Well today is our first day of discussion of Agatha Christie's Hallowe'en Party and I'm interested to know who's with us here?

I was very surprised at this book. It seems every book we read we compare to Christie, and I'm going to be interested to know your opinion.

At the outset, let me ask if YOU managed to guess who the murderer was and HOW did you figure it out?

I know Christie puts nothing in her books by chance, nevertheless I missed it completely, she's clever, she really is. I never guessed until it was revealed. How about you?

Ginny

Well, I think I should have stayed away from this folder! <LOL> I haven't finished Hallowe'en Party yet! Now I know whodunit! Oh well--I'm over half way through so I'll keep coming. I'll try to finish it tonight...

For the record, I have read every book Dame Agatha ever wrote, including two [or was it three] that aren't mysteries, and the autobiographies. Remembering them all is another matter! Been a few years... Most memorable right off the top were The Murder of Roger Ackroyd and Ten Little Indians, however my favorites were those with Miss Marple as the "detective".

Unfortunately, our library system doesn't have Agatha Christie's Hallowe'en Party so I can't join in this one, either. Oh well, I did find a Hallowe'en mystery - Trick or Treat Murder by Leslie Meier. Looks to be a good one, but definitely not Christie!

Hi, All, this is nice to see, sorry about revealing the end, Jackie. Thanks for the title of the other Halloween mystery, Jeanne, we can try that one next year.

Mary!! Welcome, welcome, looks like it'll be you and me until our Joan G and Jeryn get caught up.

Now, I had forgotten about the four words, what can they have been? Why doesn't Christie tell us? Is this fair? I don't really understand the four words at all. Who sent them, I already forget!

I, too, have read every one of Christie's works, but it was so long ago, so long, about...well, I hesitate to say how long, but have totally forgotten most of them. Also saw her play in London. Very interesting Playbill, by the way, about Christie herself and the other productions of the play.

I was very surprised at several things in the book, not hte least of which was the almost entire reliance on dialogue to carry the plot. I found it quite different from our modern mysteries in many ways and I hope we can look at some of those. Found I was quite caught up in the ending, didn't want to put it down.

I can't understand people who always guess the murderer. I found myself thinking it was the Curate and looking HARD for any askance mention of a name, so she really fooled me.

I, thought the man with the beard was confusing, and am still confused. Why beard? What did I miss here? Did you think she pulled the surprise ending off about who really SAW the murder?

I didn't think Poirot was well fleshed out in this tale, if I hadn't read other books with his character, I'm not sure I'd have connected here.

I did love her little asides about how a writer goes about selecting a character and her responses to people who say, O now you're going to put ME in the book. I'm reading another...the last, I believe, James Heriott, and I'm told everyone used to come up to him and day, O I recognized myself, when it wasn't them at all.

I think authors are intimidating in that way, their minds are so fertile, we hesitate to speak a word lest we get pilloried by their pen. We'll soon see, we've got a real live author, Bernard Lefkowitz, corresponding in the Our Guys discussion, and we'll see how tongue tied we get there.

So what was your opinion of the characters in this book? Believable or not?

Ginny

When Ginny picked the Halloween Party for the discussion this month, I went kicking and screaming to the book store to make my purchase. I made a sight I must say. Bought the book and let it lay till almost the 15th, said O.K. Dame Agatha here we go.

Surprise! I loved this book! I loved the story and the people therein. In my minds eye I could see David Suchet as the dapper and at his most charming, Poirot. Of course Mrs. Oliver was Dame Agatha herself. I saw more humor in this book. Maybe because dedicated it to P.G. Wodehouse. I also thought this was a more American style of writing. As in the sentence on page 66, " I can't stick my neck out and diagnose a murderer without some evidence." Or on page 22, " I should think rather mature, perhaps. Lumpy."

The red apples were everywhere. Do you think the big red apples could have been her red herrings?

Yes Dame Agatha was and is a consummate story teller.

Bunny! WHY "kicking and screaming?" hahahahaha

You've raised some great points. I should have but didn't think of Mrs. Oliver as Agatha Christie. Yet there were plenty of clues as to what it's like to be a mystery writer sprinkled around.

And David Suchet, yes, he's really good. I thought also there were some little surprises in this book: people didn't always agree with the master detective! His feet hurt but he wouldn't change shoes. He was vain about his moustashes.

