Author Topic: The Library (Read 2084677 times)

louisiana · « **Reply #16520 on:** February 08, 2016, 11:03:09 AM »

The Library

Our library cafe is open 24/7, the welcome mat is always out.
Do come in from daily chores and spend some time with us.

We look forward to hearing from you, about you and the books you are enjoying (or not).

Let the book talk begin here!

*Suggestion Box for Future Discussions
*SeniorLearn's Archives

Jane: I, too, use the Pilot Precise V5 -Extra Fine-pens and have done so for many
years.They are my favorite writing pen. I just get mine at Target.
I also watched the two-night airing of Madoff. Dreyfus did a magnificent job!.
JOY

pedln · « **Reply #16521 on:** February 08, 2016, 12:06:39 PM »

Jane, I've used those very same pens Precise V5 for years, ever since a colleague recommended them. Glad to hear they're available at WalMart. Maybe they'll be a little less than Staples.

Here's a Writers Guild of American interview with Ben Robbins about his writing the Madoff script. (Hope it works, I haven't done links for so long.) Marjifay, I"m waiting on the Netflix DVD too.

https://www.wgaeast.org/2016/02/interview-ben-robbins-madoff/

Tomereader1 · « **Reply #16522 on:** February 08, 2016, 12:15:27 PM »

Another pen I like very much is the Pilot B2P which is made from recycled bottles. It is available in different colors (ink), it is a gel roller, and writes smoothly. I have two that I have been using for about 1 1/2 years. You can get refills for them. (It uses the G2 smooth writing ink).
I get mine at the Walgreens drug store, but I think Walmart probably carries them.

Also, the Pentel EnerGel RTX liquid gel pen. Available in 0.7 medium point,and probably fine also. When I bought these at first, they came two pens with an included refill, but I think that was just during "school supply" season. (refills are LR7) Seems they come two in a package anyway. My husband loved the way they write, but he has a habit of putting them in his shirt pocket without clicking the point shut...guess what happens? Also, the pen has latex free grip. which would be nice for anyone with allergy to Latex.

Tomereader1 · « **Reply #16523 on:** February 08, 2016, 02:28:01 PM »

I want to ask a question, and couldn't really find a specific place to post it, so members of "The Library" get to weigh in.
In going through my old AOL Address Book, I found a plethora of names that I vaguely recognize, but am not sure if they were participants here or on S&F, or another website that I frequented awhile back (SYTYCD - So You Think You Can Dance). If I list the names/screen names, maybe someone can tell me if these folk are still with us, and still post:
gvines; HBKM0MDEE, Ginny Ann Jakob, Jan Birnie, Jan Clyde, JennyCrumiller, JoyNClarence, Judy Shernock, LeahLeo1, MargeAW, MgPersia, Miselle, Myrnart, RioGal64 and Traude.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #16524 on:** February 08, 2016, 03:31:51 PM »

Traude is no longer with us - do not remember when she passed - Ginny Ann I am not sure of - she was posting in Senior and Friends - her last post here was in 2010 - MyPersia no longer posts here - sort of remember Joy and Jenny and Jan Clyde and Judy Shernock but do not know where they are today.

PatH · « **Reply #16525 on:** February 08, 2016, 03:51:56 PM »

Judy Shernock is Jude S on this site, but she hasn't posted for a while.

I didn't know that Traude had passed away. She stopped posting some while ago because of vision problems.

maryz · « **Reply #16526 on:** February 08, 2016, 07:03:18 PM »

Our "Molly" in Bosom Buddies on S&F used to use the name Persia, I think.

I get Netflix streaming (not DVD). Maybe that's why it doesn't show up for me.

Tomereader1 · « **Reply #16527 on:** February 08, 2016, 07:14:32 PM »

Thanks for responses! I did check the Member Roster, and found about 5 of the names. I realize that many times, for whatever reasons, we have to change our screen name so that may explain why some don't show up as originally signed in.

ginny · « **Reply #16528 on:** February 08, 2016, 07:17:46 PM »

Barbara, I couldn't have said this better myself about Richard Dreyfuss as Madoff:

Fabulously acted, fabulous casting, fabulous story telling and a fabulous peek inside the banking and investment industry. I would like to see it again,

Absolutely right, me, too, and I agree with Joy, too:

I also watched the two-night airing of Madoff. Dreyfus did a magnificent job!.

