Women's Issues

[Steph]

Jean, thank you. A wonderful discussion on Fiorina that made sense. I was puzzled by the child who died, but looked her up and disccovered it was a stepdaughter, not that she may not have loved her very much, but it was a big off point to me...
it is odd that we have a poster, that I dont see anywhere but on the
womens Issues page that seems to be very different than most of us. I thing that everyone should be able to post, but I am not happy with the "I know everything and you know nothing" tones.

[MaryPage]

Apparently it was not only a step daughter, but she was 35 years old when she died of alcohol and drug abuse.  And yes, this IS a child.  And yes, it can affect you deeply.  But the impression given the world audience was that (1) she has given birth and (2) she lost a YOUNG child.  Well, I will give her this:  she does not appear to have put a word wrong there, but certainly obfuscated matters!

I stayed up and watched Bill Maher on HBO last night, and boy, am I ever glad I did.  He and his panel of 4 really called out the lies and the liars from the Republican debate.  As have the folks on MSNBC and CNN.  I am beginning, but just beginning, to feel a tad better about the media.  I am beginning to relax a little and thus enjoy the show more.

[mabel1015j]

Thanks for the headsup on Maher. I didn't see it last night, but will look for it in the next couple of days. They repeat it a couple times, that is very helpful.

Jean

[MaryPage]

I am eager to hear what you think when you see it.

[MaryPage]

Just when my spirits began to rise, due to so many people, in so many forms of media, pitting the Truth against the Lie, I saw an absolutely mind-boggling moment on TV this morning.  One of the famous Sunday morning talk shows.  A well known anchorman and his panel of experts explaining that the video Carly Fiorina described WAS NOT entirely a film made at Planned Parenthood, but has been proved to be a fraud put together for the sole purpose of attempting to discredit Planned Parenthood.  All seemed in agreement, and then a Republican congressman was interviewed and asked if, in view of the facts being out there now, he would still vote to close down the government if Planned Parenthood is not defunded, and, to my complete astonishment (and obviously also to the well known anchorman's) this congressman declared, in what was a loud and obviously frenzied almost public SEIZURE of anger, that YES, if this terrible organization that sells baby parts is not defunded, he would want to see the government closed down!  Everyone was astonished!  The truth is, Truth is not what they are seeking.  Pandering to the vicious haters who just flat out Want To Believe their own garbage talk for the sole purpose of actually stamping out an organization that is by, for and about serving the needs of women and DOES NOT, DOES NOT, DOES NOT sell baby parts, is their entire goal.  You can't tell these people the truth on any subject;  they are the same ones who blow spit out of their snarling mouths while shouting that Barack Obama is not a citizen of these United States and was never born in Hawaii, but insist his birth was a conspiracy cooked up by people wanting to drag our country down clear back when he WAS born and it was planned that he would grow up to become president.  I just cannot wrap my mind around the degree of LACK OF LOGIC here!  Color me stunned!

[BarbStAubrey]

[MaryPage]

Interesting.  Sums up my own perspective of this aspect of humanity perfectly.

[Steph]

The haters are terrifying this year. It seems tohave  grown over the past 12 years or so.. You have Cheney and then Palin and now a variety of Hate...hate ...hate.. I know a lot of it is that there are a whole subset of humans who are convinced that letting same sex marry is close to the end of the world. It is so very sad.. Noone gets to pick  who they love..It is just that simple

[MaryPage]

Planned Parenthood is a NON-PROFIT organization dedicated to the Health of Women.  Women seek out Planned Parenthood, it does not seek out women.  It is the largest provider of womens reproductive services in this nation, and if they succeed in closing down its 800+ clinics, they will only have a few others to find fault with and get closed down.  Then there will be nowhere for women to go, and we will be back where we were before 1921, less than 100 years ago, when only RICH women could afford birth control and someone to prescribe it for them.  That was the whole point, originally;  as there were women who had the means and felt greatly liberated by being able to AFFORD the devices to keep them from having to undergo a pregnancy every year of their fertile lives, if, indeed, they got through those years alive.  So it was, for the most part, an organization of well bred, well to do society women with time to dedicate to worthy causes who volunteered time so that women who could not afford this relief from child bearing could reap the benefits of giving their bodies some well deserved vacation time.  Planned Parenthood has always been rife with a sense of doing good deeds for the community and especially for ALL the women of the community.