And the dedication to PGWodehouse,too, had overlooked that. But the apples, which seemed to play such a prominent part in this, were kinda non effective, didn't you think? Maybe they were the red herrings, certainly nothing came of them.

You know what I liked almost as an aside to this? The ennumeration of the old party games. "Snapdragon," had you all ever heard of it? It's no wonder it has faded out, but wasn't it interesting? How about the other games on page 75, have you ever heard of them? Sounds like a lot of pretty harmless fun except for the Snapdragon.

What about Poirot's repeating the saying "Old sins cast long shadows?"

What old sins? Is this another red herring?

This is the first book in a very very long while that I wished I'd kept a list of cast of characters. I notice that although Christie usually does include such a list, she didn't this time.

I also agree with Mary , it's kinda hard to know if you've read them all as the titles are so different in England and in America.

I've answered my own questin on page 171 when Poirot himself writes the four words. What can the other three be? Why didn't Christie tell us?

Ginny

I was also picturing David Suchet and didn't even notice that Poirot wasn't fleshed out in this story.

I was surprised at who had seen the murder. Although I shouldn't have been. There were plenty of clues.

I think the old sins were the original murder and maybe the old affair of two of the characters.

Is it my imagination or do most of Christie's villians die for one reason or another at the end of the book?

I can't figure out the four words and now I'm not even sure "water" was one of them.

Oh, Mary, wonderful points, my goodness, you are a close reader!

Yes, I'm thiking water was one of the words, but I'm not sure the others were mentioned and I wonder if we think that's fair and if a modern author would have told us the words?

You are right, too, in that Poirot is NOT fleshed out, I noticed that but kept thinking Suchet, just as you said. It's amazing what seeing a television production can do to one's imagination. I've always liked illustrations, lots of photos and pictures, but not in a work of fiction or mystery. I want to imagine the characters as I see them, and not as somebody else may have seen them.

Lots of times even the covers of a book are a disappointment.

What a marvelous question, too, DO all Christie's villains die at the end of her books? For that matter, what's the percentage of them living in the modern day mysteries? How about the ones we've just read, she said, scratching her head for the memory?

Ginny

I just started the book...had to wait on it's arrival from Barnes and Noble (via seniornet) so have tried to just skim over the earlier posts until I am finished.

I was fascinated by the term 'vegetable marrow' for pumpkin and the lighting afire of the raisins!

Nettie!! I'm so glad to see you back! I've been thinking about Mary's question all day and find I can't REMEMBER half of the mystery endings I've read of Christie's.

How about Ten Little Indians ? Did the villain die at the end? I want to say yes, but am not sure.

I know Christie didn't believe in allowing evil to triumph and set her stories that way for a purpose. I think I even read the Miss Marple stories were written with that in mind.

Ginny

I could be entirely wrong about the murderer always dying at the end. It's been a long time since I read any of Christie's books, but I remember thinking that years ago. Is there anyone around who has read several of her books recently?

Mary

I want to give credit to Ms. Christie for one big thing, big to me--she never resorted to gratuitous violence nor grisly description to enhance her plots. She didn't NEED to! We read them eagerly WITHOUT such ploys!

I'm presently reading Patricia Cornwell's latest in which there is more of this grim detail than usual. I LIKE her books; have read them all and hate to see her resorting to this kind of thing. WHY are modern authors DOING this so much? Are there people out there who LIKE it? Is it part of the trend we see in movies and on TV? Is our society as a whole getting hardened to this kind of thing? Am I getting old? [Well, yes, but...] <Laughing thru' my tears!>

Jeryn, that's another good point about the contrast between the older authors and the authors of today: all the violence and descriptive scenes, sex and just about anything else you don't need to read about.

Even The Ballad of Frankie Silver has a long long gruesome passage on the process of electrocution. Who needs it? I wonder if the authors think we are so devoid of imagination that we need it spelled out?

Notice how clever Christie is in her characterizations. WE have to flesh them out pretty much by ourselves. Actually, this book, I thought, was not quite one of her best? The characters a bit sketchy? There wasn't really ONE this time that I really felt, well, that I was. Was there one you identified with? Usually I'm right there IN the book with her, but not this time. Still it was a clever puzzle, as all hers are, and pretty hard to put down at the end. Yet I never knew who "done it" till it was revealed.