He did!! I've never seen anything like it. That scene where he thought the jig was up and he just sort of visibly disintegrated mentally right before our eyes: just incredible.

I think it was Blythe Danner who played his wife so well, and I haven't seen her in years. Do you think she knew? Poor woman, the most hated woman in America, they say. I don't think she had a clue.

Marjifay and Mary and anybody else who gets to see it, I'd love to hear what you thought of it.

I loved Travels with Charley. In some ways the Alvin Straight story about the elderly man who couldn't get a driver's license who drove 240 miles on a riding lawnmower to see his estranged brother, from Iowa to...Michigan? was a lot like Travels with Charley and the people he met along the way. I loved that movie, too: The Straight Story.

I don't understand Madoff and his sons. Was he trying to protect them against his corruption? But the oldest, what a tragedy, became angry when others were promoted over him in the company. They really seemed, at least the oldest one did, to hate him. Can't quite reconcile that with the charming happy family man. Or was he?

I am so glad to see this discussion of pens!! I once borrowed one of those fluid type pens and have never found one again. NOW thanks to reading this discussion I know what it IS and I hope to find one! (Do they smear?)

Such a pleasure to use!

ginny · « **Reply #16529 on:** February 08, 2016, 07:20:28 PM »

Pedln, thank you for that wonderful article on the writing of the Madoff script!!! (And for the news I can get that pen at Staples. I have to go right by one on Wednesday).

jane · « **Reply #16530 on:** February 08, 2016, 08:12:16 PM »

Tomereader...email from me to you about several of those names.

Jane

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #16531 on:** February 09, 2016, 12:09:02 AM »

Its not exactly a throw away ball point but I love one of my Christmas presents - a Kate Spade New York pen - since the label was left on the box I know the price was $36 - mine is in fun colors of a bright peony pink for the cap and a sherbet orange for the base of the pen - looked them up on Amazon and they come in several delicious color combinations that make them fun to write with. The ball point is smooth and I am delighted.

mabel1015j · « **Reply #16532 on:** February 09, 2016, 12:25:36 AM »

The Madoff show was very good. I don't think Mrs Madoff knew anything, her title in the company was simply ceremonial. I think he did not tell his sons because he knew they were more ethical than he was and would blow up, just like they did. He couldn't justify what he was doing.

Blythe Danner had one speech that indicated he hadn't ever had a good relationship with the sons and didn't the oldest son say something to that effect? It appeared to me that he was always working. Now I was not paying 100% attention 100% of the time, so I may have misinterpreted.

Jean

Steph · « **Reply #16533 on:** February 09, 2016, 09:17:33 AM »

When we had the rv, we used to think of ourselves as following his path. In a RV a long road trip is heaven, you can stop here and there and meet lovely people and do things you had never considered doing at home.. I do miss it so much.

Jonathan · « **Reply #16534 on:** February 09, 2016, 11:50:27 AM »

It was only a buck, but my Pentel, R.S.V.P, Fine, is a pleasure to use. Penmanship has always been an art form for me, so I love getting handwritten stuff. Every letter gets an evaluation. This one's an abstract. That one's impressionistic. And this one...dear me...my friend's fingers must be hurting....

I'm sorry I missed the Madoff thing with Richard Dreyfuss. Must see. In the meantime I've started reading The Wizard of Lies. What an amazing story. Madoff knew the game was up with the financial crash going on around him, quickly wrote cheques for family and friends for several hundred million and fessed up. Who knew what in the family? Everyone could be expected to lie about how much they knew. No?

Thanks, Ginny, for putting me onto the Straight Story. I love it. I've watched it several times. That's the way I want to go. With truth and reconciliation. On an open road.

Tomereader1 · « **Reply #16535 on:** February 09, 2016, 12:40:53 PM »

Just a general "thank you" to all who responded to my questions regarding past/present members' screen name. I can now edit my
Address Book.

