Author Topic: Dancing at the Rascal Fair by Ivan Doig August Book Club Online (Read 66211 times)

JoanP · « **Reply #40 on:** August 05, 2011, 10:14:52 PM »

The Book Club Online is the oldest book club on the Internet, begun in 1996, open to everyone. We offer cordial discussions of one book a month, 24/7 and enjoy the company of readers from all over the world. everyone is welcome to join in.

Dancing at the Rascal Fair by Ivan Doig

Dancing at the Rascal Fair is an authentic saga of the American experience at the turn of this century and a passionate, portrayal of the immigrants who dared to try new lives in the imposing Rocky Mountains.
Ivan Doig's supple tale of landseekers unfolds into a fateful contest of the heart between Anna Ramsay and Angus McCaskill, walled apart by their obligations as they and their stormy kith and kin vie to tame the brutal, beautiful Two Medicine country.
It is a story rich in detail, recounted in language that rings true, from the Scottish lilt of Lucas Barclay to the laconic speech of Stanley Meixell; above all, it is a story filled with “those word rainbows called poems.” (Barnes & Noble)

"Against this masterfully evoked backdrop. Mr. Doig addresses his real subject: love between friends, between the sexes, between the generations....His is a prose as tight as a new thread and as special as handmade candy....Dancing at the Rascal Fair races with real vigor and wit and passion." Lee K. Abbott ~ The New York Times Book Review

Discussion Schedule:

August 1 ~ 5 Scotland and Helena; Gros Ventre; Medicine Lodge (about 88 pages)
August 6 ~ 14 Scotch Heaven (about 111 pages)
August 15 ~ 21 The Steaders (about 75 pages)

*****

Some Topics for Consideration
August 6-13 Scotch Heaven

Scotch Heaven

1. "So many of the arrivees originated in the land of the kilt and the bagpipe." Who arrived in Gros Ventre first, Lucas Barclay or Ninean Duff?

2. "The land had been made into arithmetic." Had you any idea land was so carefully divided into a boustrophedon? Was this Greek pattern decided upon in Washington? What did Angus' Section #31 plot and Rob's #32 choice say about the personality of each of the boys?

3. Is raising sheep still a major enterprise in Montana? Why did Rob pressure Angus to borrow even more from Lucas to invest in more sheep? Where had Lucas made all his money?

4. Who do you think may have influenced the "school board" to hire Angus to be the new schoolmaster? Why did Angus accept? Do you think he was a wise choice?

5. What was Angus' response to Ninean Duff's pressure to take a more orthodox view in his teaching? What does this tell about Angus?

6. "Anna Ramsay, a glory of a woman" - Do you believe in love at first sight? What did you think of Anna?

7. What do we learn of the Blackfeet in Montana? How did Lewis and Clark affect the development of this area? Can you find the meaning of a medicine lodge ?

8. "Adair is not to be fretted about." What do you think of the determination of this young woman in this strange new land?

Related links:
1862 - the Pacific Railroad Act and the Homestead Act
Gros Ventre Indians in Montana
Ivan's Notes on his home page

Discussion Leaders: Babi & Joan P

JoanP · « **Reply #41 on:** August 05, 2011, 10:27:37 PM »

PatH - I agree - and it was BOTH of the boys who worked hard - not just Angus. Sometimes I think Rob is portrayed as a lesser character. Perhaps it's his confidence that makes him seem a bit cocky. But it's his confidence that keeps them going, even when plans and expectations are shattered.. His confidence is contagious. Thanks for reminding that it was Angus who thought about the possibility of homesteading, Callie. He gets the ideas, but thinks about them - and then waits for Rob to make decisions before making his own - have you noticed that?
Callie, there are a number of things here that remind me of Empire of the Summer Sun...such as the dishonest Indian Agent who pocketed the rations intended for the reservation in '83 that caused hundreds of the Blackfeet to starve to death - which is why Nancy ended up in Gros Ventre.

We're wondering how many of you have moved into the Scotch Heaven chapter? According to the schedule, we've been planning to go there in the morning. Ready to start? Some of you may not have finished. We could talk about the first half of it until everyone catches up. Let us know, okay? Don't want to be spoilers for anyone.