Am not sure about the symbolism of the apples? Adam and Eve? Or???????

Ginny

Apples and hats are always associated with Ariadne Oliver in any of the books she appears in.

Jeanne, do you know why ? I mean, does there seem to be a reason which was explained in an earlier book?

You'd never know I ever read one of Christie's books, it seems except for a few, I can read them over and over. I guess I like the way the writes.

Understand she was fond of talking to herself, too, acting out all the parts, speaking the dialogue. She wrote something funny about it once.

Her grandson has certainly lived royally off her trust, how nice. Someday, maybe this summer, I hope to get to see the museum in Dover which has her typewriter, etc.

Ginny

I enjoyed 'Hallowe'en Party!

As mentioned, I also appreciate the lack of graphic violence in her stories.

I felt when we first met Miranda that she knew something, I kept wanting Poirot to go back and talk with her.

I found both Poirot and Ariadne Oliver comical!

I'm frustrated too about the other 3 words...

Hi everyone, I've been coming everyday to the discussion and learning all sorts of things. Most, is you all refer to Suchet as Poirot. Isn't it funny, Peter Ustinov and Albert Finney played the role of Poirot to a fair thee well but no one has been as strong as Suchet so the question is, does the role fit the man or the man fit the role. The three words? Red herring here? I think thats why people get angrey with Christie she hints at something but never really tells you the whole. Ten Little Indians the killer drank poison. Then in Death on the Nile the killers, one killed the other then kill herself. Evil Under the Sun they went to Jail. So I guess when you write so many books you look to an end that fits. Above all crime will not be rewarded. I,like most most of you, are pleased with less graphic violence and language. I am getting a bit tired of graphic everything. Have any of you read Christies' Tommy and Tuppence books. They are a joy. Well people keep talking so I can read and learn. Bunny

Bunny,

The Tommy and Tuppence books are my favorites. I dearly love them.

Joan

Tommy and Tuppence were super; just wish there'd been more of them. And what about wonderful Miss Marple? SHE was my favorite.

Jeryn:

You are right about Patricia Cornwell's books. I just finished her latest and it was rather descriptive. We feel the same way about movies and TV. The old movies, a shot was heard, the body fell, and it was assumed they were dead. Or there was a scene where you seen the killer raise a knife and seen what apparently was a thrust and then the body hit the floor. We as readers or viewers were allowed to let our imagination be our guide. But in some stories today or movies there is so much graphic depiction of what actually happens one has to turn away from the screen til that scene is over.

I haven't read this month's book as I just finished Cornwell's and prior to that I was reading a Lawrence Sander's mystery that I still have to finish. Hopefully I will be able to lay my hands on the December book and be able to contribute to these discussions.

Shorty

Welcome Shorty,

We are glad to see you here. Hope that you will join us in the discussion of the books.

Joan

Shorty!! Welcome, welcome!! I echo Joan's welcome, and hope you will stay a long while.

Has anybody been able to find the Christmas book without recourse to audio tape? The B&N Bookstore only has the audio tape?

I don't mind trying that once, but want to know first. I guess you all saw about 7 new Christmas mysteries have come out since we've started discussing this one.

Ginny

Ginny! I got one of them you had mentioned: Rest You Merry! Local library had the large-print edition only so I got it! Thought I'd better as you said it was out of print. Just started it today... feel like I'm reading for my first grade book report [large large print]. HaHa.

Mercy, maybe we better call this the Christmas Mystery Mystery. OK, we'll do two: Rest Ye Merry by Charlotte MacLeod, and Counterfeit Christmas by Charlotte MacLeod, and we can compare them since they are on the same characters. In fact, I think that would be great!!

Is anybody finding the Counterfeit Christmas at all?

What do you all think of this new Black Coffee which is a Christie play adapted by somebody else? I had turned up my nose at it ("not REAL Christie") but now I hear it's great? What do you think?? Have you read it? Are you going to? the reviewers all make a big point about Christie's style and lack of violence.

Ginny

Jeryn,

There are many people who need the large print. It is just wonderful that they have large print books for those who have trouble with their eyes. I have a lot of eye problems but don't need the large print books myself yet. I do have a catarct and the dr won't take it off a this stage. So I may get to the point of needing large print before he does.

