Ella: You have a good library; my library has one copy of this book, which is checked out, and two ahead of me on the reserve list. Secretary of State Albright is certainly setting high standards. Daily, I hear reports of her that give me pride. Her life is a good place for us to start.

The book is well written and interesting cover to cover. It does have a few "Drawbacks" i.e. It obviously doesn't succeed in being up to date with the "Present". It is too intensely tied up with her Father's biography and the question of her "Jewishness" or lack thereof. I would have appreciated a bit more about her relations with the Middle-Eastern leaders.

Best

LJ

LJ: I read that criticism in several of the reviews, but I enjoyed the family history and I think it added, rather than detracted from the book. Whether she knew or didn't is an interesting speculation.

Has anyone read or heard about some of the current criticism regarding Ms Albright,specifically that because she is a woman she's not "tough" enough to be Sec.of State.

Hello Ed: I read in an editorial that Ms. Albright in speaking to the President had a "flirtatious" manner. It was written by a man - so I took no notice.

There was some speculation that Clinton's appointment to the UN (I can't remember his name) was an enemy of Albright's and that his ascendency jeopardized her ambitions, for VP, I guess. One thing about Secretaries of State, they never seem to need sleep. My body craves 8 hours per night, but they go here, there, never seem to be bothered by jet-lag. These folks seem not like some special kind of human.

The Library emailed me and I picked up my copy today. I can keep it for 3 weeks and hopefully renew it.. 1 copy ... and my name was the last on the list, (I didn't reserve until Jan. 5th).

I got this book at the Library and have read several chapter. It is very interesting, well documented, and so far I am enjoying it very much.

--- Papa John

Hey "Papa John" I haven't seen you posting in the non-fiction areas before this, and certainly want to welcome you to the fold. This is a fine place to find another reader and we look forward to your comments. I'm sure Jackie would appreciate any suggestions about your likes and dislikes in readings about the great women of our (and both past and future) time. We'd all be interested in knowing your thoughts on other areas in both biography, history, adventure, current events, and potpourri.

Best

LJ

Greetings, Papa John, and welcome. We are always happy to have another reader join us. Are you a fiction fan? There are many fine books being read in fiction. We have some exciting non-fiction books being discussed, also. Hope to see you posting here and in the other discussions, too. Another woman from the past will be discussed in Books of Horror; Shirley Jackson's Haunting of Hill House will be upcoming this spring. I've heard rumors of a discussion of Alias Grace, Margaret Atwood's tale of an 18-year-old housemaid who was charged with murdering her employer in the mid 1800's. A true story.

Thanks for the welcome LJ and Jackie. I like fiction and non fiction. In the non fiction I think I enjoy biographies probably the most. The new book about about Madeleine Albright is especially timely because she is playing such a part in current events and because she is a she.

--- Papa John

Hello - did any of you watch the funeral of King Hussein last night? And notice the fact that there were no women, as is their custom. Read this morning that several ladies came, Hilary among them, but they were greeted in the palace by the Queen and stayed there. Albright, diplomat that she is, elected to stay home - I do admire her tact, which she learned from her father.

Ella: I know nothing about her father. What is the relationship between tact and her father? I'm am very curious.

Jackie, the first 100 pages of the book are largely about her father.

On the other hand, I know nothing about queen Noor's father. Best

LJ

Hi Jackie - When you get the book, you'll know. LJ is right - her father was prominent in (that CZech country I can't remember how to spell).

Queen Noor was an American - she graduated from Princeton with a degree in Architecture - she also is beautiful isn't she? The King's 4th wife I understand! Wonder what her parents thought about it all?

As I recall, Queen Noor's father worked for Pan Am, and the family had spent much of her early life in the Middle East.

That's interesting, Jackie - so she knew what she was in for when she married King Hussein. It would be difficult for an American women I would think, but love, sweet love. How did the man so beguile women? 4 wives he had!

Do you want me to start the discussion. If so, I'll pose a few questions to think about - will do this weekend. It's a very good book!

Ella, you darling: I have not yet gotten the book. It may take me a while, but I'm going the rounds of all the local libraries this weekend. Please do start the discussion. I took it on because no one volunteered.

Happy Valentine's Day to all of you.

HAPPY VALENTINE'S DAY!

A day or so early but must do when I have the time. Jackie has asked me to open this discussion for her as she has not been able to get the book from the Library as yet. So I'll make a few comments and hope all of you will jump in with your own.

"See what happens when you let men into the Cabinet" - said Madeleine Albright, Secretary of State, about two male colleagues who were discussing clothes shopping. (Quoted from this week's TIME Magazine)

The lady has a good sense of humor!