Babi · « **Reply #42 on:** August 06, 2011, 10:21:55 AM »

At last we meet Lucas Barclay. "...Lucas Barclay had that same burnish that glowed on Rob. The
face and force to go with it, for that matter. These Barclays were a family ensemble, they all
had a memorable glimmer." I think our Rob had a touch of that alluring attribute, 'charisma!'.
There is no question that he takes the lead in this adventure, and Angus follows him as he has
done all their lives. Which is not to say that he doesn't have a mind of his own and will take
the initiative when he sees the need for it. So what sort of young man is Angus McCaskill? Curious, wanting to know all rhere is to know. More schooling than Rob; more thoughtful. No fool.
Another glimmer into Rob Barclay. He is shocked that such a thing as Lucas suffered could
happen to a Barclay. Rob expects to be successful in all he does; he cannot imagine the world not conforming to his expectations. I suppose many young people starting in the world must feel like that.

JoanP · « **Reply #43 on:** August 06, 2011, 11:33:04 AM »

Callie, I'm thinking of you and Babi in Oklahoma and Texas - the draught, the heat! How are you holding up? Thoughts and prayers are with you and yours at a time like this!

Are you curious about the author's background to have produced this so authentic account of the homesteading and the Scottish settlers in this area of Montana? He was born in Montana - in the small town of White Sulpher Springs. Not sure how near that is to Gros Ventre - or Scotch Heaven...fictional towns, I imagine. Who knows, maybe this is the very town. Do you remember if the fictional Scotch Heaven was south of Helena - as White Sulpher Springs is said to be?

Like the Barclays, he had a Scottish great uncle - the "first of the family to come from Scotland to Montana." He writes in Ivan's Notes on his home page ~

"My own western existence has bordered the lives of the last homestead generation, the settlers who poured into Montana between 1900 and 1918 under the spell of the dream of making the state "the last and best grain garden of the world." My father was born in a log homestead cabin south of Helena in 190l. And now that I am deep-bearded, I've been told continually by older Montanans of my resemblance to my father's long-lived uncle, D.L. Doig, the first of the family to come from Scotland to Montana."

He adds the only pertinent information about himself in Ivan's Notes on his home page ~

" the red-headed only child, son of ranch hand Charlie Doig and ranch cook Berneta Ringer Doig (who died of her lifelong asthma on my sixth birthday), who in his junior year of high school (Valier, Montana; my class of 1957 had 21 members) made up his mind to be a writer of some kind."

Still wondering at the number of Scots living in this area - to the exclusion of almost everyone else. There was one family from MO as I recall. Was Ninean Duff living there in Scotch Heaven before Lucas Barclay arrived in Gros Ventre? I'd like to think that Lucas had something to do with directing Scottish family to the settlement.

maryz · « **Reply #44 on:** August 06, 2011, 11:49:13 AM »

I have always assumed his book were at least partially autobiographical.

CallieOK · « **Reply #45 on:** August 06, 2011, 12:51:12 PM »

This long stretch of temperatures over 100º is wearing on everyone - but friends and I agree we might not think we're as hot if the media didn't keep going on about it - and on and on and....ad infinitum!!!

Click here http://geology.com/cities-map/montana.shtml to see a map of Montana showing three towns mentioned in the book.: Choteau, Valier and Browning. Find Helena, the capital, and go north.
On today's highways/interstates, distances are: Helena to Choteau, 102 miles; Choteau to Valier, 56 miles; Valier to Browning, 43 miles.
I think Gros Ventre and Scotch Heaven are just west of Valier, where - on a detailed National Geographic map, you can see where a river forks to the north and south.

Edit: After I posted this opinion, I read Ivan's notes and found this autobiographical tid-bit: junior year of high school (Valier, Montana; "AhHa", she said gloatingly

BTW, it's 500+ miles across Montana from east to west. Just for fun - try measuring that distance from where you live and see where you end up. For a lot of you - east will be out in the ocean.
For Babi, north might be not far from my town.

PatH · « **Reply #46 on:** August 06, 2011, 04:55:32 PM »

Thanks for the detective work, Callie. That's pretty much where I was thinking too, but you got closer.

Babi · « **Reply #47 on:** August 07, 2011, 08:34:14 AM »

Thanks for those insights from Doig's home page, JOAN. They give considerably more personal
info. than the acknowledgments in the back of the book.
I wouldn't say the place was exclusive to Scots, though the name 'Scotch Heaven' certainly
takes a bow to their prevalence. That cattle ranch was there from early on, too. And of
course, the later homesteaders came from everywhere.

