Novel Bookstore, A. by Laurence Cossé

[Frybabe]

Welcome to our July Discussion of

A Novel Bookstore by Laurence Cossé

What is a good novel? A classic, a book that was a landmark, a difficult book? We have all read books that include all the basics for a 'good' novel however, it became a novel without genius. Will ‘A Novel Bookstore’ move us toward a definition? A Utopian Paris bookstore, without the constraints of market realities and financial constraints, triggers jealousies and threats in Cossé's self-described, elegantly written novel. Ivan "Van" Georg and Francesca Aldo-Valbelli, the heroes, establish ‘The Good Novel’, a bookshop that will stock only, well written French fiction. A secret committee of eight French writers is conscripted to submit annual lists of titles that become the bookstore’s inventory. We, the readers are immediately thrust in the middle of solving secret attacks on the lives of three committee members. As the story continues, we join the friends of the ‘The Good Novel’ to also track down who is behind the attempts to de-rail the success of the bookstore that is protecting artistic excellence from being submerged by mediocrity.

Links are underlined.
Lunchtime Literary Conversations: with Laurence Cossé and author Hervé Le Tellier, moderated by Rakesh Satyal
In French, with great photos illustrating her books… Laurence Cossé dans La Grande Librairie du 12 février 2009
Quotes by Laurence Cossé

Week 1: Part 1 and Part 2 through Chapter 14 (about 102 pages)
Week 2: Part 2 from Chapter 15 to the end (about 97 pages)
Week 3: Part 3 (about 123 pages)
Week 4: Part 4 (about 86 pages)

Discussion Leaders BarbStAubrey and Marcie

DISCUSSION QUESTIONS FOR WEEK 4 - PART 4

• We learn something about the writing process, and what constitutes a good novel, through discovering more about the committee members, especially the members who were attacked. What made an impression on you?

• What are some of the cynical aspects of the book publishing and book selling businesses that we learn about through the investigation of possible culprits? Have you experienced any negative aspects in your pursuit of books?

• What do we learn about Francesca? Is her situation, reactions and how she "took her leave" a reflection of novels you've read or heard about?

• What parallels are there in the relationships between Van and Anis and Van and Francesca?

• How do Van and Anis change after Francesca "takes her leave" and they read Francesca's notes?

• What are your thoughts as  you finish reading the book?

DISCUSSION QUESTIONS FOR WEEK 3 - PART 3

• How do the various settings – forest, hillside trail, mountain ski resort, Paris, hospitals, police station, a seventeenth-century building add mood, tone and meaning to the text?

• What recurring patterns, images/symbols, images, metaphors, similes, have you noticed and Why – What is their purpose – How do they develop or impact the characters?

• What clues made you suspect those behind the denigration of Francesco and Van

• How do the attacks on the values inherit in the book store remind you of other literary and scientific attacks

DISCUSSION QUESTIONS FOR WEEK 2

• In this section (middle to end of Part 2) we learn something about the personal lives of Van and Francesca. What impressions are you forming of them? What does the Bookstore mean to them?

• What do you make of Anis?

• What are your impressions of the 8 members of the committee?

• What are your thoughts about the importance of literature that Francesca learned from her grandfather?
  "Literature is a source of pleasure, he said, it is one of the rare inexhaustible joys in life, but it's not only that. It must not be disassociated from reality. Everything is there. That is why I never use the word fiction. Every subtlety in life is material for a book. He insisted on the fact. Have you noticed, he'd say, that I'm talking about novels? Novels don't contain only exceptional situations, life or death choices, or major ordeals; there are also everyday difficulties, temptations, ordinary disappointments; and, in response, every human attitude, every type of behavior, from the finest to the most wretched. There are books where, as you read, you wonder: What would I have done? It's a question you have to ask yourself. Listen carefully: it is a way to learn to live. There are grown-ups who would say no, that literature is not life, that novels teach you nothing. They are wrong. Literature performs, instructs, it prepares you for life."

• Are there books that are mentioned in this section that you are thinking about reading?

DISCUSSION QUESTIONS FOR WEEK 1

• Who is telling the story?
• How many stories within stories have you noticed?  What books have you read that use a narrative embedded in the story, often told by a character in the story? This is sometimes called a Metadiegetic Narrative (a back story).

• On page 23 Marcellin heard Paul deliriously mutter “Mina green and pink.” When he spoke of it to Madame Huon, she assumed Paul “was referring to one of his visitors and the color of her eye shadow or her lingerie.” What was Paul referencing, and why is it important?

• Several of the names that are sprinkled in chapter 4 are names known to the French. Who among the names is a well-known skier and whose Sur name is a famous cookie even sold here in the US?
• What causes a chuckle reading the Doctor and Suzon attacking the beaufort? What is beaufort?
• What is the history of the name Montbrun?