A few critics (our own LJ included) have made the comment that l/4 of the book is her father's story; further I'll make the comment that another l/4 of the book is taken up with her research. Very impressive research.

Did the history of the family detract from MB's story ?

What did you think of MB's interviews given to the author (in the Introduction)

Have to disagree with LJ...How many foreign born women have reached great heights in US government? I think her family's story sets the stage for MA's achievements...Read the book several months ago when it came out. I'll go back and refresh so I can try to keep up with such an articulate group. BL.

I too, thought the biography of her father was interesting and am glad to have read it, and the family background is germaine to the protagonust's story story, but somewhat like the recent political debacle over Clinton's sex life, I thought the emphasis on her Jewish ancestry was/is overdone.

Admittedly, since she's still in office, the intimate details of her tenure as Sect'y. of State were/are not available, but that would have been the most interesting part of the story.

Best

LJ

There were a number of quotes in the "Introduction" which appealed to me.

First : For a significant number of middle aged male WASPs, who consider American Foreign Policy their private province, the day Madeline Albright became Secretary of State will go down in history for one reason; It was the day they were beaten by a girl".

Second: "Too often, in the past foreign policy decisions were made by politicians with no experience or feel for diplomacy. Or diplomats shaped policy with little understanding of the wishes or culture of those people in whose name the policy was formulated".

The latter comment seems to refer to an American tradition dating to the mid 1800's and essentially unchanged prior to our intimate involvement in the Middle East.

Best

LJ

LJ: Do you agree that this Secretary of State has the diplomatic background and knowledge of foreign lands to do a credible job? How do you think she's doing so far?

Throughout the book the thread of whether or not SHE KNEW about her Jewish ancestry is vastly overdone, in my opinion. I wanted to scream - SO WHAT? With one exception and that is if she did not know it must have been difficult for her to realize the trauma her parents, with whom she was very close, must have gone through, particularly leaving their parents behind to perish in the concentration camps and never disclosing it to her and her siblings. But then I know a few veterans who have gone through traumatic experiences in wars who never talk about it either. Some do, some don't.

On page 124 "There was one fascinating similarity between her thesis (on Czechoslovalia) and the books written by her father............she made no mention of the personal tragedy that communism had inflicted on the Czechoslovak people or Hitler's treatment of the Jews." I don't know what to make of this do you?

In the introduction I thought the author portrayed MA as a cold, ambitious, self-serving woman; however after finishing it I got the opposite opinion; she was a warm, loving woman and friend. Constantly I was referring to the author's notes in the back and was astonished in some cases that her friends would disclose such personal conversations; but most of the time the controversial/negative aspects of her life or personality were cited as coming from confidential sources. For MA it must have be appalling to read.

I hope she will write her own memoir someday.

I agree that the emphasis upon her Jewish ancestry and whether or not she knew of it is overdone. What her father had to do to protect his family, transport them to safety and provide the setting for a productive life is much more interesting than what some may see as lack of loyalty on his part.

Hello Jo:

I hope we will continue to post our impressions of this book. As I remember Pat W., John and Ed were also reading it. Jackie, I assume, is still waiting to get the book.

I have some notes I took while reading it and will be back later to comment. Meanwhile, those of you who are reading it or have read it, please step to the bat and take a swing. How is our first female Secretary of State doing? How was she as a UN Ambassador - I remember reading that she and her predecessors stay in a suite in NY - was it the Waldorf-Astoria? that cost $27,000 a MONTH!!! We are paying for this, my friends, shouldn't the government buy a place there instead of this kind of rent?

By the time the government could; buy - furnish - provide secretarial service - buy office equipment usually available to guests in high dollar hotels - maintain all this - pay for the household help - butler - cooks - waiters for affairs that include others - Silver, China service etc. to allow a Sec.of State entertain - a supervisor for the help - pay for protection - secure parking for Sec.of State, International guests, and other government guests as well as on going help, it would probably be as expensive as having a hotel provide all the services required. I think these $$ astound us because we are just not aware of the costs most CEO's and Heads of State take for granted.

I think hotels give name personalities a break on expences but they can use those names then to add to their list of famous people they've served. Where as with current government officials the protection issues preclude the hotel from benefiting from their stay.

I have the book - my daughter actually sent it to me in December but, I haven't cracked it yet - Magic Mountain has taken all my reading energy. Another week with MM should do it for me and I forsee this a quicker read. I will post after I've read.

I'm trying to do MM too, but I fell sadly behind. Then I started this one, and it's going much faster. I'll probably finish if 'way before MM! I'm impressed with the adaptability and talent of the family, and even though it wasn't what I expected to find in this bio, I appreciate the insights into events and circumstances behind the scenes of WW II. Knowing historical fact is not the same understanding the drama of individual lives. Madeline's father was determined to get his family to a safe place at almost any cost. Madeline was a determined, self-assured student and she is now determinded to let the Serbs and other aggressors know that they must stop inflicting suffering or face consequences. I know that's her job right now, but she seems naturally forceful in her manner of delivery.

