by now there can't be any surprises.  JoanK calls Emma a people person, and she certainly has to work pretty hard to find people to keep her interested.

[bellamarie]

I was reading about Jane Austen's life growing up when I was searching sites yesterday, and she was 39 years old when she wrote the book of Emma.  There were some interesting similarities she used from her true life, to the storied life of Emma.  In reading this, it shows how Jane uses much of her life in all the books she wrote.

http://www.pemberley.com/janeinfo/janelife.html

Just to mention a few from Emma:

Jane's father's name was George....Mr. Knightley's first name is George
Jane's niece's name was Anna........Mrs. Weston's baby girl's name is Anna
Isabella and her family go to the seaside each summer.....The Austen family also went to the seaside each summer.
Jane read a lot......Emma read a lot.
Jane's father was a Reverend.........Mr. Elton is a Reverend
Jane had one sister........Emma has one sister
Jane's family had a fairly respectable income.....The Woodhouse's have a fairly respectable income.
Jane went to the Abbey school....it is mentioned it was much like Mrs. Goddard's school.
Jane did a lot of reading with a library of 500 books.....Emma reads a lot and Mr. Woodhouse has a large library.
Jane's favorite brother's name was Henry.....Emma's nephew is named Henry
Jane's brother's name was Frank......In Emma we have Frank Churchill
 
The list goes on and on, but what I really thought a gem to come across is this:

There is a famous statement by one Mrs. Mitford that Jane was the "the prettiest, silliest, most affected, husband-hunting butterfly she ever remembers" (however, Mrs. Mitford seems to have had a personal jealousy against Jane Austen, and it is hard to reconcile this description with the Jane Austen who wrote The Three Sisters before she was eighteen).

Now I ask, could Mrs Mitford, indeed be our dear character, Mrs. Elton???   

Oh the fun you can have with so much information.

PatH.,

The notes speak of the "almost claustrophobic" scope of action, and I've always felt it to be somewhat oppressive.  Emma is rich and privileged, but she is playing out her life in the small area close enough to walk, amid a very small cast of characters.

I got the sense from reading about Jane's life, she too lived close to the circle of comfort, as I see Emma does, and most of Jane's protagonists in her books, also seem to live like this.  

Was it Elizabeth Bennett's sister Lydia, in Pride and Prejudice, who dared to run off with her boyfriend to elope, that is the only character Jane deviated from closely living like herself?

Rachel Trickett remarks that "Jane Austen's fools are to be delighted in, not detested"[9], a statement which perfectly applies to the figure of Lydia Bennet, the fool of the elopement-episode. Naively, she falls prey to Wickham, thus bringing shame over all of her family, although she does not do it on purpose. Her restricted point of view does not allow her to see the full consequences of her action. On her wedding-day she returns to Longbourn, prattling on like ever before, never even noticing that she is touching on weak spots in the circle of her family:

One more thing Jane does in most of her books, is have at least one character, who just rattles on, and on, and on. I sense it is to be comical, yet annoying.

Here is a most interesting read on the take of Jane's writings.
http://www.grin.com/en/e-book/60194/lydia-s-elopement-and-its-functions-in-jane-austen-s-pride-and-prejudice

PatH.,  One thing I have taught myself, is to not even read reviews, or interviews, that authors have done before I read a book.  I absolutely love the fun in not knowing, and being shocked or surprised as I come to these parts in the books.  My college granddaughter who has the love of reading like myself, was over just yesterday and we were talking about how it's so much fun not knowing.  We both said we hate spoilers!  She just finished a book about a teacher who is single, and of course I can't remember the name to save me.  I so want to read the book.  But I ask, is it possibly the one we are planning to read in July?  If so I need to hold off.

[Jonathan]

Spoilers don't work with Jane Austen. If knowing how it ends, spoils the fun, one isn't reading Jane Austen.

I like better  what's said in Bellamarie's 'Oh the fun you can have with so much information.' And with disagreements it's twice the fun. My way of seeing it, doesn't make your way wrong for me. I like your way of seeing it just as much as my own. For example: you say that Mrs Elton is a social climber. But I wonder: would a social climber marry the vicar of Highbury? What's to climb? Perhaps finding a governess for Mrs Smallridge gives her another step up in some other circle. On the other hand, Jane Fairfax must see the prospect as confining. For her marriage would seem like freedom.

