Author Topic: Frankenstein by Mary Shelley ~ July Book Club Online PREDISCUSSION (Read 24680 times)

PatH · « **Reply #40 on:** June 16, 2010, 07:46:41 PM »

Frankenstein
by Mary Shelley

Frankenstein is a story many of us think we know but actually don't. Very few films have followed the novel very closely. The monster of the book is intelligent and soft-spoken. The themes are timeless and full of conflict. Join us as we read this fantastic story, created by 19-year old Mary Shelley, and share your thoughts about its characters and meanings.

Post here to let us know you'll be joining us starting July 1.

"Remember that I am thy creature; I ought to be thy Adam, but I am rather the fallen angel, whom thou drivest from joy for no misdeed."

Discussion Leaders: PatH and marcie

The full text is available online at literature.org and Read Print and Project Gutenberg
.
Online version of original 1818 Edition

Bookjunky · « **Reply #41 on:** June 17, 2010, 08:13:17 AM »

It is also available as a download from project Gutenberg. http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/84 Not sure yet which version that is. I read Frankenstein years a go in High School for an oral book report my freshman year. When it was my turn to give my report everyone groaned, the knew I had just watched the movie. But when I began pointing out things in the book not in the movie I got a really easy A.

marcie · « **Reply #42 on:** June 17, 2010, 11:31:21 AM »

Thanks, Bookjunky. We'll add the link to gutenberg in our heading. Since you got an "A" on your report, you'll be our resident expert ;-)

mrssherlock · « **Reply #43 on:** June 17, 2010, 12:41:17 PM »

Sadly Amazon has no copies of the edition I found in Wikipedia, with the additions by her husband, so I found it at Alibris.

Ella Gibbons · « **Reply #44 on:** June 17, 2010, 01:06:12 PM »

Eons ago, and I'm not sure how long ago an eon is, but it's a very lovely word, I saw the movie. Today I picked up the book which has an Introduction by Wendy Steiner. Mary's own life is unbelievably horrible, how she lived through such tragedies and horrors is beyond me. She carried Shelly's heart in her purse for the rest of her life, OH, NO!

JoanP · « **Reply #45 on:** June 17, 2010, 01:26:15 PM »

Ella. I agree, Mary's life was nearly as unbelievable as her fiction! I was interested to read that she is said had an affair with Washington Irving - Ichobad Crane - the headless horseman.

I just have to say that I think the creature of the 1831 Frontispiece looks far more like something a young experimental might fashion out of "spare parts" in his lab (sort of like a scarecrow) , than the Adonis on the bookcover seen here in the heading.

I have to admit, the creature has touched my heart - to the point of tears. I mustn't talk about it yet, though.

marcie · « **Reply #46 on:** June 17, 2010, 01:54:33 PM »

Ella, it's great that you'll be joining us. In keeping with the grotesque atmosphere of the book, I am wondering how Mary kept Percy Bysshe Shelley's heart?

Traude, I missed your post some days back. I am so glad you're going to be with us for the discussion.

Joan, yes I do picture Frankenstein's creation as being "pieced" together. The cover in the heading is more like the muscular Adam in the Sistine Chapel: http://www.katapi.org.uk/Art/CreationOfAdam.html

JoanK · « **Reply #47 on:** June 17, 2010, 03:04:51 PM »

I'll be joining you, and have to order the book. I admit I'm confused by the different editions, and am wondering which one to try and get. Any suggestions?

marcie · « **Reply #48 on:** June 17, 2010, 05:05:04 PM »

JoanK, I'm very glad you'll be with us. Speaking for myself, I am not sure that it matters which edition you have for purposes of our discussion. I believe that most of us will have a book based on the edits made by Mary Shelley in 1831.

Wikipedia says: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankenstein#Publication
On 31 October 1831, the first "popular" edition in one volume appeared, published by Henry Colburn & Richard Bentley. This edition was quite heavily revised by Mary Shelley, and included a new, longer preface by her, presenting a somewhat embellished version of the genesis of the story. This edition tends to be the one most widely read now, although editions containing the original 1818 text are still being published. In fact, many scholars prefer the 1818 edition. They argue that it preserves the spirit of Shelley's original publication (see Anne K. Mellor's "Choosing a Text of Frankenstein to Teach" in the W.W. Norton Critical edition).