We have two more names to add to the reading list; I hope Jackie will get her books soon.

Barbara: Yes I can understand the UN Ambassador needs some of that space and expense for entertaining; but certainly she has an office in the UN for secretaries, aides and the like and office equipment; I would imagine she has a large staff there, wouldn't you?

Jo: She is forceful, but quiet and dignified about it, in my opinion. The book mentioned MA coming to Columbus, Ohio (my hometown) and we avidly watched the event. Several protestors were vociferous in shouting and protesting and she was quite calm throughout it - it was being filmed by CNN - she mentioned that she had been a professor and understand students' passions. Some years before that (quite a few I believe) Kissinger had come to OSU for a lecture and my sister and I went to hear him speak; we had always been so impressed with him also.

Took a look at some notes:

Throughout the book, perhaps because it was written by a woman, there are many references as to how difficult it is for a woman to move up in a man's world. A few I remember are the difficulty MA had in networking and liasoning with those in power as the men often talked in terms of sports and shared missions; the juggling she had to do in managing house, motherhood and wife, her hurt and difficulties over the divorce, men's attitude toward women in the White House and beyond.

One thing I remember and made a note of is that in order to move up in politics one has to be in a financial position to do a lot of entertaining, which MA learned to do very successfully. I wonder if this is also true of men. Some influential women, such as Geraldine Ferraro, who was also in such a financial position, formed their own network - I can't remember if this was where the "square table" discussions were formed, but thought that amusing.

I also made a note that TIME magazine in the '70's came out with a cover story about the suburban housewife that stated "the housewife was breakfast getter, laundress, house cleaner, shopper, gardener, etc……the thread that weaves between family and community-the keeper of the suburban dream - and paints her face for her husband's return before she wrestles with dinner." That was me only I started in the '50's and was happy in those days being a suburban housewife. I had fun and the children were the center of our lives. I wonder if TIME or any other magazine will ever again write such a story! How times have changed since then for women and their roles in the family.

I'm on the last lap of this inspiring book... It is interesting to note that many of the women in M Albright's close friendships were immigrants from Europe and Eastern Europe... They had come through some harrowing times and had learned early on to survive and compete. They were not necessarily bound to the American concept that women belonged in the home. They were all well educated and had put their education to good use..

Another point I noticed was the education network did not include women's education in the Midwest.. These successful people had attended schools in the East..

I well remember trying to get into an Eastern school in '46. Coed colleges & universities gave preference to GI's and were crowded, so the women's colleges opened to men, and women in those days stood in line behind the GI enrollees.

By the early 50's when my younger sister went to college, she had no trouble enrolling at Bryn Mawr.

One of the many endless fascinations of discussing books is what we all notice in a book and oftimes apply to our own lives. Just love reading what other folks have to say about a book. Things I miss others will pick up on. (such a bad way to end a sentence!)

Ella, what was Winston Churchill's remark about a criticism ...? Did he say it was a situation "up with which I will not put!"? A convolution to avoid an end preposition! Your sentence sounds better!
I'm about halfway through with the book, and I'm wondering about a few things. One, the money! Evidently, Madeline and her husband have all that they need from his family, including money for her continuing education??? She decided to do graduate work not long after the twins were born when they were in DC. There was no clarification about fellowships, grants, etc. Did she just decide to go, and that was that? Obviously, she was highly qualified and deserving, but in those days, we had to work out financial matters before we took that plunge. I went to school when my children were small, but I had to apply for all the funds, work part time, and get family help with kids. I think many of us were influenced by finanacial limitations as well as by the cultural belief that we should be dedicated mothers and homemakers. Later, we are told she could inherit Albright money, but she couldn't use to to help her own family! WHAT???? That was interesting! It didn't seem to be because there wasn't enough to go around, enough to take wonderful care of the little Albrights!
I also had trouble understanding how she could forget the afternoon in Prague she met with Petr Novak, the man who had been a musical prodigy and was maimed by the Nazis to prevent him from playing the cello ever again in his life. On that occasion she learned that her own father had been on a Nazi "hit list." She had to have been gasping with sorrow for Petr and with relief that her father had escaped in time. How could she have forgotten the details of that interview?

Hi Jo. As I remember Joe Albright was very wealthy and she had household help as soon as they started in their marriage; I doubt money was any problem ever for her after her marriage. I think any of us could have and would have gone back to school if (1) household help was available; (2) a nursemaid for the children; (3) finances no problem. She was bored! Can you imagine that? I was much too busy with house, children, and the little social life we had, to be bored. We had one car and I waited to do shopping, etc. in the evenings or Saturday so my husband could babysit. Even after MA's divorce she was still wealthy.