Planned Parenthood has some paid employees, but an awful lot of unpaid volunteers, as well.  In fact, there is a long history of volunteerism.  They are the nicest women you will ever meet, and their attitude when ANY woman goes there is "What do you need?"  If it is just a shoulder to cry on and some advice, that is readily available. 

[Steph]

well said MaryPage. But the haters seem to just see  target....boom. Our country needs to clean up its act. I am losing hope for any sort of turnaround.

[MaryPage]

Well, the haters and the finger pointers and those who avidly eat up and take up any conspiracy theory they hear repeated, even if the one relating the story is making the whole thing up right on the spot;  these are the ones being heard and having their lies repeated over and over and over again.  The other side of the coin is the millions just going about their daily business and hoping all the hoo rah will soon blow over and the nation will come to its senses.  What we have to actually DO, I think, in order to counter this poisonous insanity is to STOP for a moment.  Stop toiling away in the vineyards of the Lord, as it were, and speak Truth to Evil.  It is such a cruel and unthinkable thing to find that women who have been giving of their time and talents for generations in an effort to make the world, or at least their little place in it, a better and happier place for those in turmoil and difficulty, are suddenly being attacked in the fashion of Salem, Massachusetts back in the 17th century.  They are portrayed as witches and all their kindnesses as plots inspired by Satan.  Who was it who declared that "no good deed goes unpunished?"  I sometimes wonder if the deadly actions of those who hate dogooders so much are a manifestation of their GUILT because they are not stirring their own selves in the service of their fellow men, women and children.  So they shoot doctors and nurses to death, and yell that they are in the right because they are doing God's Work!  Never have I witnessed such turning inside out and upside down of what is expected of us as we travel through our lives supposedly doing Acts of Love!

[mabel1015j]

From a post on The Library discussion.........

I think Eleanor Roosevelt is the woman who should be on the $10 or $20 bill. She spent more years than almost any other PERSON in free service to the US and stood for all the values of our country, and for human rights around the world.

Rosa Rios, the treasurer of the US, came to the Alice Paul Institute to explain why the Treasury Dept is looking to put a woman on the $10 bill. They are working their way through the task of making currency more diffucult to fake and the ten dollar bill is the next in line to change, so it will be easy to change the design at the same time. She wouldn't  tell which woman they have decided on, but she said she thought we would be pleased. I wasn't in that meeting but my dgt and a good friend were. Also at the same meeting was the WOMAN who is the executive in charge of IT at the White House. I am pleased that there is beginning to be an "old girls club" at that level of our country.

[MaryPage]

Margaret Sanger was my top favorite, but Eleanor Roosevelt my second;  so I will be happy with her being on our ten dollar bill.

[mabel1015j]

Oh, I do thank Margaret Sanger for her good work every year on her birthday. Because of her my DH and I were able to restrict our number of children to two, replacements of us. Nobody talks about zero population growth these days. It's been forgotten. But I feel like we've done our little bit with MS's  work and Katherine McCormick's money to give us the birth control pill. I would probably have slit my wrists if I had gotten pregnant 4 or more times.

Jean

[kidsal]

Have been working of my genealogy and finding the women in the late 1700/1800s with 12 or more children.  Many of them died when having the last child.  Then apparently from the mid-1800s on the number dropped to 6 or 7.  Moved to town from the farms and didn't need that many children to help with the work?? My family (both sides) came here in the mid 1700s.  Farmers/millers.  Many of the children began to move westward through mid-west and on out to West coast.  By the time they reached the west the number of children had dropped to 5 or less.

[Steph]

When I was active in genealogy, the church records were so sad..The number of children who died at birth or around the first six months was astounding.. Had to be hard.. My grandmother lost five children to either stillbirth or early death. Later the reason was discovered in that my grandfathr who was considered delicate was really diabetic..

[MaryPage]

My paternal grandfather, the 5th of 11 children, was born in 1864.  His mother died at age 40 when her baby girl (who I was named for) was only 18 months old.  I have been extremely fortunate in that I have never had to "do" genealogy, but had it handed down to me intact, and I have even seen her scrapbook, which was full of newspaper clippings and other mementos.  Susan Gibbon Thornton Mason buried 3 of her 11 children.  Maggie, Susie and Pinckney.  They were 5 years old, 21 months old, and 5 months old.  They are under a little triangular tower-like stone (not a tall tower, but that is the only way I know to describe it) in the old family graveyard that was on the family plantation called Forest Hill in Fredericksburg, Virginia.
Yes, my great grandmother would have sat by oil lamp or candle at her desk or the dining room table, after the children were down for the night and cut out and pasted in these many items.  Lots were poetry of the day, sad poetry, poetry of little lifeless white hands and such.  Obituary poetry that was popular in the local town newspapers in those times of so much early death.