• Suzon says Paul is a very cultured man who goes by the name Néant. In French Néant means ‘nothing - void’ which could describe what he lives on but more, how does his name link the concept of void to: ~ Charles Baudelaire ~ Alexandre Grothendieck, mathematician ~ a Cabaret  ~ Phantasmagoria

• What book have you read that was so powerful when you finished reading you realized you never read anything like it? What about the book you read was outstanding? Was it the use of language, the unforgettable characters who spoke to you in a new way, a theme that reached beyond your imagination?

• Why does Armel write checks to Maritime Rescue or Handicap International?
• Van speaks highly of Armel as a storyteller. What is the difference between a storyteller and a stylist?
• What are the various meanings for Paul’s pseudonym, Brother Brandy?
• What motivates, scares, upsets Anne-Marie?

Sorry to hear that you must drop out for a while, Sheila. Take care of your eyesight.

[BarbStAubrey]

Shelia sorry you cannot join us but we understand - hope the surgery makes a difference for you - I had one eye done that was so iffy because of pseudoexfoliation but it was successfully done with only the one surgery and it did not take me any 6 weeks as they predict for healing - I was off all drops in 5 weeks and flying to my daughter's for Christmas exactly 6 weeks after the surgery - it really is as they all say one of the easiest - so good luck and smile - you will see distance like a kid again - now it will not fix astigmatism nor close up so glasses may still be your lot in life.

This book almost reads like a mystery except we have no 'body' but it sure is keeping us on the edge of our seat as we read. If you have the book keep it in your pile you will enjoy it when you can see better.

[marcie]

I too am sorry you can't join us, Sheila. I hope that all goes well and that you're able to read again soon.

[BarbStAubrey]

Some links that tie Néant (Nothingness - Void) to French culture -

Scroll a bit for the English A Taste for Nothingness - Charles Baudelaire's Fleurs du mal / Flowers of Evil

Photos on YouTube of Cabaret du Néant dedicated to death.

The Victorian theatrical affect The Ghost in the Theatre: Pepper's Ghost effect

Another YouTube - this time Victorian Phantasmagoria

This is a PDF As If Summoned from the Void: The Life of Alexandre Grothendieck (Mathematician and Holocaust survivor)

[Mippy]

Sheila ~  Good luck with your eyes!  I too am having vision problems.
I've been lurking here ... sorry DLs ... and have not yet purchased this book.

[BarbStAubrey]

Glad you stopped in Mippy - wouldn't you like to join us - the meat of the story starts next week and for two full weeks we read about the bookstore in Paris - the final week is a the week the mysteries are unveiled - we are holding off with anticipation that we enjoying building as we read - gives it a delicious flavor to the read like the mouth watering anticipation of a good 4 course meal.
Here are just a couple of links to a few of the many villager's names

Suzon last name is Petitbeurre

Doctor Parfait 'Clair' maybe as in - Au 'clair' de la lune?

beaufort

Madame Huon whose grocery was right next to the Café-restaurant.

Alfred Deneriaz carried Néon home.

Steve Perrault the lumberjack who helped carry Néon home.

Marcellin Prot, Alfred's father-in-law who helped carry Néon home, who stayed by his bed sleeping in the arm chair and heard him mutter, Mina green and pink

Vera Polonowska, the haughty blonde nurse - France and Poland have had a special historical relationship with a great migration of Poles to France in the mid nineteenth century. France and Poland

Alain N'Guyen, the ambulance driver - French film-maker Francois Truffaut's makeup artist spells her name "Thi Loan N'guyen"? That is, with an apostrophe between the "N" and the "g", as if there was a click in there.

Arthur Montbrun

Nicos Hariri our author includes how closely the name Nicos is to the name 'Nicolas' Sarkozy which suggested to me there were other reflections in the names.

Colonel de Billepint is one letter away from Villepint Prime Minister of France 2005-2007

Ouest-France

Ballon d'Alsace

Armel as in St.Armel and then his last name with all the math in the book could be a nod to this famous mathematician  Le Gall

There really is a Noëlle Revaz - Home Page for Noëlle Revaz as there are other authors mentioned in the book however, that is for another post.

[marcie]

Mippy, I'm glad you've been following the discussion. I'm sorry about your vision problems. I hope you'll join us as you can, even if you don't find the book in your library or bookstore.

[marcie]

Thank you for those names, places and informative links, Barbara.

At the end of the section we've been reading (Part 2, Chapter 14), the narrator says, after the section when Van and Francesca have decided on the number of books each committee member must recommend, "Long afterwards, when Van related these discussions to me, they seemed technical and austere. Van assured me of the contrary. He hd recalled extraordinary moments. Time flew by with the quickness of thought, their project was coming to light, and its credibility was at stake."

