Bleak House by Charles Dickens - February Book Club Online

[JoanP]

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Bleak House                            
by Charles Dickens

                   

Bleak House is the 10th novel by Charles Dickens, published in twenty monthly installments between March 1852 and September 1853. It is held to be one of Dickens's finest novels, containing one of the most vast, complex and engaging arrays of minor characters and sub-plots in his entire canon. The story is told partly by the novel's heroine, Esther Summerson, and partly by an omniscient narrator. The story revolves around the mystery of Esther Summerson's mother and it involves a murder story and one of English fiction's earliest detectives, Inspector Bucket. Most of all, though, the story is about love and how it can cut through human tangles and produce a happy ending. The house where Dickens lived spent summers with his family, beginning in 1850, is said to have inspired his novel of the same name.  Among others, he wrote David Copperfield in this house.

The Old Man of the Name of Tulkinghorn  (click to enlarge)

INSTALMENT XI XII

DATE of PUBLICATION    Jan. 1853 Feb. 1853

CHAPTERS 33-35  36-38

DISCUSSION DATES April 5--Apr.9  April 10--Apr.14

Mr. Smallweed Breaks the Pipe of Peace (click to enlarge)

               Some Topics to Consider

Chapter  XXXIII  Interlopers 1. Who would you say are  the "Interlopers" referred to in the title of this chapter? 2. What is the peculiar smell, the "foetid effluvia" observed by witnesses in Chancery Lane?  Can it be connected to what is known of  "spontaneous combustion"? 3.  Mr. Snagsby's mental suffering is so great, he entertains the idea of turning himself in - to be cleared if innocent, punished if guilty.  Do you believe it will turn out that he is responsible, at least in some small part,  for  Krook's death?   4. What brings the Smallweeds down to the Sol's Arms?  What interest do they have in Krook's Rag and Bottle?  How did Mr. Tulkinghorn become connected to this unsavory family? 5. How does Lady Dedlock take the news from Mr. Guppy that the letters have been destroyed?  How did you interpret Mr. Tulkinghorn's reaction when he encountered Mr. Guppy in the Dedlocks' library?    Chapter XXXIV  Turn of the Screw 1. Were you expecting some sort of repercussions following Mr. George's refusal to comply with Tulkinghorn's request to hand over samples of Mr. George's former captain's handwriting?  Why was the letter from Smallweed particularly upsetting to Mr. George? 2. Were you at all surprised at Mrs. Bagnet's tone with her husband's old comrade?  What more do we learn about Mr. George in this installment? 3.  What might  Mrs. Rouncewell be doing in Mr. Tulkinghorn's office? What was Mr. George's reaction when he saw her there? 4.  Wasn't this "turn of the screw" particularly cruel and devillish of Tulkinghorn? 5.  Does Mr. Bagnet know what his old friend was forced to do, in order to save the Bagnet family from ruin?    Chapter XXXV  Esther's Narrative      1. After several weeks in the sickbed, have you noticed a change in Esther's sense of responsibility and view of her position in the family? 2. How does Dickens break the news to his readers that Esther's face has changed?  How do you imagine her appearance now? 3. Is it difficult to believe that Rick Carstone has changed in his regard for John Jarndyce?  What might have changed him?  Isn't he still in the army in Ireland? 4.  Is it a stretch to believe that Miss Flite has walked 20 miles in her dancing slippers to tell Esther that a veiled lady has been enquiring after her - and that this same lady is said to be the Lord Chancellor's wife?   Does this mean what it seems to mean? 5. Do you believe Miss Flite when she says that the Judgment of her suit will come shortly and all of her birds will then be released?    Do you have any idea why she addresses Esther as Miss Fitz-Jarndyce?

 

Related Links:
 Characters in Bleak House by Groups;  Map of London  1851 (double click); UNSOLVED MYSTERIES ; Interactive Map of London

 

                                                  

Bleak House  "A dreary name," said the Lord Chancellor. "But not a dreary place at present, my lord," said Mr. Kenge.

DLs:  JoanP, Marcie, PatH, Babi,   JoanK  

[JoanK]

Dickens says: "I do not willfully or negligently mislead my readers."