Thanks for clarifying the geography on this, CALLIE. I knew vaguely that Helena was in
the southern part of the State and so had an idea these places must be farther North. I
especially like your finding of a river that forks north and south; the perfect location
for our 'Gros Ventre' and Scotch Heaven. And you're quite right. From Houston in the
Southeast, 500 miles north or west won't even get you out of Texas.

I am so much enjoying Doig's bits of humor and original similes. Like, "Rob had hands quick enough to shoe a unicorn." And Doig's wry humor..
Rob: "When do you suppose spring comes to this country?" Angus: "Maybe by the end of summer."

JoanP · « **Reply #48 on:** August 07, 2011, 12:50:48 PM »

Callie, super detective work - junior year of high school (Valier, Montana)! And Thank you for the map. It really helps this geographically challenged Easterner. . I see Doig's birthplace, White Sulpher Springs - east of Helena - and the other towns mentioned in the book much more to the north. At the very start of the Scotch Heaven chapter, there's a quote from a newspaper article- The Choteau Quill, dated July 3, 1890:

" word comes of yet another settlement of homesteaders in this burgeoning province of ours...who can doubt that Choteau County is destined go be the most populous in Montana. Of this latest colony, situated into the foothills a dozen or so miles west of Gros Ventre... Gros Ventrians call the elevated new neighborhood Scotch Heaven."

Here's another closer up map of the area - I see Two Medicine Creek too. We stayed in Cut Bank on the way to Glacier National Forest. By the way, did you read of hiker who was mauled by a grizzly in Glacier National Park yesterday? He's alive - in a hospital in Browning this morning.

JoanP · « **Reply #49 on:** August 07, 2011, 01:04:54 PM »

I guess I'm amazed at the uniformity of the homesteaded townships in the West...all the same size, 36 sq. mi. - no matter how much surrounding land was open:

Quote

Each township is six miles square, thus totaling thirty-six square miles, and — attend closely for just a few moments more — it is these townships, wherein the individual homesteader takes up his landholding, that the American penchant for systemization fully flowers. Each square mile, called a section, is numbered, in identical fashion throughout all the townships, thusly:

This "township" method of dividing land according to the boustrophedon grid didn't originate with the Homestead Actbut rather the 1785 Land Ordinance that laid the foundations of land policy until passage of the Homestead Act in 1862. I find this all so fascinating.

Wasn't Angus just so smart to select Section #31? What did you think of Rob's choice? Here's a better picture of the location of the land he chose - some of you have this on the inside cover of your book if you are reading the paper copy, not kindle...

click illustration to enlarge

PatH · « **Reply #50 on:** August 07, 2011, 01:11:58 PM »

I'm always amazed when something reminds me how tiny the eastern states are compared with those west of the Mississippi. 100 miles from my home gets me all the seaboard states from South Carolina to the bottom tip of Maine. West, all of Ohio, a lot of Michigan and Indiana, and part of Kentucky and Tennessee.

One of the bits of humor I particularly liked occurs early in the book, when they are complaining about the ship's food:

"The potatoes aren't so bad, though."
"Man, potatoes are never so bad. That's the principle of potatoes."

CallieOK · « **Reply #51 on:** August 07, 2011, 02:08:07 PM »

PatH, when my husband was doing graduate work in Missouri there was a family there from eastern Pennsylvania. She asked if we were going home to central Colorado over a long weekend. When i said it would take a day and a half to get there and another day and a half to come back, she exclaimed, "But you only have to go across Kansas!!!"
They had come across 7 states to get to the Kansas City area from Pennsylvania!

Joan, where did you get your diagram of the sections? I've always seen the Section numbers as they are at the beginning of the "Scotch Heaven" chapter.

Click here to see the base lines from which surveys began in Montana. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/83/Meridians-baselines.png (Click on Montana to get a closer view)
Townships go North-South from this Base line; Ranges go East West.

Each section is divided into fourths (and each fourth into fourths, etc. - which makes it possible to identify very small tracts of land). So Angus' homestead is in the very bottom left hand corner of the grid shown in the chapter. Rob's is in the top right hand corner of the Section to the right of Angus'.