Must it end? This discussion has been delightful. Thanks, Joan. Thanks to all of you. What alternate, short title would I suggest for this Austen book? I would like to suggest VERVE AND VEXATION. These two traits strike me most about Emma. Both highlighted at the Box Hill picnic in Ch 43 (III,7)

'She was vexed beyond what could have been expressed - almost beyond what she could conceal. Never had she felt so agitated, mortified, grieved, at any circumstance in her life. She was most forcibly struck.

For the 'verve',  I didn't have to look for more than Frank Churchill's announcement at the picnic:

'Ladies and gentlemen, I am ordered by Miss Woodhouse (who, wherever she is, presides,) to say, that she desires to know what you are all thinking of.'

It takes verve to run the show in Highbury. And Emma pays for it.

[JoanK]

I like that name, JONATHAN! But don't say goodbye quite yet. Now that we know the plot, there's still lots to discuss.

BELLAMARIE: thanks for the Spark notes. They suggest four themes for the book:

. Marriage and social status

. The confined nature of women's existence

. The blinding power of imagination and

. The obstacles to open expression

PatH says it is the confined nature of women's existence that struck her the most. How about you? Which, if any, of these themes struck you as you read the book?

[JoanK]

Meanwhile, who knew? here is Emma, the movie! I haven't seen this one, but look forward to it!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4SjTZdp298

[PatH]

JoanK, you really know how to mess up my evening.  Instead of catching up on my paperwork, I've got almost 2 hours of Emma to watch.  I've looked at a few minutes of it, and it looks very promising.

[Halcyon]

JoanK. I just watched the movie. Delightful. I realized that Frank went to London to order the piano for Jane. Perhaps everyone knew this except me. Thank you for the link.

[bellamarie]

Thank you JoanK., for the link. Oh boy!  I am so excited to have this movie to watch. Halycon and PatH., good to hear I won't be disappointed watching Emma. I have never seen any of Austen's book made into movies yet.  One more first for me from this book club.

Jonathan, I so agree with you.  What fun would any discussion group be if we all saw things the same and felt the same.  I looked forward to each and every post, so I could have a different perspective other than my own.  I love how we all see characters differently, it says a lot about who we ourselves are as people.  I think it gives an insight, to our own strengths and flaws, and how we deal with them.  I am big on forgiveness, when someone shows me they are aware of doing wrong, so of course I was easy on Emma.  In every book you need a Mrs. Elton.

JoanK.,  I like the blinding power of imagination! 

I am a writer, without my imagination, blinding, and a bit wild at times, I would not be able to conjure up the great ideas for books I plan to write, now that I am officially retired as of Holy Thursday, when I closed the door to my last day care child.  It was bittersweet, and my kids and grandkids treated me to a night out at Cinco De Mayo's, to help me end my night.  That one margarita kicked my behind!

[BarbStAubrey]

ah so many of the characters are as I would picture them in your link to Emma, the movie, Joan K except Knightly. To me this actor is too put together in that I see Knightly as mature but with a vulnerable or empty core that he fills with making sure everyone is doing the 'right' thing where this Knightly looks to me as if he could care less however, he knows his place in society and as lord of his manor. Not a snob but certainly not lacking - a very self contained gentleman of means.

[JoanK]

I haven't had a chance to watch the movie yet. Going to try now.

BELLAMARIE: how exciting! I hope you enjoy retirement as much as I have. I'll look for your books in the future.

I wonder if it was imagination that blinded Emma so much as desire. She wanted things to be a certain way, so she saw them that way and ignored clues to the contrary. I can think of a time when I did that.

On the theme of marriage and social class: the Sparks note points out that "marrying up" was the only way a woman could improve her position in society. And that is what Emma wants for Harriet. But the message of the book seems to be that such marriages can be disastrous, as Mr. Weston's first marriage to a woman above him in status was and Mr. Elton's attempt to marry Emma. 