That makes me almost sure that it will turn out it was NOT spontaneous combustion.

Detective Bucket will have a lot to unravel whenever he does show up!

[Laura]

Based on what you all have written here, I am even more sure that Krook did not die by spontaneous combustion.  

“Krook was Grandmother Smallweed’s brother. Grandfather Smallweed has come to deal with Krook’s property. His lawyer is Mr. Tulkinghorn.”  (Quoted from Spark Notes)

Mr. Tulkinghorn is Lady Dedlock’s lawyer too.  She was seen leaving his office after a long meeting.  I remember Joan P. posting about how Mr. Tulkinghorn seems to be in the middle of everything (about the time we were talking about Allegory).  If there was any doubt that was true then, I think there is no doubt now!  

This book is a tangled web!  Now Krook was Mrs. Smallweed’s brother!  Wow!  Now to add that link in my mind and figure out all the implications…

Oh, and I don't think Jo is dead.

[PatH]

Dickens says: "I do not willfully or negligently mislead my readers."

That makes me almost sure that it will turn out it was NOT spontaneous combustion.

Detective Bucket will have a lot to unravel whenever he does show up!

I came to the opposite conclusion--that Dickens believed spontaneous combustion to be possible, therefore he felt free to use it.

Bucket certainly will have a lot of work ahead of him.

[JoanP]

Isn't this amazing -  we are all sitting in our own little corner of the world reading the same book, the same words - and seeing things from such a different prospective?  I have complete confidence that Dickens will clarify everything before we are done - because that's how he usually ends his tales.  Oh, except for Mystery of Edwin Drood - that maddening uncompleted last novel.  Dickens died half way through.  I'm looking forward to see how the PBS adaptation finishes the story.  There were huge unanswered questions - with Dickens seemingly leading the reader in one direction, but you just knew what he was doing, just didn't know how he was going to do it.  Maddening!  I think PBS is airing it next week...

What happened to the letters in a feminine hand, presumably from Lady Dedlock to Hawdon?

 PatH's  question from a few days ago not yet answered.  I hope Lady Dedlock's letters weren't burned up...they would be interesting to read.  I'm going to assume that it was made to look this way by whomever doesn't want them around.  That would mean someone is trying to protect Lady Dedlock, wouldn't it?  Handwriting plays a major role here.  There's another  sample of Hawdon's handwriting that Tulkinghorn wants to get his hands on too.  Mr. George has decided not to hand them over.  We haven't heard the last of that...he's not going to get away with this refusal.  Tulkinghorn has his way of turning the screw when he wants something.

I feel particularly sorry for poor Mr. Snagsby - he feels implicated somehow - but doesn't know if what he has done has caused Krook's demise.  I'll bet he's passed on information about those letters in Krook's possession.  DId I miss something?  Do you know what is bothering him?  

[Babi]

 I agree, JOANP. The coincidences and unexpected relationships do seem a bit too much. I think
you meant Smallweed, tho', not Skimpole.  I don't blame the lawyer for checking that claim
carefully. Smallweed would not hesitate to stake a false  claim on Krook's shop if he thought he
could get away with it.
  I don't for a minute think that Dickens would 'willfully or negligently mislead' his readers.
I did think he personally believed spontaneous combustion, but after reading more carefully
what you posted of his actual words, I do agree with your conclusion. Good thinking!
  A point is made of some partially burned papers. Are these the letters Guppy wanted to see,
...or not? Are the letters still out there, somewhere?

 As a sidebar,  I am amazed to read of the sort of artistry supposedly used by the newspapers of the time.  A sketch that depicts an apartment as ‘three-quarters of a mile long, by fifty yards high’?? I found this link interesting. (Enlarge the illustrations.)  The detail is marvelous, but there is no way of knowing the size of the original rooms.
             
  http://www.oldimprints.com/OldImprints/19th_century_newspaper_illustrations.cfm

[JoanP]

Thanks, Babi - I did mean to say that it was Smallweed who arrived on the scene with his wife...poor wife.  He didn't have anything to throw at her, so he threw his granddaughter at at her!  I wonder how these two will be portrayed in the film adaptation.  So it turns out that Mrs. Skimpole is Krook's sister!  Will wonders never cease!  Why on earth are they interested in the Krook and Rags establishment?  Is because of the contents of the house...the papers?  The room in which two people have been murdered?  Miss Flite?  
And Babi, did you notice that Skipole's lawyer is none other than Mr. Tulkinghorn?  I thought that he only represented the big houses, not the likes of Skimpole, and yet here  he is, checking on the relationship of Krook's only heirs.