CallieOK · « **Reply #52 on:** August 07, 2011, 02:15:46 PM »

More about homestead surveying.

Stakes were placed in the corners of each 160 acre tract. One of them would have the legal description on it. In Oklahoma, the homesteader had to find the stake with the legal description and take it to a Filing Office to register the claim. Most homesteaders placed something on the tract to indicate they were claiming it.
I know that one woman who made the Land Run into the area where I live used an American flag. There's a "legend" that another woman who made the Run took off her red petticoat and put it on her claim stake! (Legend also has it that she rode in on the cowcatcher of a train that was moving very very slowly through the area, jumped off, ran over to stake her claim and ran back just in time to be pulled onto the caboose! So, not only did she display her petticoat in public - she "put on a show" for the other passengers - Shocking!!!!)

JoanP · « **Reply #53 on:** August 07, 2011, 05:17:46 PM »

Great stories, Callie! They help us realize these were real people, doing whatever it took to acquire some land..About the boustrophedon - I didn't even notice the difference between the one in Doig's book and the one from this site - the
1785 Land Ordinance
Was there a change in the numbering for the Homestead Act of 1962? If you can click the link, you can see another grid with sections numbered like in the book...

In both grids, Angus selected the bottom corner which was number 31. This was ideal for raising sheep or cattle.- The animals could wander outside his plot to graze. But look at Rob. He chose the highest, lofty plot - planning maybe to put in a reservoir for his band of sheep someday. Angus tells him:
"But we live in the meantime, rather than the sometime."

Everyone comments about the wind up there. I'm wondering if someday Rob will be seen to have made a wise choice...
Nothing is enough for Rob - can anyone remember why he wants to buy even more sheep - borrowing from Lucas? Angus seems to know when to say "no" -

CallieOK · « **Reply #54 on:** August 07, 2011, 07:21:44 PM »

Looks as if the number sequence pattern changed between 1785 and 1796.

The difference in choice of homesteads is another example of a cautious nature versus an impetuous one. Angus looks at practicalities more than Rob does.
However, Rob realizes that he has a clear route to grazing land up into the mountains, which is free range. Winter's coming, though.

Didn't you love Angus' tale of The Lucas Barclay Matrimonial Bureau? And the story of Methuselah and his cook?

PatH · « **Reply #55 on:** August 07, 2011, 10:01:37 PM »

Callie, I like your land rush stories. I hadn't heard of the stake system before. It's wonderfully sensible. If you've got the stake, you obviously got there before anyone else. I wonder if there were counterfeit stakes?

PatH · « **Reply #56 on:** August 07, 2011, 10:18:50 PM »

Now we seem to be settling down to talking about the story again, though I admit I'm reluctant to cut short this fascinating background stuff.

I heard another version of the Methuselah's cook story over 50 years ago, involving a bunch of male campers. Maybe the story is as old as Methuselah? It's still funny, though.

So Rob marries the first woman he sees who looks at him admiringly and reflects him back at himself. Lucas was right. Is he right about Angus? It's kind of hard looking for a mate in homesteading circumstances. You can count up your choices on your fingers without taking your other hand out of your pocket. Do you settle for the best of what you see, or wait in hopes something better comes along?

CallieOK · « **Reply #57 on:** August 07, 2011, 10:25:27 PM »

Two more tales and then I agree that we should get back to discussing the story.

Pat, bringing in the stake with the legal description on it was also a way of identifying yourself to the Filing Office.

It wasn't necessary to go to the Filing Office right away. Some homesteaders didn't get there for quite a while because they were too busy getting settled. The first Oklahoma Land Run was in April so there was time to plow enough land to at least plant a garden large enough to sustain the family through the next winter. It would also have been possible to plow enough land to start a cash crop of some kind.

The two filing offices in The Unassigned Lands of Oklahoma worked this way. At a certain time every morning, all the men who were there to file a claim drew numbers for the order in which they could fill out the papers and pay the Filing Fee of $50.00. I don't know how many numbers were included in each day's drawing - but women who had staked a claim had to wait until all the men who had drawn that day's numbers had filed and then they could do so.
Ada Baskins, the woman who staked her claim with a flag, wrote in her diary that she rode horseback almost 20 miles to the Filing Office early one morning and had to wait until after 4:00 p.m. to file her claim.