Joan

Oh Joan, I know the large print books are a wonderful thing! I should not make fun of them but it was sort of a cultural shock! Sorry to hear of your cataract; may it shrink and shrivel!

Ginny, our local library does not have that other Christmas mystery by MacLeod. If I like this first one, I will just BUY that other one. You had done some research into Christmas mysteries, I believe? Why don't you give us a list? Just for our own perusal...

Ginny, I could only get the tape of Counterfeit Xmas. Heard it last night. The tape is good and well read but are you aware that it is a short story?

Black Coffee sounds like I may have a go, I hadn't heard of it. Is it in hardback? Thanks for the heads up. Bunny

Bunny, no, for Pete's sake, are you kidding? A short story? This is beginning to look like the Christmas Curse.

Jeryn, yes, tons and tons of them, just got a new list yesterday, will post tomorrow. Those of us who HEARD the Counterfeit Christmas can reread, if we can get our hands on it, the Rest You Merry and Compare. Personally, I don't think anything MacLeod did ever rose to Rest You Merry's level.

Ginny

You mean I've got the best one right off the bat?!? Sometimes I gets lucky...

Jeryn, I think so!

More later today.

Ginny

Here, as requested are some Christmas or Holiday mysteries. Tons and tons of them this season, it seems:

A Holly, Jolly Murder by Joan Hess...Claire Malloy's presence at a Druid revel turns into a probe for murder.

Holmes for the HOlidays <?i> Martin H. Greenberg et al, eds. 14 seasonal tales by famous authors for Holmes and Watson to solve.

Inn at the Edge of the World by Alice Thomas Ellis: fugitives from Christmas on an isolated Inn are stranded on an island with a killer.

A Cat on Jingle Bell Rock by Lydia Adamson Alice Nestleton, asked by a charity to track down an anomymous donor whose contribution is late discovers murder.


The Merchant of Menace by Jill Churchill: Jane Jeffries's neighbor's tacky Christmas display leads to murder. Looks cute.


The Midnight Before Christmas by William Bernhardt: That's not Santa Claus trying to get in Bonnie Thomas's house!


And, in addition to all those nominated in our prior discussion, there's a new one out by Mary Higgins Clark.

Ginny

Ginny and All,

I am going to request that we not do Mary Higgins Clark.

I know that she is very popular but she gives me a feeling that I cannot describe and I abslolutely cannot read a book that she writes any more. I read several of her books and go this feeling. I just don't want to feel that way again. I do live alone you know. I felt this way before I was alon and stopped reading them before that but I certainly am not going to read one of them now. I think she verges on horror.

Joan

Oh, no, we're not considering her Joan, but was asked for a list of the latest mysteries featuring Christmas, so put that up. Obviously I missed a close tag somewhere.

No, we're doing the MacLeod Counterfeit Christmas if any of us can find it! hahahahah

or Ho Ho HO.

Ginny

Joan, I can relate. I do not read MHC books anymore either. Too much of the predatory perps after perfectly nice women, and each book was pretty much like the one before.

I've never seen anyone here mention books by Ira Levin. If you've never read The Stepford Wives, try it for a real pulse workout! Couple others were pretty good, too. I don't think he's writing any more; not sure.

Hi everybody! I'm sort of just dropping by to say hello and introduce myself. And a special hello to you, Ginny. It feels like we're old friends by now. Thank heavens I'm not alone in my aversion to Mary Higgins Clark! That woman has been writing the same book over and over again for years. It was when I realized she made me feel like taking two asperins, going to bed and calling the doctor in the morning, that I stopped reading her and was cured. "The Stepford Wives" is terrifying. I second the recommdation about reading it. And you don't have to worry about getting scared at night with this one.Best, Carol

HI, CAROL!! Yes, I agree, I feel like we're old friends, too. I think MHC writes on a formula and I'm sure those of you who read her daughter's first book saw Mom's hand there. The short chapters a give away, I thought.

Oh, let's DO read The Stepford Wives, and discuss it! I've never read it and only saw about 10 minutes of the movie, let's DO!!

I vote YES for January!!

Ginny

Hi Everyone,

Stepford Wives was indeed a good book. In my opinion All of his are very good. Have read most of them I think. I keep saying that. I must have spent all my time reading before the computer. Used to devour a mystery in one night. Joan

I think we all agree on M.H.C. I'm of the same thought. Hate to say it out loud. On Amazon.com under mystery university they have a piece on Agatha Christie thats just wonderful. I think all would enjoy. I saw the "new book" Black Coffee, sounds good but I will wait till paperback.