Would you say the Skimpoles are the "interlopers" named in the title of this chapter?  If not, do you see anyone else?  Weevle and Guppy?  The Snagsbys?

[Jonathan]

'This book is a tangled web!  Now Krook was Mrs. Smallweed’s brother!  Wow!  Now to add that link in my mind and figure out all the implications…'

I'm sure we all feel that way, Laura. When I read about that family relationship I thought immediately of the sulphurous smell surrounding the death of Mr Krook. The grease. The yellow/green substance. And what is Mr Smallweed's favorite name for his wife? Brimstone. A family trait.  Doesn't she sound like a demented witch?

Pity the poor rag and bottle man. For years he has been trying to teach himself to read. He suspects that there might be profit in some of the old papers cluttering his place. Especially a bundle of letters which he has taken from a dead man's portmanteau. He's frustrated. He was going to have his new lodger read them for him. Mr Guppy was going to do a switch with a false bundle of letters, so he could deliver them to Lady Dedlock. Mr Smallweed would like to get his hands on them. So would Mr Tulkinghorn.

Jo must be alive. Knowing Dickens, the reader will be there when Jo's time comes.

[PatH]

Jo must be alive. Knowing Dickens, the reader will be there when Jo's time comes.

You're right, Jonathan.  If a character like that dies, it won't be offstage.

[JoanK]

BABI: what a wonderful article! I'm so used to cameras, I never thought about how pictures got into earlier papers.

I confess, I'm getting lost in the ins and outs of this plot. Lucky for me the next section is simpler!

Skimpole has enough irresponsability to be responsable for (so to speak). I don't think he's involved in the letter business, that's Smallweed. Or am I wrong?

[Laura]

OK, I admit it --- I cheated.  I read the analysis section of Chapter 33, The Interlopers, from the Spark Notes.  I was thrilled to read this opening sentence:

“The complicated financial arrangement between George, Mr. Smallweed, and the Bagnets, which is nearly impossible to understand, reflects both the tangled web of Jarndyce and Jarndyce as well as the interconnecting threads of the novel’s many storylines.”

The bold and underlining are mine!  The note then goes on to explain:

“We have the facts, or what seem to be the facts: George once borrowed money from Mr. Bagnet to buy his shooting gallery; Mr. Bagnet borrowed this money from Mr. Smallweed with the understanding that George would repay it; and Mr. Smallweed, generally willing to collect interest instead of demanding repayment, is now demanding payment in full because he’s upset that George wouldn’t provide the lodger’s handwriting. The vaguer aspects of this situation include the many references to the “arrangement” George has with Mr. Smallweed; Mr. Smallweed’s “friend in the city,” who may be Richard or who may be no one at all; and George’s deep devotion to the Bagnets. Dickens does not spend much time elaborating on every element of this messy grouping, and a full understanding of the particulars isn’t the point. Instead, we get a clear sense that characters are linked to each other in complicated ways, that loyalties can be tested, and that motivations are not always what they seem. The shadowy dealings of Mr. Smallweed and George’s growing desperation add more sinister tones to the developing plot.”

Well, apparently, everything is supposed to be a clear as mud!  Reading this made me feel so much better!  We are not losing our minds!  This is one complicated book!

I still don’t know who the interlopers are though!  LOL!

[Laura]

Pity the poor rag and bottle man. For years he has been trying to teach himself to read. He suspects that there might be profit in some of the old papers cluttering his place. Especially a bundle of letters which he has taken from a dead man's portmanteau. He's frustrated. He was going to have his new lodger read them for him. Mr Guppy was going to do a switch with a false bundle of letters, so he could deliver them to Lady Dedlock. Mr Smallweed would like to get his hands on them. So would Mr Tulkinghorn.