I've been wondering who the narrator is and how he or she knows all of the details provided in the book. Now we find out that at least Van has confided in the narrator. I'm not sure yet what I think this mysterious narrator adds to the book in place of a more traditional omniscient narrator.

This section of Chapter 14 provides quite a list of French authors whom Van and Francesca consider great novelists. I haven't heard of many, if not most, of them.

[marjifay]

I really give you moderators credit for the great job you're doing to try to stimulate enthusiasm for,  IMO,  such a dull book.

Chapter 10 has the most absurd, stilted conversation between Van and Francesca.  She says to him, "Do you understand that I no longer view you as an associate?" (Meaning, I guess that she has the hots for him.)  And then asks him not to tell anyone about her effusiveness.  That's effusive?? LOL  I would have expected him to reply, "Duh?" or "Say what?"

And the boring bit in Chapter 7 about the life of Stendahl.  Who cares?  The only books I recognize so far are those by Cormac McCarthy.  Am bored by all the French authors they talk about.  Ho hum.

And what's all that big deal about finding the exact section of the police department to help them with the attackers.  Just go in and ask the d..n police sergeant to let them talk to someone about their friends who have been attacked.  And why have they waited so long to do this?

When they finally find the perfect detective, they ask if he can give them an hour or two (!!).  Then they proceed with a long boring account of how they met and got the bookstore going.  And educate the man about the difference betwen a book and a novel!  This started in Chapter 12.  I just finished Chapter 14 and they are still running on and on about it and haven't yet gotten to the reason they went there in the first place.  It's a wonder the detective didn't fall asleep like I almost did.

This is the kind of stuff that makes me want to throw a book (I call this a book, not a novel) against the wall.  Can't do that because it's a library book, but I can return it which I will do.  

Pardon my rant.
Marj

[JoanP]

Marjifay - I don't recognize most of these French authors either - and I was a French major way back when!  I guess we have to remember that the author was French, wrote this book in French - and we're reading a translation.  It stands to reason that  most of the titles she's writing about are French then.

Van and Francesca talk about authors (besides Cormac McCarthy) that we can recognize.  Proust and Balzac for example.  Several times it has been suggested that we discuss one of their works here - or back in SeniorNet.  I wonder if there is still interest in these two titles?

I agree with you -  about Hefner.  It did seem a bit odd the way he came to be on the case, and agreed to give  so much of his time to it.   I can see it was important that they find someone who would be sympathetic to the need for privacy when they explain the nature of the book store and the reasons they think the three had been assaulted.  Otherwise, there is nothing to connect the attacks and no leads to give to the police.

Isn't it odd that Van at age 42 has no one in his life - no past, no family, no wife, no girlfriends?  And he becomes smitten with the very young university student?  who likes to read.  Francesca must have thought so too- she tells him that "  he came across as a born loser."

There's a lot that ought to be made clear in the coming chapters.  If the author can accomplish this, she's got a "novel" on her hands...

[marcie]

LOL, Marj, about wanting to throw the book (but not doing so because it's a library copy)  

It's definitely a slow, deliberate book. I had forgotten by Chapter 15, which is the section we're going to start this weekend (for Week 2), that the police detective was there and that the events were being told to him by Francesca and Van. I was sort of startled to see Heffner's name when Van was talking about the comic book author "B."  Van says: "Let's call him B. ... Everybody knows him." The next line says "Heffner's expression told them that he didn't know him." I had to look back to see what the heck Heffner was doing there. I thought I had skipped some pages!

Everything that Van and Francesca have done together so far is very planned and deliberate and we only seem to find out things as they are told to someone else or, perhaps, reflected in a book that is mentioned. My challenge is to find out more about some of those books and, as JoanP says, maybe we'll be inspired to read some of them together.

[BarbStAubrey]

Sounds to me like we have among us on Senior Learn the two kinds of readers that Van speaks about in chapter nine when he describes Armel as a wonderful storyteller that he wanted on the committee to balance the stylists, even stylists as powerful as Paul or as refined as Sarah Gestelents.

I could not find an author by the name of Sarah Gestelents but this is the difference (storyteller versus stylist) that seems to be to be matching the quote from Mina in Stendhal's Mina de Vanghel and his later book Le Rose et le Vert. We included those quotes earlier about German frankness and French Irony with little phrases required by French elegance.

Marj I am thinking you prefer to read a book that is telling a story rather then a book explaining characters, motive and feelings using allusions to books you have not read.  It also sounds like you do not like an author who plays a cat and mouse game of including characters   who use time wasting phrases - it is true that most of the books we have read in recent years on Senor Learn are written by storytellers with German frankness so The Novel Bookstore does not offer us what we have been used to discussing.