Earlier, someone asked about a "soddy". In Oklahoma, the prairie was (and is) covered with Buffalo grass, which has very long roots. Settlers discovered that the red clay could be cut and dried into bricks and the long roots of the grass would hold the bricks together until they dried.
Here's a link to a picture of a sod house ("soddy") in Montana in 1884. http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/I?ngp:7:./temp/~ammem_LBVr::displayType=1:m856sd=ndfahult:m856sf=c022:@@@

PatH · « **Reply #58 on:** August 07, 2011, 10:52:33 PM »

It's hard to leave this, isn't it? Callie, have you read "The Jump-off Creek" by Molly Gloss? Based partly on the story of the author's grandmother, it describes the first 2 years in the life of a solo woman homesteading in Oregon in the 1890s. I wouldn't have lasted 2 days in that life.

The geography is as frustrating as it is here. You can get very close to the location, but even with a detailed topo map of Oregon I couldn't quite pin it down.

PatH · « **Reply #59 on:** August 07, 2011, 11:20:22 PM »

Now Angus has become the schoolteacher. I wonder how often the "schoolmaams" were men? It certainly suits him, and he does a good job. The privy incident is hilarious.

JoanP · « **Reply #60 on:** August 08, 2011, 08:53:46 AM »

Good morning!

Love the homesteading stories. Makes the whole period come to life. I can't help but think of the advantage of having two strong young men working together - with no children to worry about. Not only that - they were not afraid to work - and could work with their hands. And Uncle Lucas has their back. In no time, they've got prime land, warm, well-made sturdy homes and a promising enterprise raising sheep on the land. Is this area of Montana still known for raising sheep?

Callie, do you think that sod homes were common in Montana back then? I thought the proximity of the cottonwood trees would make such homes unnecessary - as they would be on prairie land.

When the boys first arrived in Gros Ventre, I wondered where a fellow would meet a girl in this place. Yes, there was the calico situation - - and there was Nancy -

Then we found there were already some early settlers in the area later known as Scotch Heaven. Some had daughters - like the Findlaters. The previous schoolmarm - now married. Where will teachers come from? PatH - I guess that a schoolmaster was somewhat of a surprise for these children - unlike in Scotland.. Whose idea was it to choose Angus for the position, do you think? Would the children have been better off with someone who knew something about America - American history?
What would have happened had Angus refused?
PatH - why do you think he did so well? What was the secret of his success?

Babi · « **Reply #61 on:** August 08, 2011, 09:08:21 AM »

Just realizing this section of country is side by side with what became Glacier
National Park gives you some idea of what it was like. Hardy folk, these Scots.

Quote

why he wants to buy even more sheep - borrowing from Lucas?

PAT, perhaps you already answered that one when you wrote, "Nothing is enough for Rob.." I think Rob yearns to be a rich man, like those who owned all the land in Scotland.

For all his reliance on Lucas, Rob was getting too close to Nancy. I really
did think he had more sense than that. Angus sees something developing between Rob and Nancy that shocks and alarms him. Strangely enough, he seems more understanding where Nancy is concerned. "Nancy seeing Rob as a younger Lucas. A Lucas fresh and two-handed. Nancy whose life had been to accept what came."[/b]
But Rob, not letting himself see the catastrophe he was headed for. "Rob who could make himself believe water wasn't wet." "I knew better than to try to head Robert Burns Barclay from something he had newly talked himself into. Take and shake Rob until his teeth rattled and
they'd still be castanets of the same tune."

CALLIE, after all these years I'm just now learning this information about the
sod houses. There were grass roots in those sod bricks!

CallieOK · « **Reply #62 on:** August 08, 2011, 09:10:42 AM »

A link to Cottonwood trees. Paragraph 6 has the most information about using them for building material (love the reason for using them to build barns).

http://www.stoneandcottonwood.com/cottonwoodtreesarticle

Babi, the grass in the sod bricks sometimes led to prairie critters suddenly dropping onto the settler's table! I've also seen pictures of cows grazing on the roof of a soddy that was more like a dug-out.

JoanP · « **Reply #63 on:** August 08, 2011, 09:26:44 AM »

Thanks for more on the cottonwood trees, Callie - I don't think the boys would have been happy building their homes of sod. Such craftmanship setting the logs. Rog was a natural at it.