[JoanK]

Finished watching the movie, and quite liked it. I liked the dance at the end with the six character going round and round each other: a synopsis of the book.

Of course, I always like the book better. Even a great actor can't make you see into a person the way great writing can.

[bellamarie]

I hope to get a chance to watch the movie today once all the kids go home after our egg hunt and dinner.  I always love the books better, no movie producer can take the place of the original writer's work.  IMO

I remember reading the book, The Help, I finished it late at night, and myself and a couple of my girlfriends went to see the movie the next day.  I was so upset, how they left out so many of the vital parts of the book.  For me I saw in the book issues with race, abuse, and social injustice, with  only slight humor.  The movie missed these themes so badly, and seemed to take scenes from the book that were not humorous, and made them so in the movie.  I sat through the entire movie telling my friends how they destroyed the book.

It's way late for me to be up, I just got home from Easter Vigil Mass, where my daughter in law was initiated into the Catholic faith.  The Mass was 3 hours long, 8:30 p.m. til 11:30 p.m., a little sweet and spirits were served afterwards, and we got home at 12:30 a.m.  Now, I must go to bed to meet everyone at Mass at 11:00 a.m.

Thank you JoanK.,  I think I am going to really enjoy being retired.

[bellamarie]

Good night!

[PatH]

A gorgeous day--sunny, and going to be warm--perfect for this joyous celebration.

Happy Easter to all.

[PatH]

Talk about perfect timing--this book review was in this morning's Washington Post.  The Austen Project has been getting good modern writers to rewrite all of Austen's books in modern settings.  Emma has just come out--rewritten by Alexander McCall Smith.  The reviewer liked it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/books/a-modern-retelling-of-emma-by-alexander-mccall-smith/2015/03/30/96a0b370-cf49-11e4-a2a7-9517a3a70506_story.html

I placed a hold on it at my library.  It's still on order, and I'm 65th in line.

[JoanK]

Gotta have it!

One more point: how does Austen so effectively lead us down the garden path? According to John Mullan in "What Matters in Jane Austen", it's by pioneering the use of "free indirect style." This mean telling the story from the point of view of the character without using the first person. That way, we forget that the author is telling us what Emma THINKS is happening, rather than what IS happening. He says "So confident did she feel about her control of the technique that she made her plot depend on it."

Here is the example he gives. Emma believes, falsely, that Harriet is in love with Frank Churchill. When Emma tells Harriet of the death of Mrs. Churchill (freeing Frank to marry), we have "Harriet behaved extremely well on the occasion, with great self command. Whatever she might feel of brighter hope, she betrayed nothing. Emma was gratified to observe such proof in her of strengthened character."

How subtle. We now know that Harriet had no such feelings at all. But Austen has managed to make us believe she does, while being strictly honest. "Whatever she might feel", not she DID feel. Austen even reminds us these are Emma's belief: "Emma was gratified to observe such proof of strengthened character." We are observing Emma seeing exactly what she wrongheadedly wants to believe, but think we are observing what Harriet is doing.

Austen would have made a great lawyer!

[bellamarie]

PatH., what a great find!  After reading the article I must say, I'm not so sure I would like a modern day Emma, after knowing Austen's Emma of her era.  The excitement for me in reading Austen, is the very fact these stories take place in a time and place I have never lived in.  I love reading and imagining these fictitional characters, in the clothing and homes, with the restrictions of their time.  Today's time, is an everything goes.  One other reason I don't think I would be happy with this modern day Emma, is it is written by a man, so we are getting a male's point of view.  For me, only a woman can know and portray another woman's feelings.  Jane writes through her own life experiences, this new modern day male writer, has no familiarity of living the life of our eighteenth century Emma. 

The whole purpose for me loving Jane Austen, is because of all the special feelings ONLY she can bring to her readers.  I'm not ready to accept Austen's beautiful writing made into a desperate housewife type of story.  Some things are better left alone.  There is only one Jane Austen, and it's because of who she was, that her protagonists in her stories are who they are.

[Jonathan]

'...pioneering the use of "free indirect style." This means telling the story from the point of view of the character without using the first person.'