I found the text of the 1818 edition online at http://www.brian-t-murphy.com/FrankensteinV1.htm. The author of the site says that he recommends the following edition: Hunter, J. Paul, ed. Frankenstein: A Norton Critical Edition. New York: W. W. Norton, 1996. He says: "Originally this project was intended to be expanded to include both published editions, with annotations, as well as a collation of all of the texts, including Mary Shelley’s original manuscript and fair copy as well as her annotations in the Thomas copy of the 1818 edition at the Pierpont Morgan Library, New York. However, J. Paul Hunter’s edition renders these further developments unnecessary, and is highly recommended."

Roxania · « **Reply #49 on:** June 19, 2010, 11:45:10 AM »

I'd like to join!

Ella Gibbons · « **Reply #50 on:** June 19, 2010, 11:47:00 AM »

My book is the Modern Library Series; there is an introduction by Wendy Steiner who is/was the chair of the English department at the University of PA; then there is the Author's Introduction written in London, October 15, 1831 followed by a Preface written by Marlow, September, 1817. (who is he?)

The book begins with LETTERS which are very interesting!

JoanP · « **Reply #51 on:** June 19, 2010, 12:37:03 PM »

Ella, I'm thinking that Marlow is not a person, but a place? Not sure though.
I'm glad you mentioned those letters at the start. I admit to being puzzled by them, and only after getting into them did I realize their significance to the story...

JoanK · « **Reply #52 on:** June 19, 2010, 01:29:57 PM »

I ordered it from Amazon. I couldn't tell which edition I'm getting, but a review recommended the 1994 "Peabody" edition, so that's what I got.

PatH · « **Reply #53 on:** June 19, 2010, 02:17:46 PM »

Welcome, Roxania, both to Seniorlearn and this discussion! We're delighted to see you here.

For you and Elainetm, the other newcomer to these discussions, I'll summarize how they work. In the pre-discussion, people sign up, get acquainted, and talk about relevant background--different versions, author's life, the atmosphere of the time, whatever. Some participants don't bother coming in to this after they sign up, but most do.

When the actual discussion starts, July 1 in this case, we divide the book up into chunks, and talk about one at a time; it's usually 1/4 of the book each week. A schedule will be posted, but we'll probably start with the first 6 chapters. We try not to talk ahead of the schedule no matter how far we've read individually, but earlier sections are fair game. Questions are posted as a starting point, but are often ignored.

Frybabe · « **Reply #54 on:** June 19, 2010, 05:18:01 PM »

Hi Roxania. It is so wonderful to have you on board.

marcie · « **Reply #55 on:** June 19, 2010, 11:05:28 PM »

Welcome, Roxania! We're very pleased to have you join this discussion.

Ella Gibbons · « **Reply #56 on:** June 20, 2010, 03:40:27 PM »

WELCOME ROXANIA! I love the spelling of your name!

Yes, I see, JOANP. Marlow is a place, Switzerland?

PatH · « **Reply #57 on:** June 20, 2010, 04:34:35 PM »

Marlow seems to be a town in Buckinghamshire where Mary and Percy lived for a while.

PatH · « **Reply #58 on:** June 20, 2010, 05:18:56 PM »

I got that bit of information from the Wikipedia article, which is pretty copious.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Shelley

As Ella points out, she had a tragic, colorful life.

HaroldArnold · « **Reply #59 on:** June 21, 2010, 11:38:48 AM »

Regarding my B&N digital edition of Frankenstein. Like a DVD of a modern movie the package includes additional material relative to the works. I am sorry for my delay an answering JoanP's question relative to the Percy Shelly authored preface. The following is my Table Of Content that will answer Joan's question and provide a bit more information on other inclusions with the B&N digital package. In addition I have the capability of accessing included annotations and footnotes:

From The Pages of Frankenstein
Copyright Page (From the 1st Ed)
Mary Shelly (a bio sketch)
The World of Mary Shelley (a modern social commentary on Regency England)_
Introduction (apparently a modern commentary written by a Karen Karbiener a PhD Professor at N.Y, University)
Praise
Dedication (the author’s dedication statement dedicating the work to her father, William Godwin)
Author’s Introduction ( by Mary Shelly)
Preface (Written by Percy Shelly in his wife’s voice. This is followed by 4 Letters From a Robert Walton to his sisters These letters are the frame around which the novel is based. Click the following for more information on this fictional Robert Walton and these letters. http://www.enotes.com/frankenstein/robert-walton )
Chapters ! Through 24
End Notes
Inspired By Frankenstein
Comments & Questions
For Further Reading