Interestingly - Sunday's Washington Post's Travel Section had a huge spread - photos and maps - of Glacier National Park. Cold enough for you? Isn't it funny how these coincidences occur...

I'm thinking that Rob wasn't as interested in Nancy as Angus feared - the slightest distraction -and he was off to the next project. Didn't even need that shaking Angus wanted to give him! PatH said yesterday - Rob married the first woman he sees who looks at him admiringly and reflects him back at himself Marrying Nancy would not reflect well...Rob must be aware of this...
-
Love the quoted passages, Babi!

Mippy · « **Reply #64 on:** August 08, 2011, 10:59:18 AM »

Good morning, everyone, from cloudy Cape Cod. I've just been reading the last posts, and have read in the book up to page 162.

I'm also enjoying the humor, as when Rob says: why do you suppose they put a river all the way down there? and Angus says: talk to the riverwright about it!

Posting has been difficult, as I've had family here for a while, but today the CA folks are heading out, first to visit my Boston daughter, then home. As an added bonus, a long-lost (out-of-touch) niece also came to visit yesterday, who grew up in Calgary, Canada. The map of Glacier National Park shows Calgary at the top, perhaps 100 miles north of the US border. Who knew?

Thanks to everyone for all the great links!

CallieOK · « **Reply #65 on:** August 08, 2011, 11:19:19 AM »

Angus summarizes three years in the section beginning "Say you are a stone that blinks once a year. In the wink that is 1891, you...note the retreat of timber on Wolf Butte where Rob and myself and (five others) sawed lodgpole pines to build...houses."

Angus also comments on the first winter: "You might not think it, but with winter we saw more of the other homesteaders than ever...no more than a few weeks ever passed withot Scotch Heaven having a dance that brought out everyone...We of the bachelor brigade were ...busy appreciating that Scotch Heaven's balance sheet of men and women was less uneven that it had been..."

Quite a few single women "came west" on their own - some as schoolteachers, others as "Calico" and some just to visit.
Another treaure of mine is original pages from my grandmother's scrapbook in the 1880's. Included are brief "personals" about her teaching in Iowa, Kansas and Nebraska. One "personal" tells about her and her Mother visiting relatives in Oregon. It says her mother went home but "Miss Maggie will continue her trip to San Francisco to attend the Education Convention and visit (a cousin) there for the balance of the summer."

salan · « **Reply #66 on:** August 08, 2011, 02:03:41 PM »

Callie, what a treasure trove you have in your grandmother's scrapbooks and writings. It surely makes her come alive for you. How many of you journal? I am 68 yrs old and have seen a lot of history being made. Those of you who are older have seen even more. If we journal, and put down our thoughts and feelings we could make those portions of history come more alive for our grandchildren, great grands and so on. It makes me feel like going back and updating some of the journaling I have done.

I think perhaps Angus was chosen partly because he was always quoting poetry. It made him seem better educated than many of those around him. He really does seem to take to it, doesn't he?

Rob does seem to be a "pie in the sky" kind of guy, doesn't he? He dreams big--sometimes unrealistically so.

PatH, I read the Heart of Horses by Molly Gloss and really enjoyed the book. Thanks for mentioning The Jump Off Creek. Now I have another book on my tbr list.
Sally

CallieOK · « **Reply #67 on:** August 08, 2011, 02:27:59 PM »

Sally, that grandmother lived in the town where I grew up and died when I was a freshman in college. So I remember her well. Unfortunately, we didn't find all these treasures until the aunt who lived with her died 20 years later. My Dad was also gone - so I didn't have the opportunity to talk to anybody about the items of correspondence, etc.

With the schoolmaster job and having met the teacher at Noon Creek, Angus is beginning to find his own way without Rob's input. This is not going over well with Rob who is used to Angus going along to get along with him, is it?

JoanP · « **Reply #68 on:** August 09, 2011, 08:39:00 AM »

Good morning to all the rascals in the room-

I've been looking for the meaning of the title from the start - thought for sure it was an old Scottish air - searched for days. Yesterday I came across a statement made by Ivan Doig - I'll bring the source as soon as I find it again - saying that HE wrote it himself - for this novel. So that settles that - I'll stop hunting for it.
Still wondering whether "rascal fairs" were known in Scotland...Looked up "rascal" - the first definition seems to fit the mood of the Dance, doesn't it?