So that's what it's called. Thanks, Joan, I thought there was something unique about the narrative style. Who is telling this story, I wondered, the author or the character herself? In places it gets entertaining, when, after getting Emma's 'account', the author steps in and reminds the reader of it, adding her own objective version. A spinoff is that all the other characters live and act in Emma's shadow. Given her pride and predjudices she can mislead the reader as well as she misled Harriet. But, what a wonderful way of getting to know Emma.

I will certainly look for a 'freee indirect style' in the Alexander McCall Smith book. I'm not too optimistic about finding it, even anything in the 'grand' style of Jane Austen.

I found the movie very entertaining. Just as I had imagined the characters, except for Mrs Elton. She suffers badly in Emma's view. But, as the author tells us, others in Highbury liked her.

But let's continue reading. Why does Emma marry Mr. Knightley? And the others, too, for that matter. I was surprised at how little love there was in all the matchmaking.

[BarbStAubrey]

Just uncovering the restrictions is an adventure and then to see how folks expressed their lives within those restrictions is amazing - I can barely feel the restrictions any longer that were so many that were simply a part of life like waking up when I was young before WWII to even have a good feel for the restrictions on both men and women 200 years ago.

I notice today when dancers attempt to express the jitterbug and other dances of the 1940s they do it with a different kind of freedom expressed in their body movements rather than the restrictions that were so inborn so that especially girls were showing more body freedom but there was a reserve, especially how the upper arms stayed rather close to the body, that I wonder if it can even be copied without having an inner compass to the mindset that shows up in the body.

To adapt this story - I can see the highlights of the story line but in today's freer society it will be a different story. To begin with unless you are limiting the setting to an office, no one lives their life within a village setting so the concept of containment would have to be manipulated. But who knows - the author may see things in society today that are not as obvious to us so that the story could have relevance.

whoops writing at the same time Jonathan - Yes, so many stories before mid nineteenth century are about folks marrying as if closing on a homestead - within the past couple of years I remember reading a story by Jhumpa Lahiri, Pulitzer Prize winner, that featured parents of a young collage age man and the mom was explaining to him their relationship of deep love that grew however, they were matched by family back in India and married there only having seen each other briefly before the ceremony and never alone. I am guessing the lucky ones in history were able to have what we value in a marriage today. I'm thinking they had one thing in their favor - the field was narrow so they might just as well make it into the most beautiful garden they could unless, the guy had the energy and fly by skills of the proverbial honey bee. Now a woman/girl, married or single got a red letter for her dalliances unless she had the power that came with money and knew of a few private nooks - hmm I wonder if that is how the old phrase nooky came about? 

[bellamarie]

I just finished watching the movie, and I am simply amazed at how the actors captured the true personalities of Austen's characters.  A superb job! 

I did notice in the very beginning of the book, the narrative was being told by someone other than Emma, and I remember pausing in wondering who it was.  Of course, it had to be none other than Jane herself.  I got so engrossed in Emma's character in the book, I lost sight of the fact it was not Emma herself, telling the story. 

No, I can't see anyone ever capturing the true characters in a modern day writing.   Austen is a classic, to be appreciated for her time.

Jonathan,

Why does Emma marry Mr. Knightley? And the others, too, for that matter. I was surprised at how little love there was in all the matchmaking.

There is no doubt in my mind why Emma marries Mr. Knightley, Austen and the movie producers made it plain and simple, it was because she, and he loved each other.  And, no, this is not my imagination. 

Poor Harriet, she marries because it is of convenience, it seems obvious, because she went from wanting to accept Mr. Martin, to easily being persuaded to want Mr. Elton, then to have feelings for Mr. Knightley because he shows her kindness, then back to Mr. Martin, since Mr. Knightley convinced him to try again.

Mr. and Mrs. Elton seem to have married for status and position.  Although she does use the endearment cara sposa, so perhaps she does love him.

As for Mr. and Mrs. Weston and Frank Churchill and Jane Fairfax, it is love, and possibly for the women, the good fortune, to keep them from being a governess the rest of their lives.   