PatH · « **Reply #60 on:** June 21, 2010, 08:34:21 PM »

Harold, it sounds like you will be well equipped to fill us in on stuff we miss. I couldn't get very far on your link without registering, which I was reluctant to do, but it mentioned the concept of a "frame narrative", which I think we will want to notice when we start. WARNING--even the bit I read has plot spoilers.

marcie · « **Reply #61 on:** June 21, 2010, 09:57:35 PM »

Wow, Harold. It does sound like you'll have a wealth of information to share. I look forward to the discussion.

kidsal · « **Reply #62 on:** June 22, 2010, 01:50:10 AM »

FRAME NARRATIVE: A story within a story, within sometimes yet another story, as in, for example, Mary Shelley's Frankenstein. As in Mary Shelley's work, the form echoes in structure the thematic search in the story for something deep, dark, and secret at the heart of the narrative. The form thus also resembles the psychoanalytic process of uncovering the unconscious behind various levels of repressive, obfuscating narratives put in place by the conscious mind. As is often the case (and Shelley's work is no exception), a different individual often narrates the events of a story in each frame. This structure of course also leads us to question the reasons behind each of the narrations since, unlike an omnicient narrative perspective, the teller of the story becomes an actual character with concomitant shortcomings, limitations, prejudices, and motives. The process of transmission is also highlighted since we often have a sequence of embedded readers or audiences, A famous example in film of such a structure is Orson Welles' Citizen Kane.

Ella Gibbons · « **Reply #63 on:** June 22, 2010, 01:06:20 PM »

Gosh, KIDSAL! That explanation would scare many from reading the book. Good thing we have PATH and MARCIE to help us understand this frame narrative!

I promise not to bring up a place (such as Marlow) again in this discussion, hahahahaaa!

PatH · « **Reply #64 on:** June 22, 2010, 02:22:28 PM »

I had never heard the term "frame narrative" before--thanks for the enlightenment, Harold and Kidsal--but one sees the thing itself a lot. As it plays out in Frankenstein, more than one frame, it's not formidable at all.

JoanR · « **Reply #65 on:** June 22, 2010, 04:31:18 PM »

Hi, everyone! I just got my book from Amazon - the 1818 text! (That's the publication date - she began to write it in 1816 - with a 6 month old baby!!)

I borrowed Frankenstein from our library but it is the 1831 edition which has an afterword by Harold Bloom so I'll hang onto it as well. I prefer to read the text that Mary Shelley wrote FIRST even if she may have "improved" it later. It's like keeping your kids' gradeschool art even though their later efforts are "better" - not that there is that extreme a comparison here!!
My new book is a Norton Critical Edition so it is probably chock-a-block full of helpful comment.

I see a chronology of Mary Shelley in the back of the book and notice that she wrote "Mathilda" in 1819 but it wasn't published until 1959.

marcie · « **Reply #66 on:** June 22, 2010, 10:02:05 PM »

Yikes. I agree, Ella, that some of the descriptions of "frame narrative" make it sound more complex than it has to be. It sounds like it describes a technique for a story within a story with a "framing" story setting the stage for other stories. One example from Frankenstein is the beginning framing story of someone writing letters to his sister describing a story told to him by Victor Frankenstein. I don't think that gives too much away before we start talking about the content of the book on July 1.

Gumtree · « **Reply #67 on:** June 23, 2010, 05:21:47 AM »

PatH and Marcie : I'd love to be part of this discussion but am afraid I will only be able to lurk most of the time. I have a copy of the book - the 1831 version and will use that but am rather envious of JoanK who has the Norton Critical Edition - they always have such pertinent commentaries.

The frame story or frame narrative has been with us forever and we've all read some of them - they're really just a story or stories within a story - some get quite complex and one wonders whose story is being told at any one time - but Frankenstein is fairly straightforward in that respect.