Your book throwing sounds like since you cannot change what the author has written to what makes you comfortable you can at least throw the book    

Hope you stay with it and give this stylized story a chance - it sounds like it is a different experience for you - just as Van was aware that he needed among his list making committee authors who were both storytellers and stylists we can use the comments of someone who is more comfortable with an author who is a storyteller.

In the mean time - really you can't Marj - you just can't - pleeeaassee - don't rain on my parade - I love this book - I really do - but - it is great that we disagree - that is what these discussions were all about - to get each other's opinion while respecting each other and we each acknowledge that we do all have different life experiences that we bring to a book and we have different tastes - we can have both views here and we will have viewpoints galore from every angle. Wheeee...

[marjifay]

Thanks for not jumping all over me for panning the book, people.  I just get moods sometimes.

I wonder how many of the French books mentioned have been translated into English.  If you find one that sounds good, pease let us know.

Actually, before I got sidetracked with Novel Bookstore, I was reading an interesting book by a French author:  MANON LESCAUT by Abbe Prevost, first published in 1753 but easy to read in the modern translation.  The Amazon review, says "'The sweetness of her glance, or rather my evil star already in its ascendant and drawing me to my ruin, did not allow me to hesitate for a moment.'  So begins the story of Manon Lescaut, a tale of passion and betrayal, of delinquency and misalliance, which moves from early eighteenth-century Paris--with its theatres, assemblies, and gaming-houses-via prison and deportation to a tragic denouement in the treeless wastes of Louisiana. It is one of the great love stories, and also one of the most enigmatic: how reliable a witness is Des Grieux, Manon's lover, whose tale he narrates? " (182 pages)

I wouldn't mind reading Proust.  I own, but haven't read yet, Remembrance of Things Past.  Also have Alain de Botton's How Proust Can Change Your Life.  (I really should get started on that because at my age I don't have much time to change my life. LOL)

Marj

[BarbStAubrey]

owww Marj you have a copy of Alain de Botton's. How Proust Can Change Your Life. I just ordered it from Amazon last week for the same reason you had the reaction to The Novel Bookstore - I tried Proust and oh oh oh - it was so slow moving and I was not comfortable with his spending so much time with his 'ladies' - but reading this book I realize there was a phrase that indicated Proust was about the details of life - forgot what page but it hit me that maybe I needed to look again at Proust and then when I saw Alain de Botton's book I thought that is it - read that first and then I can read Proust from a different prospective.

ah Manon Lescaut - I only know the Opera - I have never read the book... what a story and what music it inspired.

You are right some of the books mentioned are not translated and some of the authors have nothing translated into English - that is when you want to sell everything and move to France for a year - because at our age I am convinced it is the only way to learn the language - to be completely inundated with no choice to even hear English. And then all these wonders written in French would be on our reading pile.

With all the interest here of late and connecting how much French influence there is in our nation it opens a window to us and who knows maybe we will tackle a few of these authors - it would be an experience that reading as a group would get more from our read since it is so much easier reading with a group than tackling some of these authors on our own.

[Frybabe]

I think we discussed a Proust (short story?) a while back. I did get bored with that. As for this book, I have been reading ahead because I also have a library book that must be returned soon. I can only read a short paragraph or two at at time. I don't find it boring, but it is something I can only read a little of at a time without getting "antzy" to do or read something else.

I started a list of books listed and am through Chapter 19 with that. I don't think I am going to list them all here. A cursory check of some of the books leads me to believe that we haven't heard of may of the books and authors because they have not been translated into English. Some authors have only had a few of their books translated.

As for the committee members, I did not check all the names, but the three that I did, I could not find anywhere except in the novel.

This is getting a little ahead, but the story of Gendarme Bailly and the street named in his honor is real.  http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rue_de_l%27Agent-Bailly  It is only one city block long. http://my.qoop.com/store/Michele-Attilio-ZAMPOLLO-336972449184511/Rue-de-l-Agent-Bailly---Paris-by-Michele-Attilio-ZAMPOLLO-qpps_667889257073701/

[kidsal]

I made a list of the novels on the Novel Bookstore website and ordered a few used copies.  Am reading The Sea by John Banville.  Enjoying it very much but am on page 93 and have a list of over 20 words I have had to look up.  It is the story of a man whose wife died and he has returned to the seaside town where he grew up.  Story moves back and forth from his life with wife and his life as a child.

[marjifay]

Barb said, "that is when you want to sell everything and move to France for a year -"  

One of the favorite places I visited was a trip with a couple of friends to France.  We rented a condo in Southern France --  Aix in Provence.  We rented a car and drove all over.  Wonderful time, and the people in Southern France are so nice, much nicer than in Paris.