1. One that is playfully mischievous.
2. An unscrupulous, dishonest person; a scoundrel.

ps - Just found this and have to add it here!

"Rascal Fair" - the hiring market for those who had not obtained a job at the "Muckle Fair".
"Muckle Friday" - the half-annual hiring market for farm workers.
Farming in Scotland

JoanP · « **Reply #69 on:** August 09, 2011, 08:53:58 AM »

Mippy, you are making good progress - even with a house full of company. Your Calgery niece might be interested in this book, living so near to the terrain described.
Lucas Barclay has another niece coming on the scene...You have to wonder how long she's been planning this trip? T'is the season for nieces!

Quote

"I think perhaps Angus was chosen partly because he was always quoting poetry."

Sally - who do you think selected him? I'm not sure he was quoting his poetry to Nineas Duff, was he? I agree, he was obviously better educated than anyone else around. Just geographically challenged with no US history to teach these kids. Notice him cramming the day before each lesson. More important than anything - he really cares about these kids... One student seems to stand out - I feel that we'll be hearing more about her in the future. How old would you say Miss Susan Duff is? I wonder where these kids will go to school once they have "graduated" from this one room schoolhouse.

Babi · « **Reply #70 on:** August 09, 2011, 09:36:55 AM »

I've seen those pictures, too, CALLIE. I figured that house had to have been built into the
side of hill; surely otherwise that cow would fall through. Talk about a 'critter' landing on
the table!

I don't know, JOAN. I took the whole 'Nancy' thing pretty seriously, as it came close to
altering the road the boys took. Because of this infatuation, Rob changes his mind about homesteading. He wants to give up their dream of homesteading and continue to work in Gros Ventre. He has good explanations for this, of course. Angus should stay, too. The town would need a schoolteacher. And maybe later, when they were established and hand some funds, they could look for homesteads.

Angus finally decides the only thing he can do is leave, but in saying good-bye to Lucas he
unintentionally reveals why. Lucas handles it.
Q.. What do you think of Lucas way of handling this situation?? No direct confrontation. Just clear the temptation out of the way and offer a big, dangling carrot.

CALLIE, I had to smile at one of Doig's comments in his 'Acknowledgments'. He said some of
the poetry was, of course, Robert Burns, some of it was a combo 'Burns-Doig', and some was pure Doig. I did notice one or two that didn't really sound like Burns to me.

I think you're right about Rob expecting Angus to follow where he leads. It's understandable,
I suppose, as they grew up together in that relationship. Good catch, tho', that Rob may be
resenting the 'new' Angus. I hadn't caught that.

CallieOK · « **Reply #71 on:** August 09, 2011, 01:25:36 PM »

In my hardback copy, the chapter/section "Scotch Heaven" goes from page 88 to page 300.
Is everyone else reading this part more slowly than I am? I don't want to jump ahead with observations.

For instance, hasn't anyone else discovered Rob's plot to get Angus away from Anna?

PatH · « **Reply #72 on:** August 09, 2011, 03:04:17 PM »

My section "Scotch Heaven" goes from 88 to 200, but it covers what you describe, Callie, ending with a wedding. I think maybe we were all starting slowly, in case some people hadn't caught up, and to take things in order. Probably we should move forward.

JoanP · « **Reply #73 on:** August 09, 2011, 03:20:16 PM »

Babi - I can't imagine Rob staying on in Gros Ventre - trying to woo Nancy away from Lucas. It didn't take much to get him to give up on her, as soon as Lucas offered to sponsor the boys in their homesteading venture. I wonder if we'll ever see Angus as low as he was - he was ready to set out on his own. Is this how he will react to disappointment in the future, do you think?