[MaryPage]

Back in the days when I was possessed of blooming good health and tons of energy, I used to travel down to Fredericksburg at least once a year.  Under Virginia law such graveyards must be preserved forever (yeah, forever! as if!), and so it is now fenced in and sits along a short country lane off a major road.  I know it well.  All around and about, up and down that major road, are subdivisions, one of which is called Forest Hill in memory of the plantation that once was there.  My son Chip shares my sense of the place, and nowadays he and a second cousin of mine from Baltimore go down, usually in these autumn months, and clip and clean up inside the fence.  In fact, Chip managed to get the worst case of poison ivy of his entire life (he is 51 now) a couple of years ago from doing that very thing!

[Steph]

I had a lot of direct line genealogy done, but I wanted information on all of the wives and so did a lot of that sort of work as well as becoming the go to person for Clute.. It was fun, but now with the internet and all of the misinformation,not so much.

[mabel1015j]

Great article about our perceptions of Hillary!

http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/why-arent-we-inspired-by-hillary-clinton?mbid=nl_092415_Daily&CNDID=38959653&spMailingID=8097827&spUserID=MTExMDk0NjYzMDk3S0&spJobID=762621330&spReportId=NzYyNjIxMzMwS0

[Steph]

I like Hilary, not as much as Elizabeth Warren but still.. but I worry about Bill, he cannot stand being out of the spotlight and that is a definite problem for her.

[MaryPage]

Elizabeth Warren is a great favorite of mine, as well and all.  I have been a fan since back years ago when Bill Moyers used to have her as a guest on his PBS show.  I credit him with letting me know about her.  I think she was just a Harvard professor in those years.  I want the Democrats to control the Senate again and make her Chairman of the Finance Committee.  Woo hoo!  Or Hilary can put her in charge of the nation's finances.

I do favor Hilary for president, but I love Bernie Sanders and adore Joe Footinhismouth Biden.  I just cannot bear the amount of insanity in this country that has made such a huge and obvious debut on the world stage by even suggesting Donald Trump for the role of number one world leader.  I blush.  We have, indeed, shown the entire planet that our wacky element is enormous and, I am much afraid, that we are not to be taken seriously.  Makes me want to go hide in the closet.  Chip and I have had very serious conversations about what in the world we could do and where in the world we might go if he is actually elected.  Back in the day, Canada would take us in a minute, but now they will not.  It would appear we may be stuck in the crazy house!

[Steph]

I love Joe, but oh my, he simply cannot stop...if it is in his brain, out it comes and that is not good. And this is from a girl who grew up in Delaware and has always admited him. Bernie.. a typical Vermonter,,

[mabel1015j]

O.k, o.k., o.k., I am poped out!!! He has said many good things, but his speech this morning was much about evangelizing........turned me off.

However, the biggest angst I am having at the moment is how many millions of our tax dollars are being spent on his visit!?! He just left the seminary where he stayed overnight. He was ferried to his next destination in the President's helicopter!?! Not only did he fly in the US govt helicopter, but there was, of course, a Marine Corps crew piloting it. AND accompanying that helicopter were two others, both US GOVT equipment, flying the American flag. I get the need for security and I was a bit miffed at all the money Phila is spending, but I assume they are recouping much of that from the 100s of thousand of visitors/shoppers that they have. But, the Vatican can't pay for their own helicopters??? My tax money is being used!?! So much for separation of church and state!

Jean

[MaryPage]

I see your point entirely, Jean, but I believe the protocol here is that Speaker Boehner, 3rd in line to the throne, as it were, and apparently able to put out such invitations entirely on his own initiative, according to all accounts I have been reading lately, INVITED this pope, as Head of State (the Vatican State)  to make this visit.  INVITED.  And assured The Vatican of complete security guaranteed by THIS country.

So We The People had no choice, upon the Pope accepting our gracious invitation, but to provide the security necessary.  Over and out to the security experts, and if they deemed it in our national interest to supply Marine helicopters for his transportation, they rule.

Personally, I think it money well spent, especially considering a number of factors that came out really big:  His Holiness takes the word of the scientists and fears global warming, Republican Catholics are now split on that subject and 3 fervent Catholics on the Supreme Court boycotted their Head of Church's appearance before the Congress, and it was, like it or not, the Leader of the Republican Party who set this whole thing in motion with his invitation!  What a puzzlement!  Personally, I think most Catholics will stick with the Pope and, in the long run, will vote Democratic.  Win lose, win lose, win lose, WIN!