Speaking of books about France, I just finished one of the best books I've read this year -- Agincourt by Bernard Cornwell, about a famous battle the English under young Henry V fought against France in 1415.  It's the story of a young English forester who signs on with Henry's army as an archer.  Magnificent story telling of the 6,000 Englishmen confronting 30,000 French soldiers.  Henry believed God was on his side and that France should be his.  (It has some of the most creative cursing I've ever heard--some very funny.) A great read.  Now I will have to read Shakespeare's Henry V.

Marj

[Frybabe]

Oops!

I can only read a short paragraph or two at at time.

I meant a short chapter or two.


Marj, Have you read "Ysabel" by GuyGavriel Kay? It is set in Aix en Provence. I printed out several maps of the area and followed the action. I also looked at online photos of the area and Saint-Sauveur Cathedral which places a central role especially at the beginning of the book.

[BarbStAubrey]

Frybabe thanks - great links - did you see the YouTube link of the studio apartment available for rent? I don't know - after seeing how behind all those imposing doors we see on the street are these delightful courtyards but the apartment - oh dear - it was clean and had everything a body needs to maintain itself under one roof but the charm I am imagining is just not there. and looking closely it appears the wall board that we are used to seeing for painted walls is a new addition - behind is stone masonry - you can see it close to the ceiling and in a few spots - those buildings are made of rough stone - no wonder they are still standing 100s of years after they were built.

this studio apartment may be not much different than the space Van rents and later Annis finds her one room apartment.
Studio Apartment on Rue de l'Agnet Bailly

Library book or not this book seems to call out to read on - in some ways it is a page turner and it is the mystery of what is going to happen next as the description of getting the bookstore up and running and then who is behind all the attacks first on three from the committee and then the onslaught against the store. But you are so right - no skimming is there - we have to slow down and read - that is when I realize I have not been reading enough serious literature - I am convinced it takes practice just like practicing the piano in order to read some literature. Do you have any favorite list makers of 'books we should read' - the ones that come to mind are 'The Harvard Bookshelf' and a professor Harold Bloom - but there are others.

Kidsal I am almost sure the author of  The Sea is an English author - seems to me he is a Booker prize winner -  it sounds like you are deep into the story - its been on my pile for over a year but my pile keeps growing in spite of all the reading - Don't you love it when you have to have a dictionary by your side in order to read a book. Another site that is great to get a flavor of a word is this online thesaurus - it costs $19 a year but the way they show the connecting words is wonderful - try it - I believe you can use it one time without paying    http://www.visualthesaurus.com/

Ah Marj so you were in Aix driving around the Provence - by any chance did you visit where the Souleiado fabric by Charles Démery is printed with all those blocks smuggled in from India by Gypsies and where he has an old Gypsy caravan in front - it is located up north west for Aix in Tarascon - I bet you stocked up though on Calissons - I never did get to see the Lavender fields - did you get over that way?

All those battles - I remember vaguely Agincourt - a couple of months ago I read The Winter Sea that went back and forth between today and the sixteenth century in Scotland and again France was where Bonnie Charles was holing up with the story of how he tried to come back and recapture Scotland.Those books written around a war can be exciting can't they - very different then this book which in comparison is almost drawing room in style with allusions to other authors and carefully worded sentences -

Have you ever listened to a meeting held in France on YouTube - much time is spent on non-issue dialog that to me seems unrelated to the topic at hand. - after reading this book and researching what elegant writing is all about I can understand it is all about elegance - the look is as or more important than the content. Now that would be an expression of an art form wouldn't it. There is art that gives a message but most of it is to create something beautiful.

Golly so much to learn and only now to be introduced to a whole line of thinking and speaking and reading and writing - I wish I could start over - no - I really don't - I wouldn't want to be 20 again although 30 was fulfilling but I would take 60 of course assuming I know what I know now - .  

[Frybabe]

Barb, interesting tour. I had looked at a few stills, but didn't see this. Nice little courtyard. Looks like a student flat except that I didn't notice a bunch of books and papers around. Rue de L'Agent Bailly is several blocks away from Lycee  & College Jaques-Decour. A little farther away is a hospital and the College et Ecole Saint Vincent de Paul. I imagine, like New York or London, rents in Paris are so high that many people can only afford what seems more like a large walk in closet.

[BarbStAubrey]

a large walk in closet.

 

[marcie]

Kidsal, thanks for that information about The Sea by John Banville. It's great that you're already so far into it. Are they French words that you are looking up?

Frybabe, it's fun to know that Gendarme Bailly was an actual person. I thought those letters between Van and Anis were fascinating.

We've add some questions in the heading that we might want to consider during our discussion of the middle to the end of Part 2 for week 2.

[Frybabe]

What causes a chuckle reading the Doctor and Suzon attacking the beaufort? What is beaufort?