[JoanK]

BELLAMARIE: "There is only one Jane Austen, and it's because of who she was, that her protagonists in her stories are who they are."

I agree. The books I have read in the Austen project (modern rewriting) have been uniformly disappointing, and I expect McCall Smiths to be so too.

If you haven't read all of Austen's books yet, I envy you. Happy reading. "Pride and Prejudice" is the most popular, and many think the best. "Sense and Sensibility" and "Persuasion" are right up there with it. "Mansfield Park and "Northanger Abbey" drop down just a bit IMO. "Lady Susan" is an early novella, worth reading. When Austen died, she left a fragment of a book, "The Watsons". Several have tried to finish it, but poorly. I'd say not worth reading unless you're desperate for Austen.

Some of her letters are also available -- her sister, Cassandra, burned many of them. I'm guessing because of her frankness and sharp tongue.

We Austen nuts have read everything she wrote, and want more, more! We're the ones who gobble up the Austen imitators, even when they aren't very good.There are a whole library of them out there. One tells the story of Emma from  Jane Fairfax's point of view. It's "Jane Fairfax" by Joan Aiken, and is a pretty good job.. Another that I enjoy (mystery lover that I am) is a mystery series by Stephanie Barron with Austen as the detective. It's based closely on Austen's letters, and is a good way to learn about her life. There are others that pick up characters that Austen left unmarried (like Darcy's younger sister from Pride and Prejudice") and give them a romance.

The only modern version that I would recommend is "Bridget Jones' Diary" which is based on "Pride and Prejudice", but is fun in it's own right. (The sequel is based on "Persuasion"). But she doesn't try to make her heroine like an Austen heroine: she is very today. For the movie, Colin Firth, who played Darcy in P&P played mark Darcy in Bridget Jones.

[PatH]

I don't think Harriet married for convenience, even though from a practical standpoint Mr. Martin is a good catch for her.  She is warmly affectionate, and easily thinks she is in love, but she has obviously had strong feelings for Mr. Martin from the start, and had lingering regrets in turning him down. 

I'm too lazy to try to find it, but someone says somewhere that Harriet will be safe with Martin.  This is true.  She's rather gullible, and could easily fall for someone who wouldn't treat her right.  Now she will be protected, surrounded by people who care for her--Martin's sisters as well as himself.  and in a situation she has already learned to like from her stay in the previous summer.

[PatH]

JoanK, I was writing while you were posting.  I agree with your assessment of the Austen followups, though I haven't read as many as you.  The Stephanie Barron mysteries are good if you like mystery stories.  In the first one, Barron does too much of putting in bits that an austen nut realizes are lifted from the books, but she stopped that.  They should be read in order.

Death Comes to Pemberley is P. D. James' follow-up to Pride and Prejudice.  She doesn't catch the tone properly, but it's pretty good, and it's fun to see her take on the later life of the characters.

[JoanK]

Here is the list of Stephanie Barron Jane Austen mysteries. The first in the series is "Jane and the Unpleasantness at Seagrove Manor." They could be read in any order, but they follow her life chronologically.

http://www.fantasticfiction.co.uk/b/stephanie-barron/

They are good, but don't really capture her sense of humor (no one is able to do THAT!)

There is also another detective series with Elizabeth and Darcy from Pride and Prejudice as the detectives: I don't remember the author, but they aren't very good.

[bellamarie]

Thank you JoanK., and PatH., for your opinions on those who have attempted to write beyond Austen, with her characters.  I will be giving Stephanie Barron's series a look at.  The OCD in me will have to begin with the very first one, and read them in order.

[BarbStAubrey]

All the additional books that include characters similar to the Jane Austen characters remind me of as kids when a particular good book was read we wanted more and felt bereft when it was over so that we often asked our parent to read it again - I am thinking nothing really satisfies like the reading of the original although other authors may offer us a smile as we recognize their characters having some of the same idiosyncrasies as the Jane Austen characters.

An entire month and I have each time had to have an inner dialogue saying something like - no it is not Austin - it is Austen - I wonder if they say it differently and it sure is not after Saint Augustine as Austin, so I wonder who or what is the background on the name Austen.