[BarbStAubrey]

I also think there are so many that see the Pope as the head of a church - yes, he is that but he is also the head of a nation state - at one time the church was the Holy Roman Empire and over time significantly lost the territory it ministered over, much as USSR significantly lost territory when it was dissolved.

if you noticed the Pope was introduced in congress as head of the Holy See - The term "Holy See" is from the Latin Sancta Sedes, meaning “holy chair.” Holy See is the jurisdiction of the Roman Catholic Church. - Much like San Marino is a nation state or Luxembourg. If you compare the system used (the Curia) to govern it is a duplicate of the system used in Rome by the Caesars - yes, there is much politics that goes on so that this church is both a religious denomination and a political force as much as in Iran there is Ruhollah Khomeini both religious and political head of state.

Had Ruhollah Khomeini been invited to the US similar preparations for his safety and ability to visit members of his flock would have been arranged.   

[FlaJean]

Thanks for that info Barb and MaryPage.  I am not Catholic but have found the news coverage on the Pope's visit interesting.  I enjoyed his speech to Congress and found his gesture to give it in English thoughtful, especially as he has said how difficult English is for him.  I was able to follow him fairly easily.

[MaryPage]

One thing I find fascinating is that Francis is a Jesuit.  That is, he belongs to an all male group within the church known as The Society of Jesus.  This is newer than many of the other orders within the church, having been founded only in the 16th century.  I think of it as the brains of the church, and as such it has many times been on a collision course with various popes.  Some tried to stamp it out, unsuccessfully thank goodness.  Faith is supposed to trump intellect, you see.  I see it as nearly 500 years of struggle between those who believe we are not MEANT to know, but only to believe, and those who believe the way to achieve a complete understanding of God and Creation is to continue to learn all of our lives.  I have always been partial to the Jesuit view of things.

[Steph]

I have a good friend who was eduucated by the Jesuits..He is funny as he says, that some things never leave you and I know that his wife and I laugh occassionally, since he still feels that most people overdo... on everything. He is also a wonderful person to talk to since he is interested in everything in the world and curious about all cultures. I love to see them, since our converrsations keep me going for months.

[MaryPage]

The Jesuits practiced "Liberation Theology" in Latin and South America, and the Church came down on them for it because they showed some of the Big Wigs in the church as part of the movement to suppress the people and keep them in poverty.  This has been in our own time, as has the Jesuit wish NOT to cover up the rape of altar boys.  A bunch of Jesuits were murdered by the Army that was running El Salvador back in 1989.

[BarbStAubrey]

  The 'Big Wigs' are the conservative members of the Curia who are mostly Italian and as a body the Curia was not behind Vatican II - They wrote a doctrine they simply expected all the attending Bishops and Cardinals to blanket sign and when the conclave decided to use the opportunity to really look at the church they body went to town toppling the plan made by the Curia - however, many of those changes never saw the light of day or if they did, for a brief month or two because the power politics played by the Curia over shadowed and they were able to convince Pope after Pope ever since, the 'wisdom' of their ways.

This Pope Francis is the fist one to open the fault line and get the people behind him since John the XXIII who opened Vatican II - much of what we are finally hearing, including the issue of Birth Control was changed during Vatican II but was quickly buried by Pope Paul VI who was persuaded by the Curia to not only bury many changes but one of the agenda's from Vatican II was to reform and set up a monitoring system for the Curia and ultimately the Vatican Bank - yep, did not happen - the politics from the Curia was played well.

One way that Pope Francis is doing this is by going off script - he made at least 2 and maybe more unscheduled stops. One being after it was nixed Pope Francis went ahead and met with the sex abuse survivors. This man appears simple and loving but he is also smart as a tack and knows how to play the political game using his quiet power.

Right off the bat you knew something was going on when he chose to NOT live in the papal apartment - the papal apartment is not only bugged but Pope Benedict could not send out any messages or mail, including notes to his family without them being reviewed by the Cardinal Secretary of State or one of five others from the Curia.

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/index.htm 

[MaryPage]

I think the reason Pope Francis thinks he will not live much longer is that he thinks the Curia will manage to kill him.  I will always be convinced they killed John XXIII.

No one likes change just a whole lot.  We all appreciate SOME change, such as becoming a parent, stuff like that.  But change can be heartbreaking, as well.