Tell me what page that episode on Petr and that visit is on? I forget but I still have the book.

I have just finished the book. I am not a fast reader but I read every paragraph and every page. I enjoyed the book very much. I found it interesting and very readable. I enjoyed the extensive background material conerning her parents and their flight from Europe. This served to explain a very intresting and complex lady who is making a mark upon history as we speak.

--- Papa John

Hi, Ella! The Petr Novak episode is on pp. 145-146.
Now I'm reading about the way Joe Albright's newspaper career seemed to dissolve when he was still so young, at the same time that Madeline's star was rising in Washington. She was a sought-after hostess for various campaigns, admired because of her multiple skills. I feel the marital rift coming.

Hi Jo - I looked up those pages, a sad story wasn't it. I know it doesn't matter to anybody, but one cannot help but think that MA surely knew her Jewish heritage, although it does seem that this author goes to great lengths to sell that fact.

I notice the pictures near these pages - I truly do not like MA's trademark hat do you?

This friend, Marcia Burick, certainly gave an extensive interview to the author - I wonder how MA feels about her now.

Do you feel that if the family had not escaped communism (we know they would not have escaped the Nazis), that MA's father, and also MA, would have risen in the ranks politically? Of course, they would have had to embrace communism, but they both seemed to be of the same character and politically ambitious.

Ella, I hadn't thought about that. Yes, they both seem to be gited in this area, and undoubtedly would have done well in their native country if their values had not been at odds with those of the new group, who implemented communist ideology in a very brutal way. Albright instinctively knows how to conduct herself in sessions with the powerful. She wasn't intimidated by Muskie, for instance, while many others were. (I was surprised to learn that his personality was so bombastic!) I think that hat is a real risk for a woman of her physical characteristics! It is a good way of making a unique impression, though!

I read this book quite awhile ago, but reading through your comments makes me want to get it from the library and read it again. That's my problem. I read--I forget, even the author and Ella oftens asks "Who wrote it" and I can seldom tell her. Ha Ha. I am currently reading one of Ophra's books "The Midwives} by Chris Bohjalian Good, hard to get into, but worht trying.

What will be the next book you all are reading and I will try to get into it. Best to all Caspar

HELLO CASPAR! I had to take my book back to the Library so I have forgotten a lot of things I wanted to mention also; however, I did want to say (perhaps I already have a few posts back?)that when MA was here in Columbus with the Defense Secretary and other dignitaries, she certainly stayed calm and cool during a student protest by the Muslim Student Association.

Also the book mentioned Jan Masaryk (I'm spelling that wrong), former president of Chechoslavkia and hero to the people - I have never forgotten a book I read about him written either by his wife or mistress; she loved him and wanted to tell the world that he did not commit suicide as the Communists stated, but was undeniably killed by them. She wrote of her life in that country and eloquently spoke of her dying mother - it comes to mind that she was an actress perhaps.

I also wondered after finishing the book, why the author wrote so little of MA's sister and brother when she covered her parents so thoroughly.

The author seems to lead us on a trail of questioning her fathers association with the Communists - It is so easy to think black and white or red, vs. red, white and blue; when you are safe on this side of the ocean and have never had to make the choices that family was forced to make. In difficult times I think you do and say what ever is necessary to stay safe and keep your family safe. Reads to me that her father proved his loyality in the many years teaching in Denver.

And the cousin - well she may be saying things because she sees what Madelane has accomplished and Madelane I'm sure is torn between her great love and admiration for her father and guilt about things that she as a child and probably her father at the time could do nothing about unless he risked the safty of his immediate family. Few of us have experienced such horrendous choices.

The fact of little memeory is easy. We all know when things happen that make you too scared to cry, many push it to the recceses of their mind. In fact there is a book called 'Too Scared to Cry' that speaks about a bus load of children buried for days in California and the aftermath, when they were finally found and dug out. Many had little memory and some chose not to speak of it and others changed their behavior 180 degrees, not for the best.

I thought the author injected too much of his own value judgements and opinions about her not remembering her background and the communist association.

I was so dissapointed in this book. When I read about it, I had the library buy it for their collection because it was about the first female Secretary of State. I don't think it was well written and I will be waiting for an autobiography...hopefully it will be a better description of a woman who made it to the top...

Theresa - WAIT! I want to hear why you were disappointed in the book. Several of us read it some time ago, and want your opinion of it also.

I think the reason I was disappointed in the book is that I admire MA for her accomplishments and don't think the book did her justice. I finally just stopped reading it and decided I would wait for another author......