Thank you for this summary.  This helps make things clearer too!

[Laura]

Did we already know that Lady Dedlock had a son who was a soldier?  This information was stated  in Chapter 34.

[Laura]

Skimpole has enough irresponsability to be responsable for (so to speak). I don't think he's involved in the letter business, that's Smallweed. Or am I wrong?

You are correct.  It is Smallweed.

[PatH]

Well, Laura, I'm glad to have permission not to have to figure that loan business out.   I think the important thing is that it provides the means for Tulkinghorn to force George to give him a sample of Hawdon's handwriting.  George can't just default and take the consequences, because Bagnet has stood security for him, and would be ruined too.

[JoanP]

Did you think that Mr. Tulkinghorn was going to let Mr. George walk out of his office without turning over those papers?  I have forgotten why Mr. George hesitated to hand them over.  They weren't letters or anything incrimiating that would bring dishonnor to his former Captain, were they?  Wasn't it Mrs. Bagnet who advised him not to?  Mr. Tulkinghorn wants to compare the handwriting on these papers with the handwriting that Lady Dedlock reacted to in an early chapter.    

Laura, I don't think Lady Dedlock has any children after Esther.  Perhaps you are remembering Mrs. Rouncewell, Lady Dedlock's housekeeper?  She had a son who went to the army - that son was Mr. George.  Not sure why he dropped his last name - will guess so he could not be found.  But the other son - the Industrialist - the Ironmaster.  His name is Rouncewell too, I presume.  But he has a son, the one who is interested in Lady Dedlock's maid - Rosa.  His name is Wat Taylor...not Rouncewell?  Did you wonder at that too?

The  surprising thing was finding the Dedlock housekeeper in Tulkinghorn's office in London.  Was that ever explained?

[JoanP]

Everything seems to center on Tulkinghorn, doesn't it?  He seems to have all the power - everyone working for him, to some degree.    He is the attorney who  is supposed to be investigating the relationship between Mrs. SkimpoleSmallweed and her "brother" - Mr. Krook.  Do you know what I think?  I see the Smallweeds as the Interlopers in the title of this chapter.  I don't believe they are related to Mr. Krook at all -   I think that Mr. Tulkinghorn is behind this - and he is going to come out and say that Mrs. Skimpole  Smallweed ais the rightlful owner of Krook and Rags...or at least he's going to delay pronouncing his findings until the Skimpoles find what they are looking for.  

Poor Miss Flite - locked out of her flat.  Who is caring for her caged birds?

[PatH]

The  surprising thing was finding the Dedlock housekeeper in Tulkinghorn's office in London.  Was that ever explained?

I don't think it was explained; maybe it will be later.  But isn't it an odd scene?  Mrs. Rouncewell comes out of the office, notices George and Bagnet, remarks that they must be military men, and exchanges a few sentences with Bagnet about her military son.  All this time that very son is standing with his back to her, supposedly engrossed in something over the fireplace.  He has presumably recognized her voice, but she doesn't seem to recognize him, and he carefully doesn't turn around until she has left.

The ironmaster's son is Watt Rouncewell.  Sir Leicester nervously thinks of him as Wat Tylor, the leader of the Peasant's Revolt of 1381.

[Laura]

Laura, I don't think Lady Dedlock has any children after Esther.  Perhaps you are remembering Mrs. Rouncewell, Lady Dedlock's housekeeper?  
The  surprising thing was finding the Dedlock housekeeper in Tulkinghorn's office in London.  Was that ever explained?

Oh, you're right!  I mixed up the two.  Lady Dedlock's presence would have been a lot easier to explain!

[Babi]

 I was a bit startled to find Tulkinghorn was Smallweed's lawyer.  On consideration, tho',
I suppose it's not all that surprising. Smallweed would definitely relate to a secretive
lawyer who likes to know everybody else's secrets.
 With the sudden appearance of the Smallweed's claiming Krook's place, perhaps they are
the interlopers.
 