Unfortunately, those who are mortally afraid that change will undermine their own positions of power will kill ruthlessly in order to attempt to preserve the status quo.  Too awful, but absolutely the case.

The Republican Party, for instance, has changed 180° since I was a dedicated worker in the GOP.  Today there is a clique there that feels they have guided the party to where their fondest dreams have wanted it to be, and now they will do anything, anything at all, to insure it does not return to Peace, Progress & Prosperity (Ike's rallying cry), not to mention moderation, compromise and good sense.

Actually, the Church has also changed mightily over the centuries, but the Curia is in total denial of the facts.  Was it The New Yorker that had an article recently by a reporter who visited the Vatican?  I was so nauseated by the description of a visit to a Prince of The Church (an ArchBishop, I believe) who lives in a magnificent apartment there and has TWO (2) life size portraits of himself in the foyer, a long hall full of photos of himself with all sorts of world famous people, and then another TWO (2) life size paintings in all his regalia in his parlor, where he greeted the reporter.  Shameless, is what!  Utterly shameless!  He is full of self love, and definitely not love of God!

But these types huddle together and plot against desperately needed changes.  This pope sees himself as a possible martyr to the cause of making this Faith more inclusive and more reflective of the preachings of Jesus of Nazareth.

[mabel1015j]

I believe this is the most intelligent, "20th century" pope (yes, I mean 20th) we have had since John 23rd, but he still leaves a lot to be desired, in my opinion. I liked a lot of what he said - golden rule, concern for sex abuse survivors, stamping out sex abuse, concern for refugees, being kind, ending capital punishment - all that good Christian philosophy.

His persona radiated over Philadelphia and the region. We have not heard of any problems among the almost 1million people who visited, even though they stood in line for 3 or 4 hours and even then some did not get into the mass and other events. Apparently friendliness and kindness prevailed.

I understand that he is the head of state of the Vatican, but much of what he did and said was as the head of the Catholic Church, decidedly religious. My concern was for taxpayer money being spent in support of the evangelism/proselytizing of a religion. Many of the events should have been paid for by the Church, not by the multireligious tax payers of the United States and being given the use of three govt helicopters is, in my opinion, way outside the bonds of separation of church and state. There was enormous support for religious events by government units at all three levels. Based on Supreme Court decisions, that was unconstitutional. I am absolutely in favor of freedom of, and from, religion, but not for government support of any religion, the religions must support themselves.

Imagine if the King of Saudia Arabia was making a "state visit" and spent three days involved in Muslim religious events and was given the governmental support that was given to the pope's visit! Oh, the outcry! And rightfully so. This is a constitutional issue for me, not an antireligious issue.

Yes, the Jesuits are the most appealing of all the religious segments of the Catholic Church, primarily for what Steph said about her friend being interested and intelligent about everything. 
Jean

[BarbStAubrey]

I think it is difficult to separate those countries that are religious centered - and I think the example of the Saudi Prince is a bit off the mark - he is not considered the head of the Muslims in Saudi Arabia but only rules by the precepts of the version of the Koran that speaks to Wahhabism. It is another who is The Mufti Of Saudi Arabia where as, Ayatollah Khomeini is the supreme leader of the Islamic Republic of Iran and if he came yes, he would be given similar perks.

However, the only reason we as a nation would be in an uproar is like comparing apples to oranges - those who slammed into the towers on 9/11 were Islamics and the last nearly 20 years of war took place in the middle east where our soldiers were killed or severely wounded - we have not been at war near or at war to support the Vatican leadership or territory - I think we could say that had the Emperor of Japan visited the US after WWII there would be a similar uprising here as if the Ayatollah was a state visitor.

I'm also thinking the money was well spent to have so many even for a bit of time look at their life in terms of being kind and helping as well as, being directed to understand others far more than the billions sent to Iraq an Afghanistan that ended up in a Swiss Bank. Yes, I think we got a lot more bang for our bucks that is a support to who we are as a nation.

I just think it is difficult for us to wrap our heads around a nation that is all about a state religion and is not a democratic nation  - but then we host those nations who gave us the concept of a rule of law and when they make a state visit they are ferried by plane to Canada, Calgary and many other locations outside of Washington.

[MaryPage]

My heart is totally with you in principle, Jean.  It is just that my practical side feels much relief that we were able to muster enough ways and means to keep a would be killer from getting to and doing away with this Head of State and World Religious Leader ON OUR PATCH.  We showed him impeccable hospitality and courtesy AND sent him safely intact back to his own patch.  Good on us!