I've never eaten Beaufort, but I have had Gruyere, which I heard it resembles.   The description of the Beaufort does not sound anything close to Gruyere I ate.  I stopped eating Gruyere because it was tasting a bit "soapy" to me.

 http://www.cheese-france.com/cheese/beaufort.htm


Several of the names that are sprinkled in chapter 4 are names known to the French. Who among the names is a well-known skier and whose Sur name is a famous cookie even sold here in the US?

I'm going to have to go back to Chapter 4 and cruise the names. The only French skier I remember, for I have not followed the sport for quite some time, is Jean-Claude Killy.

[Frybabe]

You to can own a castle. Montbrun for sale. http://www.castle-forsale.com/ Lovely looking place. Here are some interiors and diagrams. http://www.carneycastle.com/Montbrun/index.htm

Here is an interesting short biography of General Louis-Pierre Montbrun. http://www.virtualarc.com/officers/montbrun/

[BarbStAubrey]

Frybabe - wow - not sure I would ever want to live in a castle even if I had all the money that could be imagined, I do not see living a life where a castle is homebase - leave all that for folks like Brad and Angelina but what a treat to see the photos you found.

Also, the quiet humor of this author is in that scene - Suzon's last name is the famous petits-beurres (cookie) and the Doc's first name is Parfait and so we have two desserts going after the Beaufort or three evidences of food - it is the kind of recognition and acknowledgment that gets a small inward smile.

Thanks marcie for moving us along - I am so ready to get into the remaining pages of Part 2 and find out a bit more about Van and Francesca.

Kidsal do you see the Banville book as a good one for us to consider as a discussion?

[Frybabe]

I don't know the cookie, but I did note the Doctor's name. I thought it unusual for a first name at least and not a little effeminate.

[BarbStAubrey]

Well not only is Plain Tales from the Hills online for us to read at our convenience but this site allows us to downloand the book one chapter at a time - Librivox - Plain Tales from the Hills - by Kipling

[Frybabe]

Here is a map of the area in Paris where a lot of the action takes place. The rue Dupytren is marked with the red balloon. Notice to the left are the rue de l'Odeon and rue de Conde (where Francesca lives). Notice the proximity to the Sorbonne, and if you look to the right, near the river, you will see Shakespeare & Company marked.

http://maps.google.com/maps?client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=s&hl=en&q=rue+Dupuytren+Paris+France&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x47e671dea40453d3:0x66b3a35c097cd48b,Rue+Dupuytren,+75006+Paris,+France&gl=us&ei=i-kaToSUMNHegQeIjYGKBQ&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=image&resnum=1&ved=0CBkQ8gEwAA



I will have to take the book back to the library today. I am hoping, Barb, that your question in the header jog my memory enough to sound semi-intelligent for the remains of the book.

[marcie]

Thank you for the link to Kipling, Barbara, and the map of Paris, Frybabe. It's amazing how the Internet allows us to delve more deeply into the details of a book.

[Frybabe]

Are there books that are mentioned in this section that you are thinking about reading?

Not unsurprisingly given my interest in the area and era, Kipling's Plain Tales from the Hills. Not Pierre Michon's Small Lives that was mentioned, but his Masters and Servants. There was one that I was interested in, but since it isn't translated into English I promptly forgot the author and book title. I already read The DaVinci Code and have the first Harry Potter book in both English and Latin. It was my intention, eventually, to try to read it in Latin using the English to help translation when needed.


What do you make of Anis?

A puzzlement. She seems fiercely independent and secretive. Needs lots of space. Maybe a bit flighty? At some point (I am not sure it started in Part 2) I entertained the notion that she might actually be a prostitute and was trying to hide the fact from Ivan.

[BarbStAubrey]

hmmm interesting how we read people differently - my thought on Annis was the opposite - she has all the signs of an incest survivor - but then since 80% of all prostitutes are incest survivors either would fit wouldn't it.

Well lets hope we can ask the questions to keep the story going - although, to me from here on in the book it is more storytelling done granted with elegance.

And I have to echo marcie - great map - thanks

Did the last page of your copy include a URL to The Good Novel - I only read in a review that The Good Novel is part of the story so to speak in that the bookstore does not actually exist however, the site does offer is a long list of 'good' novels written in English - some were translated and some were written by an English speaking author. Partial list of good novels available at The Good Novel.

[Frybabe]

The really weird thing is, Barb, that I thought that since the book came out several real life bookstores have opened or will be opening, including one in Houston, under it's moniker. I took the online newsletter a little to seriously I guess.

Since the online newsletter has a list of good novels, I took another look. Pierre Michon's Masters and Servants is on it as are Joseph Conrad's works. Conrad is an author I also intend on reading sometime in the future. I am still working my way through and immense piles of books I bought, plus the seven pages of books downloaded to my Kindle.  I should live so long.