I read The Stepford Wives quite some time ago and I'm sorry to say, I didn't like it. But then I don't like most of the really popular books - like Horse Whisperer and Thornbirds and above all Gone With the Wind. Seems like everybody but me loved them and I thought they were awful.

Jeanne you really hated Gone With the Wind? Why? I can understand the other two books but Gone With the Wind? Thats like saying You hated the South. A unbeleaving Bunny!!!!!!!!!!

Hi Folks,

SeniorNet will be down tonight for about 1/2hr to and hour. Read Marcie's message here

Bunny - Yep! Both the book and the movie.

You are invited to a Halloweén Party.

Just click on The Grimes Family Hallowe'en Party

Be sure to scroll to the bottom of the page to see who all is there.

Joan

Well, Joan, what fun! A Haunted Mansion, a bevy of cute grandchildren and a witch in a pumpkin, and .....and....is that OTHER witch somebody WE know?

Brrrrrrrrrrrrr....hahahahah

Ginny

Thanks for the invite Joan. I had the nicest time. What cool kids.

Thanks again Joan. Love, Bunny

Getting back to Halloween Party, I didn't like it, I guess I'm more of a Miss Marple fan than our Mr. H.P.!! I finally got it from our library thru interlibrary loan. They take their sweet time. I ordered that latest one a month ago!! Still no call yet. About ready to break down and pay $22 per year to get borrowing priviledges from the County Library System. Ours seems more interested in facilities and not books or salaries!! And to boot not much up to date with computers!!

Oops, back to HP, the shoe thing got to me and was a distraction!

I'm happier with my herbie mysteries--the China Bayles series by Susan Witting Albert, I guess.

Well, I finally finished the book. I enjoyed it. I do agree with Ruth, "I'm more of a Miss Marple fan."

I did guess, on page 44, that Mrs. Drake killed Joyce. I even called Ginny to tell her my guess so she would believe me if I turned out to be right. I didn't have the reason worked out. Agatha Christie is good about putting correct clues early in the book. I had also felt that it was significant that Miranda was sick and not at the party. On page 44 it is said that Rowena Drake's husband died a year or two age. The time line was right. It said that he was a cripple. It was hard to see Rowena having to take care of a crippled husband instead of bring the socialite of the whole community. At that place in the book, I figured that she had killed her husband and Joyce saw it. The real reason worked itself out. What I didn't get was that Michael Garfield was involved. When I read a Christie book, I will reread sections until I have figured out who was the villain was and the plan before she tells us "who done it".

I do not know the four word and wish that she would either tell us or leave it out. Things like that drive me crazy.

Sandy

Thanks to those of you who visited my Hallowe'en page and for the nice comments. Ginny, yep you know that old witch .

Bunny Thanks for your comment.

Hi Ruth,

I agree I like Miss Marple best also. Really I like Poirot much better since I have seen David Suchet as Poirot. He has brought him to life for me.

Hi Sandy,

Looking forward to seeing you in New York!! Am sure we will have many laughs together!!LOL

I knew who the murder was on the same page as you did. I did not have the reasons all worked out either but as I read on I became more and more convinced I was right. I have never failed yet in knowing early on who the murderer is in Christie's books. She gives excellent clues. Her efforts to distract me never work. I enjoyed the book but it took me forever to read it. It was not a book that I could not put down. I always enjoy Christie but I think it is the setting of the book that I really like not her ability to write a mystery. I enjoy the suttle humor also. Her descriptions of the always prissy Poirot are priceless as are her descriptions of all her detectives.

Still like Tommy and Tuppence best.

Joan

Well where is everyone.

I thought maybe that someone would have something else to say about Hallowe'en Party and Agatha Christie.

I really enjoy reading mysteries that are not full of violence. I think that is one reason I like Agatha Chrisitie along with the setting and humor.

Joan

I stopped reading Agatha Christie some years ago because I was bothered by the 'red herrings', and therefore could not see why others loved her so. This was a good book for me to read because I could see that she has more depth than that. Characters in all their idiosyncrasies, down to prissy Piorot and his patent-leather shoes (by the time you reach senior age, shouldn't you have learned to value comfort a bit more?) His first meeting with Miranda -- almost a meeting of the minds, with Shakespeare. The sense of place, which somehow comes through more with English writers than with American writers.