  I suspect, JOANP, that George simply realized that Tulkinghorn was up to no good in 
wanting to see a sample of his former Captain's handwriting. He was deeply loyal. If
Tulkinghorn had any reasonable and honorable explanation for his interest, he could have
explained it. 
(Uh, that's Smallweeds again, not Skimpoles, re. Krooks.)

 Ah, thank you, PAT. I had forgotten why Watt was called "Wat Taylor".

  I really think the Bagnets' deserve more attention.  Mrs. Bagnet has become a favorite of mine.
Mrs. Bagnet...”being that rare sort of old girl that she received Good to her arms without a hint that it might be Better; and catches light from any little spot of darkness near her.”

[Jonathan]

Holding

[bookad]

Babi-I'm with you I enjoy Mr. & Mrs. Bagnet; what a cute couple
he always giving his opinion thru his wife's voice

“Old girl,” murmurs Mr Bagnet, after a short silence, “will you tell him my opinion?”
“Oh! Why didn’t he marry,” Mrs Bagnet answers, half laughing and half crying, “Joe Pouch’s widder in North America? Then he wouldn’t have got himself into these troubles.”

and

“Old girl,” murmurs Mr Bagnet, “give him another bit of my mind.”
“George,” says the old girl, “you are not so much to be blamed, on full consideration, except for ever taking this business without the means.”
 “And that was like me!” observes the penitent trooper, shaking his head. “Like me, I know.”
“Silence! The old girl,” says Mr Bagnet, “is correct — in her way of giving my opinions — hear me out!”

both husband & wife facing a loss of their savings still are deeply concerned with George's feeling low and not up to their company as he usually was I suppose

Deb

[Laura]

I was glad to read that Esther’s blindness was temporary.  However, I was saddened to read that her face was scarred.  I thought it was a bit much when she was thinking of Mr. Woodcourt and was relieved that they had not had a romantic relationship so that he would not feel any obligation to her.  I suppose Esther’s feelings are part of a mourning and readjustment process, but I just felt this was melodramatic --- but melodrama is something we are to expect in this book!

[Babi]

I don’t really understand why Dickens chose to give Esther a disease that left her scarred.  The blindness, thankfully, gradually passed. I could understand a dramatic, life-threatening illness from which she recovered. All England must have heaved a sigh of relief.  But why the scarring?
What is Dickens' purpose in that?

  And next..  Surely it’s impossible!  Old Miss Flite, walking twenty miles?  Much less in a
pair of dancing shoes!  I know people in those times did a great deal of walking and thought
nothing of it.  But still, this is an old lady,  and a poor old lady at that, who probably hasn’t had
very much in the way of adequate nutrition.  I'm surprised she is still able to get around Chancery
as well as she does.

[JoanP]

Good morning!  I hope you all had a lovely weekend.  Weather here was magnificent, great for getting out and about.  This grandmother had tucked a little jar of colored bubble solution into Easter baskets...only to learn with horror that the colors - especially the purple ones, left huge splotches of color on the new Easter finery the kids were wearing.  I wish I had a photo of the look on their mother's face as she read the warnings on the jar.  Grandma hadn't read them.  These were Crayola bubbles - who reads directions about staining clothes!  Happy ending, DIL phoned last night to say she had laundered the clothes and the color all came out.

Lots of catching up today after the busy weekend with your observations of Installment 10. Are we all agreed that the Interlopers at the Krook's Rag and Bottle were the Smallweeds?  
Do you think that Mrs. Smallweed is really Krook's sister?  Is this just one of Dickens' many coincidences?  Or do you think that someone has concocted this story in order to get access to whatever might be in Krook's flat?  What other reason would the Smallweeds want in?  Can it be that Tulkinghorn is behind this - that he thinks those incrimating letters might still be there?

Wasn't that a magnificent moment when Tulkinghorn enters the Dedlock's library as Mr. Guppy was leaving?  The brief look of astonishment on his face that he was unable to conceal?  What does he realize in that moment?  Do you think he knew beforehand that Guppy had arranged to get those letters from Mr. Krook?  What can it mean when he sees Guppy leaving Lady Dedlock's company?