As for Anis, I hadn't thought about sexual abuse, but you are right. It fits.

[marcie]

I, too, was wondering if Anis was sexually abused. Whatever its basis, her need to keep Van at a distance seems to me to be changing his self-professed pattern of flight whenever a relationship gets too close or a partner demanding more. Anis isn't asking him to make a commitment but he seems to be very faithful to her and wanting more out of their relationship. Maybe he will improve.

Thanks for those lists. I noticed a lot of Conrad's work. I think I've only read one or two and wasn't captivated by them. It could be I was too young. I'll try again.

[BarbStAubrey]

Nabokov wrote Lolita

The Horseman on the Roof was a movie in 1995  (Le hussard sur le toit)

La princesse de Clèves published anonymously in March 1678. It is regarded by many as the beginning of the modern tradition of the psychological novel. The author is thought to be Madame de La Fayette.

I couldn't find a novel L'Eclair but I did find it is an Opera and here is the libretto which could be the story that fits L’Éclair Libretto by Planard & St. Georges

Alexander Vialatte, author of hundreds of articles published in The Mountain and the spectacle of the world, he was more than a regional journalist. He is the translator in France of Franz Kafka The Trial, 1933 and other German writers. He was a writer himself.

La Duchesse de Langeais is an 1834 novel by French author Honoré de Balzac

From 1895 to 1899 Proust wrote Jean Santeuil, an autobiographical novel.

[JoanP]

We're back from NC - on Wednesday, I'm off to Kansas City (think heat, think 104 degrees!) - and then will be back to normal, I think/hope.  Am desparately trying to catch up to you all...40 pages to go.  

Just finished reading about Francesca's grandfather and his words of wisdom to his grand daughter - I too was inspired when he  told her there were "not so many brilliant books in the end."  I want to read them - the brilliant ones!  I'm serious.  I feel I'm running out of time - and am reading too many not so brilliant ones.  I'd love to get some of the brilliant ones up on the slate of nominations for fall reading.  Do you think our readers would go for that - if the selection was only from a list of  really "good novels"?  Thanks for the link to Partial list of good novels available at The Good Novel, Barbara.

I have to keep reminding myself that the titles mentioned here are not the results of lists compiled by a committee of writers -
Where do you think they came from?  The author's own preferences?

 This is an awfully good list.  Can you spot any titles for group discussion?  Let's us be a committee!

Looking forward to hearing what you think of Van and his attraction to Francesca - and Van and his attraction to Anis... I've some thoughts for the morning...

[marcie]

Good idea, JoanP, to look in this book for good novels to nominate. Would it be dangerous to be on a Committee to suggest good novels? (just kidding) But I can see how, in some situations, expressing one's opinion that one wants to read only good novels, might be seen as threatening (condescending?) to another person's taste.

[BarbStAubrey]

A couple of lists for ideas of good books in English - Remember the TV series - A young single mom, Lorelai Gilmore from Stars Hollow whose parents are very upper middle class and Lorelai's daughter is Rory Gilmore who ends up going to Yale as did her Grandfather - Rory is a reader and has brains - well on Amazon there is the Rory Gilmore book list A few of the titles on her list we have read either here or on the old SeniorNet site.Included are two lists - one, classic twentieth, nineteenth century titles that every 'bookworm' should read and another, is a contemporary list.

Then Harold Bloom. professor of Humanities at Yale has a wonderful book that would support the way to determine if a book is a 'good book; How to Read and Why

And then the famous Harvard Five Foot Bookshelf This list is from Gutenberg with links to the many books on the famous list that are free to download from Gutenberg.

In the older collection there is an Intro by President Eliot, Harvard's president in 1869,  that says;

“In my opinion, a five-foot shelf would hold books enough to give a liberal education to any one who would read them with devotion, even if he could spare but fifteen minutes a day for reading.” With this very definitely in mind, we have prepared a daily reading guide in which the assignments chosen appropriately enough, will take the usual person about fifteen minutes to read with leisurely enjoyment. These selections assigned for each day in the year as you will see, are introduced by comments on the author, the subjects or the chief characters. They will serve to introduce you in the most pleasant manner possible to the Harvard Classics. They will enable you to browse enjoyably among the world’s immortal writings with entertainment and stimulation in endless variety.

Form this Pleasant and Exhilarating Habit To take a few minutes out of your busy day to commune with these great writers of all time is one of the finest habits possible. That fifteen minutes will carry you on wings of romance and adventure to other lands, to the scenes of other days and will break the monotony of your days, will change the course of your thinking, will give you the privilege of contact with the great minds whose writings have stimulated and inspired mankind over the centuries.

.