The description of the house called Apple Trees is delicious: "It was well furnished, it had carpets of excellent quality, everything was scrupulously polished and cleaned, and the fast that it had hardly any outstanding object of interest in it was not readily noticeable."

But I almost got hung up on page one - yellow pumpkins? Not orange? And she talked about the ones with lights inside of them in the United States not for Halloween but for Thanksgiving.

Loma,

I am glad to see that you got to the point where you could see that reading Agatha Christie is not really about reading a mystery for the mystery's sake. Reading Agatha Christie is about reading literature.

I love her descriptions. They are so vivid and so English. The characters to me are priceless.

IMHO the pumpkin thing is an example of a writer describing something from another culture and not really knowing that much about what she is describing.

I really think that the characterization, the descriptions and the use of language are some of the things that make Christie stand out above modern writers who try to emulate her style.

Joan

Loma: I'm sure glad to see you!!

Aren't the British different about Halloween, tho?

The winning pumpkin (largest pumpkin) in our local Tri State Fair was yellow! I had just seen it out in Niven's field, and they had plenty of orange ones, so I know nothing of pumpkins, do they start out yellow or is that a different variety all together?? This thing was massive, and was kinda light pinkish yellow??

Ginny

AHA!! We have a leader for our January Mystery Discussion! Our Ed Zivitz, whom I hope to persuade to come among us in NYC, will lead a discussion in January of....gulp.....RATKING.....? by the great Michael Didbin that everyone is talking about!!

Now, will you all support him in this? Bunny? ED? What's it about? Is it gruesome? Is it awful? I'm not very big on awful + gruesome?

I've got 5 of Ira Levin's books on the way from Atlanta~~~ There's more than one way to skin Stepford Wives. So many many books, where's the time?

Who's in?? For January??

Ginny

Loma-------- I don't think they had Nike's then!!!!! Good luck to you Ed, trust me I've been there. Ginny is good very,very good. Ed think about Old Time Radio. Aw come on Ginny a little scary is good for you, makes the blood flow!!

Bunny - There's a world of difference between "scary" and "gruesome". I love scary, but I don't read more than a page or two of gruesome and gory.

I have to say I don't read gruesome and gory either nor do I read very scary. I am just not into that. I never have been.I also want someone who can write not just get by with the gruesome and gory. I like some humor in my mysteries also.

Guess no one wants to discuss Christie any further.

Joan

John Sandford is gruesome. Ira Levin is scary. If you just want interesting, Agatha does just fine!

I can take Levin's type of scary but there are some scaries that I can't take. Gruesome I don't believe I can take right now.

Chrisitie is always interesting. She is an author who is respected in most parts of the world. The French love her!! They loved Edgar Allan Poe too. In fact they were the first to love Edgar A. Poe. How do we classify E. A. Poe? I love him too. Now How did I get on that.

Joan

One thing that seemed clear in this book is if the murderers would have gotten away with it and gone to a Greek Island, that her fate would be sealed. A "bossy" woman, in other words one who wanted to be in control, who had limited aesthetics -- whose garden was pleasant but characterless, and a man who had his own visions of a garden but was controlling enough to have his former employer think it was all her idea. Well, that would not have worked out at all; she certainly would have died of an accident.

By the way, Miranda at Kilterbury Ring, was she to die by drinking from a poisoned cup and by knife? I assume Poirot notified Nicholas and Desmond and asked them to follow the group to London? Also, the Quarry Garden had been made for Mrs. Llewellen-Smythe, and her original will stood, so it says Rowena as widow inherited everything -- yet when Poirot first met Michael in the garden, Michael said she left her house in the will to him, and he sold it cheap to the Westons. And Mrs. Goodbody told Poirot that Leopold always had lots of money that he kept in a drawer under his socks; how would she know where he kept it? I like good mystery stories, but then tend to think about the mechanics of the actions and sometimes get puzzled.

Loma,

Mrs. good body was the local cleaning woman. I am sure that is how she knew about the money under the socks.

As for the house. It was left in the original will to Michael. It was the money that Rowena inherited. The lawyer tells Poirot on pages 102 and 103 that the money is left jointly to Hugo Drake and his wife.