As Pat reports, the paperback version has Scotch Heaven pages 89 to 200. That's the longest section we'll be reading/discussing at once. We've got all week for this long chapter. Today is only Tuesday. Babi and I had hoped to discuss the first half of Scotch Heaven - so as not to give away the big developments in the second half right away as people are reading to catch up.
It would help to know who has finished the Scotch Heaven chapter...Two of you are ready to move on - but let's be careful, remembering not to reveal too much until we find out where the others are with their reading -

Did you catch a reason for Rob's disapproval of the new schoolmarm? She seems perfect for Angus - doesn't she? Just what he's been waiting for. Do you believe in love at first sight? What did YOU think of her?
I can't figure out whether Rob knew about Anna Ramsay before he sent for his sister, can you?

salan · « **Reply #74 on:** August 09, 2011, 07:22:41 PM »

I have finished Scotch Heaven. Have most of you finished this section?
Sally

JoanP · « **Reply #75 on:** August 09, 2011, 07:30:00 PM »

Thanks, Sally. What did YOU think of Anna Ramsay? Didn't she seem perfect for Angus - the one he'd been waiting for?
Why didn't Rob like her? Can you tell whether he had already arranged for his sister to come to Montana, hoping for a match? Or did he send for her once he saw Angus and Anna getting closer? Ivan Doig sure knows how to tell the story, doesn't he?

PatH · « **Reply #76 on:** August 09, 2011, 09:15:06 PM »

I've finished the section, too.

Angus certainly falls for Anna instantly. I don't believe in love at first sight. When someone is attracted like Angus is, it's powerful, but it's not love. It can grow into love, but the first look only shows you beauty, mannerisms, maybe that someone looks like your personal ideal. You don't really know anything about what they are really like, whether you can even stand them.

I have trouble figuring Anna out. She is beautiful, smart, and competent, but she keeps her emotions under wraps. She is being very cautious indeed in deciding whether she and Angus would suit each other, unlike Angus, who is sure in the first second (right or wrong).

salan · « **Reply #77 on:** August 10, 2011, 07:50:37 AM »

Did anyone else find it strange that Angus wasn't the first man Anna had sex with. After all, it was the 1880's and it was shameful for women to even think about sex. For some reason, I didn't quite trust Anna. I think part of the reason Rob didn't approve is because he always had in mind for Angus and Adair to get together.

I think Adair seems gentle and sweet; but it drives me crazy that she always refers to herself in the third person. For instance, she says, "Adair thinks this" and "Adair does that". It really annoys me. I wonder why Doig presented her speech in that manner.
Sally

Babi · « **Reply #78 on:** August 10, 2011, 08:44:20 AM »

Adair's habit of referring to herself in the third person is jarring, isn't it? (And I'm
sure the main reason for Rob's objection to Anna is that he had other plans for
a wife for Angus!)
Anyway, I found this info. about Adair's trait. It's called "illeism". So, does one
of these explain Adair, do you think?
Illeism in everyday speech can have a variety of intentions depending on context. One common usage is to impart humility, a common practice in feudal societies and other societies where honorifics are important to observe ("Your servant awaits your orders"), as well as in master-slave relationships ("This slave needs to be punished"). Recruits in the military are also often made to refer to themselves in the third-person, such as "This soldier" or "This recruit," in order to reduce the sense of individuality and enforce the idea of the group being more important than the self. The use of illeism in this context imparts a sense of lack of self, implying a diminished importance of the speaker in relation to the addressee or to a larger whole.

Conversely, in different contexts, illeism can be used to reinforce self-promotion, as used to sometimes comic effect by Bob Dole throughout his political career.[2] This was particularly made notable during the United States presidential election, 1996 and lampooned broadly in popular media for years afterwards.

Similarly illeism is used with an air of grandeur, to give the speaker lofty airs. Idiosyncratic and conceited people are known to either use or are lampooned as using illeism to puff themselves up or illustrate their egoism. The artist Salvador Dalí used illeism throughout his interview with 60 Minutes's Mike Wallace, punctuating it with "Dalí is immortal and will not die," although this may have been a reference to the legacy of his art rather than his actual self. The wrestler The Rock was notorious for this, mainly to enhance his persona to a superhuman level.

PatH · « **Reply #79 on:** August 10, 2011, 09:26:20 AM »

Quote from: salan on August 10, 2011, 07:50:37 AM

Did anyone else find it strange that Angus wasn't the first man Anna had sex with.
Sally

Yes, Sally, I wondered about that too. And for that matter, strange that she had sex with Angus when she was still making up her mind. I don't really know what customs were like on the frontier at that time, but it was a pretty risky thing for a woman to do, given lack of contraceptives and notions of women's purity. Angus doesn't seem to find it remarkable, but he's not exactly clear-headed about Anna.

I agree with you about Rob's dislike, and I think also his vanity is hurt by the fact that she's unaffected by his charm.

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