Tulkinghorn was looking for two sets of handwriting - those letters from Lady Dedlock to Captain Hawdon - and samples of Captain Hawdon's handwriting - that will link him to Lady D.  Is this how you see it? Is Tulkinghorn set on destroying Lady Dedlock?  Is he getting closer to doing that? Does he know anything  at all about Esther's background?  He knows about everything else...


I really think Dickens' women are amazingly well depicted.  He shows such great attention to the smallest details.  Deb - I think we can all relate to the warm and sensible Mrs. Bagnet.  Just don't threaten her family's well being! Wasn't it Mrs. Bagnet who had advised Mr. George against handing the papers over to Mr. Tulkinghorn?  He followed her advice, but now must go against it - in order to prevent the Bagnet family from losing its life savings.  Mr. George is getting screwed by the Tulkinghorn machine. So what does Tulkinghorn learn from this letter or paper in Captain Hawdon's handwriting??

[JoanP]

I've been wondering about the radical change in Esther's appearance too.    That's a good question, Babi.  Why does Dickens leave her with this altered appearance, probably for the rest of the novel?  She probably looks less like the beautiful Mrs. Dedlock now, don't you think?  I never could understand why some were struck by the similarity, others not at all.  Did John Jarndyce see it?  Did Ada?  We're not told those things just yet.  Those who loved her for herself before, will not change their perception of her.  I wonder what Mr. Guppy's reaction will be...

At first I thought Esther's face was covered with pock marks from the smallpox - and wondered how little Charley had escaped the same disfigurement.  I did a quick search and found this photo of a little girl in Bangladesh, whose appearance was radically changed by small pox - and can see there was a lot more to it the change, than just scars.  Fortunately, today there is a laser treatment available - too late for Esther.  I hope this photo isn't too shocking for you - but it does give you an idea of how Esther's face could have been altered...

I'm afraid I still don't understand how Esther's blindness was only temporary - but relieved to hear that it was.  Honestly thought it was going to be permanent.  Here's an article about effects of smallpox if you want to read more - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smallpox

[JoanP]

Ah Mrs. Flite - 20 miles in her dancing slippers, Babi!  I agree the image is unbelievable!   She is elderly, locked our of her flat by the presumed Krook heirs.   Where did she get those dancing slippers?   I thought she owned next to nothing?  Did the Smallweeds give her time to remove those caged birds?  So many questions - {too many questions}?!
HOWEVER, we do know she thought it important enough to walk a great distance - whether it was five miles - or twenty - to tell Esther that the veiled lady is enquiring after her.  What else does Mrs. Flite know about Esther?  We've never been told what Miss Flite's lawsuit is about, have we?  Is it in connection to the Jarndyce case?  What do you think when you hear Miss Flite refer to Esther as "Miss Fitz-Jarndyce"  - Are you as puzzled as I am, or does it mean something to you?

[Jonathan]

Everybody is drawn to Esther, even if it means a twenty-mile walk. I believe the Fitz of Fitz Jarndyce indicates that for Miss Flyte, Esther is part of the Jarndyce clan, Fitz meaning related to. I believe. Several men are drawn to Esther in a romantic way. The scarred face will be a test of their devotion. Will they still be aware of the stirling character behind the scarred face?

[PatH]

It's hard to believe Miss Flite's dancing shoes still had soles after walking 20 miles.  Her motive for wanting to see Esther was concern for her in her illness.  Miss Flite responds to kindness (probably doesn't get a lot of it) and Esther has been kind, friendly and concerned.  It's natural for Miss F to flutter around to  see how Esther is doing.

She didn't know about the handkerchief ahead of time.  It was when she and Charlie were walking from the coach to the house that Jenny buttonholed them and told them about it.

What was her lawsuit about?  She tells Esther something about it at dinner, but not what the original issue was.  She doesn't exactly say, but I'm left with the impression that it is nothing to do with Jarndyce and Jarndyce.  She does give us more foreboding about Richard, though: "I saw them (the tell-tale signs) beginning in our friend the Ward in Jarndyce.  Let someone hold him back.  Or he'll be drawn to ruin."