[BarbStAubrey]

From Rory Gilmore's list of classics there are very few i have not read - but these are on my to read list that I would look forward to tackling in a group

• Cousin Bette by Honore De Balzac
• Flowers for Algernon by Daniel Keye
• Time and Again by Jack Finney
• Heart of Darkness by Joseph Conrad
• Galapagos by Kurt Vonnegut
• The Master and Margarita by Mikhail Bulgakov
• On The Road by Jack Kerouac
• A Confederacy of Dunces by John Kennedy Toole

  And from the Harvard Five Foot Bookshelf I have not read and would like to - another Balzac

• Father Goriot by Honoré de Balzac

  And then a whole slew of titles from The Good Novel website that I would love to read.

• Ivo Andric  -- The Bridge on the Drina  
• Robert Antelme  -- L’Espèce Humaine
• Louis Aragon  -- Le Paysan de Paris  -- Les Cloches de Bâle  
• John Banville  -- The Sea
• Samuel Beckett  -- Molloy
• Georges Bernanos  -- Diary of a Country Priest  -- Mouchette
• Mikhail Bulgakov  -- The Master and Margarita
• Italo Calvino  -- The Baron in the Trees
• Albert Camus  -- The Stranger
• Céline  -- Journey to the End of the Night
• Jean Cocteau  -- Les Enfants Terribles
• Joseph Conrad  -- Under Western Eyes  -- The Nature of a Crime  -- The Rover
• Jean Giono  -- Two Riders on the Storm
• Claude Lévi-Strauss  -- A World on the Wane
• André Malraux  -- Paper Moons
• Pierre Michon  -- Small Lives
• Jean Rhys  -- Wide Sargasso Sea
• Emile Zola  -- Germinal  -- Thérèse Raquin

[JoanP]

From that list, the Conrad novel, Heart of Darkness jumps out at me - and the Balzac - Pere Goriot.  Barbara, do you know where the list of "good novels" on the  website came from?  Do posters add books they think should be included, or are they from the author's own list?


 "But I can see how, in some situations, expressing one's opinion that one wants to read only good novels, might be seen as threatening (condescending?) to another person's taste."
Marcie, that's such a good point - and a warning too.  Our posters who vote for upcoming discussions might not like it if their only choices are from our list of "good novels."   At least we can put up a few titles on the list of nominations to test the waters for interest.  We've already got a good suggestion to start the list -
The Leopard by Guiseppe Tomasi di Lampedusa.

I'm almost caught up with you all - and trying to figure Anis.   I'm also trying to figure out who the narrator might be.  Clearly someone familiar with the secret workings of the bookstore.  At first I thought it must be Anis - but then the narrator comments about the scene between Van and Anis in Grenoble and says:

"How do I know these details?  Van often related the episode to me."

It just occurs to me that the narrator keeps changing?  Who do you see as the narrator?  Maybe I'm missing something?  Also I'm noticing that sometimes Ivan is referred to as Van - but not always.  Does that indicate a change in narrator, do you think?

[JoanP]

I don't know that I see Anis a victim of incest or even abuse, except that she has been left alone as a child.  She has accomplished so much with so little - no wonder she hesitates to give up her studies and follow Van to Paris.  She is torn - and Van is trying so hard to get her to come with him.  We've just heard Van explain to Francesca how he likes to woo women and then run from them if they expect anything from him.  What does this mean for Anis if she gives in to him?

So many parallels, victims of abandonment - Anis, Francesca, her daughter and even the young girl who jumped in the river - the one Gaston Bailly tried to "save" -  Will Van turn into Gaston Bailly, Anis, the young woman Gaston tried to save??

In his letter to Anis, Van refers to Gaston Bailly and the "undine" of his life.  An ondine/undine in French is a wave.  In mythology, the Ondina is a water nymph.
Here's her story:

In a German tale known as Sleep of Ondine, Ondine is a water nymph. She was very beautiful and, like all nymphs, immortal. However, should she fall in love with a mortal man and bear his child, she would lose her immortality.

Ondine eventually falls in love with a handsome knight, Sir Lawrence, and they are married. When they exchange vows, Lawrence vows to forever love and be faithful to her. A year after their marriage, Ondine gives birth to his child. From that moment on she begins to age. As Ondine’s physical attractiveness diminishes, Lawrence loses interest in his wife.

One afternoon, Ondine is walking near the stables when she hears the familiar snoring of her husband. When she enters the stable, she sees Lawrence lying in the arms of another woman. Ondine points her finger at him, which he feels as if kicked, waking him up with surprise. Ondine curses him, stating, "You swore faithfulness to me with every waking breath, and I accepted your oath. So be it. As long as you are awake, you shall have your breath, but should you ever fall asleep, then that breath will be taken from you and you will die!"

Interesting, no?  An undine is also a changeling-