Joan

So Mrs. Goodbody was a nosy cleaning woman, as was Mrs. Leaman. Thanks, I missed that. My copy of the book has different page numbers than yours, but when Poirot first met with Mr. Fullerton the lawyer, I did not see anything about the real estate being left to Michael even though they discussed him. The lawyer said she "had not changed her fundamental testamentary disposition for many years" except for minor updates. Guess I'm not reading thoroughly enough the first time around, and it's the dickens to go back and find things later. Anyway, it was an interesting mystery story.

I'll be darned - I just cleaned out my bookcase and lo and behold I found this book! I don't remember reading it, not too surprising with my memory. Too late for any comments from me. I didn't read any of the posts that looked like they would "give away" the murderer - ess? Since Agatha is one of my all time favorites, I now have the delicious task of reading it or maybe re-reading it.

Eileen Megan

Oh do Eileen you will have fun, and when you do look for the four words that has everyone going nuts. If you find them you have my everlasting respect.

Agatha Christie discusses the fact that nowdays children could be involved, both as victims or perpetrators, and also that the tendency was to release mental cases into society. Poirot says, "But it seems to me with children nowadays you don't need to look for the reason. The reason's in the killer's mind. His disturbed mind or his evil mind or his kinky mind. Any kind of mind you like to call it." This may be one of the author's 'red herrings', but it seems to me that it is a real concern of hers.

Bunny, four words eh? Since I haven't read any of the posts, does that mean no one got them? I started reading it last night and do recall Mrs. Oliver's character but so far nothing else!

Loma, Agatha was certainly before her time in thinking children could be responsible for such crimes - all you have to do today is read the newspaper to read of the violence committed by children.

Eileen Megan

And, unfortunately, also to children.

Thats right Eileen no one knows the four words, see what you can come up with. I think she was having a go with us.

Michael Didbin is making waves on both sides of the Atlantic with his mysteries, and here is a synopsis of Ratking proposed by Ed Zivits as our newest mystery:

Reviews and Commentary From The Publisher: In this masterpiece of psychological suspense, Italian Police Commissioner Aurelio Zen is dispatched to investigate the kidnapping of Ruggiero Miletti, a powerful Perugian industrialist. But nobody much wants Zen to succeed: not the local authorities, who view him as an interloper, and certainly not Miletti's children, who seem content to let the head of the family languish in the hands of his abductors -- if he's still alive.

Was Miletti truly the victim of professionals? Or might his kidnapper be someone closer to home: his preening son Daniele, with his million-lire wardrobe and his profitable drug business? His daughter, Cinzia, whose vapid beauty conceals a devastating secret? The perverse Silvio, or the eldest son Pietro, the unscrupulous fixer who manipulates the plots of others for his own ends? As Zen tries to unravel this rat's nest of family intrigue and official complicity, Michael Dibdin gives us one of his most accomplished thrillers, a chilling masterpiece of police procedure and psychological suspense.



It is available from Barnes & Noble's Bookstore right here online, giving SN 7% of the sales price and equal to Amazon.

Would you like to vote to read it? We can continue with the 4 words here, but today we've opened the Tony Hillerman Discussion with our own Bunny as Leader, at: Dance Hall of the Dead

Hope to see you there, what do you think of the Didbin??

Ginny

Loma, right, it's a world turned upside down these days.

OK, Bunny, so far I haven't seen anything about "four words" but if I "get a clue" I'll post it.

Eileen Megan

Good Eileen you post that if you find them. Come over to "Dancehall of the Dead" discussion and join in. Its pretty cool! Bunny

Bunny, hope you're still checking on posts here.

I don't know if anyone suggested this but I think the "4 words" were two names Rowena Drake and Michael Garfield. Miss Emlyn said: "As to two of the words on that paper, I agree, yes. The other two, that is more difficult. I have no evidence and, indeed, the idea had not entered my head".

HP said he knew who the killer was and Ms. Emlyn agreed. In the second part of the sentence I think she was referring to the fact that she had no knowledge of Rowena Drake's connection to Michael Garfield.

Eileen Megan

Hi Eileen, You smart, smart lady. I'm just so proud of you to work that whole thing out! If you want to see the award I gave you go over the Dancehall of the Dead and see. Love Bunny