[JoanK]

JoanP: "Those who loved her for herself before, will not change their perception of her.  I wonder what Mr. Guppy's reaction will be... "

We start the new section tomorrow, and some of your questions will be answered. The coming section is less complicated, but there are still intimations of further surprises. I'm beginning to wonder if all this sneaking about is just about Lady Dedlock's daughter out of wedlock, or if there is more to it. I'll bet there is money involved, too.

[JoanP]

All right, it's a stretch, PatH, but I can accept that Miss Flite decided to walk the 20 miles from London to Lincolnshire out of cocern for Esther who had been so kind to her.  And Jonathan, thank you for explainingg the "Fitz-Jarndyce."  Miss Flite does not mean to say that Esther is part of the Jarndyce family, but related to family because she is one of the three Jarndyce wards.  Richard is however, a Jarndyce cousin - who turns from his benevolent cousin who has supported him through so much over the years.  Don't you wonder what he has learned in his legal studies that makes him suspect his guardian of something?  I sense Richard is way over his head - maybe beyond saving.  But wouldn't that be unlike Dickens?

Good, JoanK - am glad we will pick up on some of these things tomorrow - it's hard to be kept hanging until the next installment.  Even harder when the next installment says not a word on the big news  from the previous one.  I'm getting so that I am looking for "the big one"  when we reach the end of each installment, are you?  This one was HUGE.  What did you think of the big revelation at the end of Installment X? -

We're told that Miss Flite has walked 20 miles in her dancing slippers and tells Esther on this visit that a veiled lady has been enquiring after her - and that this same lady is said to be the Lord Chancellor's wife?   The Lord Chancellor's wife is
 _ _ _ _   _ _ _ _ _ _ _?  Does this mean what I think it means?  What did you think it meant when you read it?

[JoanP]

How about a show of hands - are you caught up?  Have you finished reading Chapter 35?  Have you begun Chapters 36-38?  Are you having difficulty keeping with the proposed schedule, reading three chapters every five days?  Do you need more time to catch up?  Perhaps it was just the busy weekend that has left little time for reading?  Please post here so we know how to proceed with the discussion...  Thanks so much!

[Laura]

I've read through Chapter 36.  I am going to have trouble participating much until Friday morning, but after that, my schedule will free up again and the schedule we have been keeping will be fine with me.  Maybe we need a couple of catch up days.  The time around Easter is very busy.

[JoanP]

Thank you, Laura - that helps with the planning - let's see what the others think about a slowdown.  We do need to finish up with Chapter 35 - do you have any time at all to share your views on the identity of the Lord Chancellor - until the end of Chapter 35 unknown?   BUT, he is said to be the husband of the veiled woman who was enquiring after Esther.   I guess the question is - who was the veiled woman who was enquiring after Esther...I CAN'T WAIT to hear from the rest of you.  I'm not sure I reached the right conclusion, but if I did - wow!

[Babi]

Apparently Tulkinghorn checked the Smallweed's documents and found them in
order. Mrs. Smallweed was indeed Krook's sister. So many connections...and do
you notice Tulkinghorn seems to be in the center of so many of them?

 I don't believe Esther's scarring was anywhere near as severe as the poor little
girl in the photo. This child probably recived little proper care and may have
been in poor health to begin with.  Esther's appearance is altered, and to a
young woman with reasonably good looks that would seem very harsh. Those who
love her are quick to reassure her that it makes no difference to them.

 I think I'll keep this brief this morning.  Not feeling well and a return to bed sounds like
a wonderful idea.     Until tomorrow....

[Jonathan]

I suspect the veiled woman was the angry Hortense, perhaps wanting people to think she is someone else. But I have to go back and reread some parts. Actually, I've been reading ahead, and I can tell you that we're getting to the good part. There are some wonderful scenes ahead.