Classic frame narratives include - Ovid's Metamorphoses - Scheherazade's Thousand and One Nights - Boccaccio's Decameron - Chaucer's Canterbury Tales etc. And then there's Emily Bronte's Wuthering Heights and Joseph Conrad's Heart of Darkness - plus heaps of others...

So my guess is that we're all familiar with the form of the frame narrative even if the literary term is unfamiliar and I must say that Shelley's Frankenstein is a doddle compared with some of those I mentioned.

Babi · « **Reply #68 on:** June 23, 2010, 08:51:21 AM »

I finally realized I hadn't come in here to say I'll be joining you for 'Trankenstein". I'm looking forward to discovering what the book
was really about, after all the weird Hollywood versions.

PatH · « **Reply #69 on:** June 23, 2010, 09:04:54 AM »

Oh, good, Gumtree and Babi. Two more friends. Welcome.

marcie · « **Reply #70 on:** June 23, 2010, 11:48:04 AM »

Yes, we're very glad that you'll be joining the group, Gumtree and Babi!

Babi · « **Reply #71 on:** June 24, 2010, 09:25:04 AM »

I've starting reading 'Frankenstein'. The language is so fulsome and formal that
it seems stiff to me. I'm taking breaks from reading this one by turning to an old
favorite, Elizabeth Goudge's "Blue Hills", the perfect contrast.

PatH · « **Reply #72 on:** June 24, 2010, 10:32:03 AM »

It's stiffest at the very beginning, though it never becomes casual.

Mippy · « **Reply #73 on:** June 24, 2010, 11:52:55 AM »

After reading the first 10 pages, I've decided to wait and read on June 29th or so ... to avoid having to re-read, which is my usual modus operandus in book groups.

I had had no idea about the frame term, but it sure has been used by a lot of 19th century authors. I like it much better than all this postmodern stuff people keep suggesting.

Bookjunky · « **Reply #74 on:** June 25, 2010, 11:15:04 PM »

I got lucky today and found an audio version to download from Clevenet, (library download). These days I do most of my reading in an audio format. I have never recovered from the death of my trusty palm as a text reading device and the newer smart phones just don't do the job. One day I hope to get an Etaco jetbook to replace my beloved pda.

marcie · « **Reply #75 on:** June 26, 2010, 12:12:03 AM »

Bookjunky, I'm glad that you found an audio version to enable you to participate.

Everyone, Look at these amazing photos of lightning striking twice at the same time in Chicago. They remind me of (at least the film versions) of Frankenstein's experiments !!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1289162/Lightning-strikes-Willis-Tower-Trump-Tower-Chicago.html

JoanK · « **Reply #76 on:** June 29, 2010, 03:35:08 PM »

Amazing picture!

It's not me that has the Norton Critical Edition. I have the "Pennyroyal Edition" (don't ask me what that means): the 1818 edition done in beautiful print, with many pictures, and no supplementary information at all.

At first I was very disappointed. but reading it, I find it really makes a difference reading a book where an effort has been made to make it visably beautiful!

But I may go and get the Norton critical edition, too.

PatH · « **Reply #77 on:** June 29, 2010, 04:39:36 PM »

At last--only two more days until we start. I've worked out a discussion schedule, but unfortunately, the chapters are divided up differently in the different editions

. My book and the online versions from literature.org and readprint.com are one way, JoanK's book and the 1818 online version another. For all I know there may even be a third. So I'll resort to the trick that JoanK and Babi used in War and Peace, and give the last line of the section too.

We'll start with: July 1-6: Letters, Chapters 1-5 (1818) or 1-6 (1831)

Last sentence: "My own spirits were high, and I bounded along with feelings of unbridled joy and hilarity."

mrssherlock · « **Reply #78 on:** June 29, 2010, 05:38:16 PM »

I got my book and it doesn't correspond to either of the two you referenced so I'll read mine and follow online with the Gutenberg version.

http://tinyurl.com/37nlno7

mrssherlock · « **Reply #79 on:** June 29, 2010, 05:42:09 PM »

PS: The link above is for the Random House PB; Alibris had the Bodleian Library HB, the one I got.

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Author Topic: Frankenstein by Mary Shelley ~ July Book Club Online PREDISCUSSION (Read 24680 times)