[Steph]

I think the current pope is kind and caring and very very smart indeed. The Curia is so very powerful, but he seems to be making a wide loop around them. But in the end, he is carrying on the old old song of no women in importance at all and all of the old rules that were not there in the beginning of christianity, but were instituted by the Catholicsl.

[MaryPage]

I totally agree, Steph.  But he HAS set up that committee of eight to circumvent and, one hopes, clean out the Curia and the Vatican Bank eventually.  He has the power to make the Princes of the Church now.  I think he probably can do little about women until he has some priests in there of like minded thinking.  He DID manage to call off the dogs on the American nuns, dropping the investigation over two years before it was to have been completed.  I have hope, I have hope.  Not a whole lot, because I am one of those "don't sweet talk, but SHOW me" gals, but I do have a scintillation of hope.  If he lives.  There is the Big If.

Last week the third High School football player died this year.  Five died last year.  We did not truly know the annual numbers before:  no one was keeping track and it never got toted up.  Each heartbreak belonged just to the local community.  Now they are keeping a close eye on it.  And yes, each died directly as a result of playing that game.

The October 5th issue of TIME magazine (I gave up on Newsweek, which I much preferred, when they stopped printing.  I tried electronic, and just did not like it.) has a picture of this Pope on the front.  Inside they are saying that 96% of former NFL players test positive for brain disease.  NINETY-SIX PERCENT!  In my view, we might as well go back to building those weird buildings with many steps and have quick blood sacrifices at the top every year.  Same thing in the long run, when you think on it.  Except I would rather be dead in my prime were it quick than have my head messed up for decades to follow.  Football is, in the long run, a sacrifice of the players for the visceral excitement of the crowds.  As long as folk don't have to SEE or live with the damage.

In the same issue, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar writes a very sensible article about the growing belief among college students that exposure to anything that challenges their comfort zone of beliefs actually infringes on their rights!  So don't ask THEM to read a classic book that has something in it that upsets them!  Kareem calls this a War On Reason, and basically says if they don't want to read the books and develop the skills, they should not attempt to take the classes!  He also suggests we all keep up with FactCheck.  Me, I have it on my FAVORITES list and look every day.

Finally, the same issue of Time has an article about the guy who has made the dreadful videos (he, himself, admits there are more than one) that attempt to bring down Planned Parenthood.  He went at it over a period of years.  Time says:  "The recordings don't prove Daleiden's claim that Planned Parenthood profits from the sale of fetal body parts."  It speaks about the antiabortion group called Live Action and says:  "Live Action's recordings were often bogus."  It also says:  "Planned Parenthood executives repeatedly say in the videos that they don't profit from selling fetal organs."  Finally TIME says:  "Daleiden captured no such footage from the organization's clinics."

[MaryPage]

I have been following with close attention the congressional hearing today where Cecile Richards, President of Planned Parenthood, is testifying.  She was not subpoenaed, she is there entirely voluntarily.

One thing stands out as a glaring omission to me, and that is this:  opponents of PP keep referring, as indeed do the media, to government FUNDING of PP, as though it were a donation and PP is on the handout list.

This is far from the truth!  Our Federal Government GIVES no money, not one single penny, to PP.  PP offers many medical services to low income women.  Women who work minimum wage jobs to support themselves and their families, and have no health insurance.  They cannot go to the ER for birth control, excessive bleeding, lumps in breasts and/or abdomens, suspected venereal diseases, and so forth.  They MUST go to a clinic, and they go to the nearest one.  When this one is PP, all services given these women who COME UNDER MEDICAID and/or TITLE X are detailed as to expense and then submitted to the Federal Government for REIMBURSEMENT.  So we are talking perfectly normal funds under the Medicaid and/or Title X programs.  Obviously, when the clinic in question is NOT a PP clinic, exactly the same routine is followed.

So saying that the Federal Government is FUNDING PP is an outright lie!  A huge, humongous, gross contortion of the truth!

[mabel1015j]

Amen! Marypage! I have come to the conclusion that honesty is a lost art. I feel like I'm living in a society of mini-Hitlers whose philosophy is "tell a big lie, tell it often, and soon it is perceived as truth." AND. I feel like there are many people willing to receive those lies as truth. It concerns me greatly. The right-wing NAZIS started out as a fringe group also and slowly gained power and control. I've read and heard many discussions of "how could the Germans have let that happen?" We need to be diligent and remind people to use agencies like Factcheck.

Jean

[BarbStAubrey]