'But wouldn't that be unlike Dickens?' What a strange suggestion, JoanP. Are you wondering, would Dickens allow Richard to go the way of Gridley and Tom Jarndyce? Yes he would. Dickens as a storyteller gets carried away at times. He can be ruthless, maudlin, generous, prejudiced, and willing to give every screw another turn. Already there have been some needless deaths, just to move the story along. We shouldn't take it too seriously. Unless Mr Bucket shows up.

[Laura]

We're told that Miss Flite has walked 20 miles in her dancing slippers and tells Esther on this visit that a veiled lady has been enquiring after her - and that this same lady is said to be the Lord Chancellor's wife?   The Lord Chancellor's wife is
 _ _ _ _   _ _ _ _ _ _ _?  Does this mean what I think it means?  What did you think it meant when you read it?

I thought Lady Dedlock was asking after Esther.  We know her to be Esther's mother.  I think a mother is concerned for her child and is trying to find out, covertly, how she is doing.

[JoanK]

I'm easy with either moving on, or staying a few days. Between Easter, Passover, and income tax, it's a busy time.

[JudeS]

I am back after five hard ,but wonderful days of children and grandchildren, nieces, nephews, and  great grands. A medley  aged 3,4, 5, 6, 7. This is a different world!All playing Angry Birds on I phones and I-Pads. Thank goodness "Curious George" is still beloved among all this new stuff.

Well back to Dickens. I was so worried that I wouldn't catch up that I completed the reading up to the end of chap. 38 before all the madness started. I took a bit of notes too.
However I don't want to spill the beans for anyone who has not read these wonderful chapters.
I will mention the words of Skimpole to Esther in chapt. 37

"I never was responsible in my life.. I can't be".
Skimpole then describes "Common Sense"........"an excellent man...a good deal wrinkled...dreadfully practical, change for a pound note in every pocket, ruled account book in hand-say, upon the whole, resembling a tax gatherer".

I am still wondering what Skimpole is doing in the story.  One guess, he is like a magnet pulling weak people like Richard to his way of thinking. I sure don't like Mr.Skimpole .                           Yet he seems to have no serious influence on mr. John Jarndyce.  Perhaps thus proving the inner strength and goodness of Mr. Jarndyce.

The other scene I would like to mention (affects the plot not at all) is the scene of the child apprentices at the Dancing School. This played out in my mind like a movie. I found it such wonderful writing that I read and reread it just for the fineness of the prose and the deep understanding of the nature of children.(chap. 38).

[JoanP]

Gee Jonathan...I'm so glad you spoke up.  I  just assumed the veiled lady who enquired after Esther's health - and then took  Esther's handkerchief, left money - had to be none other than Lady Dedlock.  Just assumed it, until your post when you suggested it might be someone else - like the French maid, Hortense.  So - went back and reread Chapter 35 again...there's so much there that I'd forgotten.  Laura, I see you too  thought the mysterious veiled woman was Esther's mother, Lady Dedlock.  Can you imagine what that would mean?  And if Miss Flite is correct  (lots of if's there) - Miss Flite tells Esther that the veiled woman is married to the Lord Chancellor!

Jonathan...don't you find Richard young, impressionable, easily led?  I think he's just the kind of boy that Dickens likes to give a second chance?  I'll admit, Richard is a borderline case - I'm betting that Dickens finds something redeemable in him - and he's planning a happy ending for Richard and Ada after all...

Here's what I found on rereading the end of Esther's narrative - Chapter 35.
First of all, the veiled lady is the Lord Chancellor's wife - that seems to leave out Hortense, Jonathan.  BUT, this mystery lady
 Miss Flite tells Esther tells Esther about - took the handkerchief without asking - and left money. She tells Esther that the lady gives her husband, the Lord Chancellor a terrible life.  Throws his lordship's papers into the fire, if he wont' pay the jeweller.
Does this sound like Lady Dedlock to you?  Miss Flite could probably identify this lady  - she seems to know who she is - and certainly knows the Lord Chancellor very well, spending so much time in his court.  Here's Dickens, confusing us once more.  What do you make of sweet Miss Flite?  Do you think there is any truth to what she is saying?  Do you think her mad - just a little, as others tell Esther?

Right now, I don't know what to think.  Who else can this veiled lady be?