Steph · « **Reply #16536 on:** February 10, 2016, 09:53:59 AM »

Hmm, I am a minority since I feel that Mrs. Madoff knew what was what.. Maybe not the boys,, and they all cashed the checks and bounced the money so they are all rich. Sad but true.

Tomereader1 · « **Reply #16537 on:** February 10, 2016, 12:17:45 PM »

Reboot on Pens: How many remember when it was all the rage to have Esterbrook pens, even pen and pencil sets? I still have mine!

ginny · « **Reply #16538 on:** February 10, 2016, 05:00:34 PM »

Jonathan, how do you like the Madoff book? Is it well-written? I have the Wizard of Lies coming but it isn't here yet.

Stephanie, they aren't rich. The oldest boy killed himself when his four-year-old daughter was sued to recover monies that they thought he had. The youngest boy died of cancer. Mrs. Madoff, called the most hated woman in America, is not living well. Usually when these things happen it's the family that suffers too.

It's a tragedy of Shakespearean proportions.

Steph · « **Reply #16539 on:** February 11, 2016, 07:57:45 AM »

I guess I am mostly sorry for all of the people who had faith in him and lost everything.. Also I cannot believe the boys and wife did not realize anything.. You cannot live like they did and not suspect anything. Sorry..

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #16540 on:** February 11, 2016, 12:34:41 PM »

Ancient Greek manuscripts reveal life lessons from the Roman empire

http://tinyurl.com/jpfqvej

ginny · « **Reply #16541 on:** February 11, 2016, 01:16:30 PM »

Oh fabulous, Barbara, thank you for this. I love The Guardian and wish I subscribed to it. Would you put this in the Metamorphoses, too?

I dunno, Stephanie, I'm reading the book to find out. The movie indicated not.

Jonathan · « **Reply #16542 on:** February 11, 2016, 03:00:58 PM »

'I cannot believe the boys and wife did not realize anything..'

'I dunno, Stephanie, I'm reading the book to find out. The movie indicated not.'

The Wizard of Lies is a good read, Ginny. Naturally I wondered too, about how much the family knew. The fraudulent business had been going on for so many years how could they not know. The author, very well informed and having interviewed Madoff herself, found him to be equally eloquent when speaking the truth or lies.

JoanK · « **Reply #16543 on:** February 11, 2016, 04:12:44 PM »

I don't know, it's easy not to know what you don't want to know. If he was able to convince so many people he was legit, surely he could convince his family if he wanted too.

He could have even convinced himself. Ponzi schemes always crash eventually. Had he made plans to get out of Dodge quickly when that happened? Maybe he had convinced himself he could keep it going forever and everyone would benefit. We all want to think we're good people, and believe incredibly unbelievable things if they justify what we are doing. Look at all the stories made up to justify slavery.

JoanK · « **Reply #16544 on:** February 11, 2016, 04:41:47 PM »

Another example: I like to watch Peoples court: small claims court cases. Almost every episode, there's a case where someone has borrowed money from a friend and not paid it back. the conversation goes:

JUDGE: why didn't you pay her back?

Defendant: I was going to pay her, but she was harassing me. I'm not going to give money to a harasser!(Often he will have filed a countersuit for harassment).

Judge: How was she harassing you?

D: she was calling every day, asking for her money! (At that point, the audience always laughs and D looks puzzled with a "What's so funny expression".)

This happens time after time.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #16545 on:** February 11, 2016, 05:22:15 PM »

From what I could see the boys were so busy making their mark in the ligament side of the business - added to the admiration most children have for their father, especially a successful father, just the seductive dance the new daughter in law has with the father suggests she too was bowled over by his success and we read his charm that you can only imagine anyone especially someone you admire as acting within your imagination of what could exist therefore, what you image of a successful father who must be as honorable as you, if not more since he was a hero to these boys. I think they were in shock and it was obvious the eldest was outraged and angry and wanted protection learning the rug was pulled out from under him.

As to the wife she knew so little about the business that it would have had to be explained to her - she was not a math head or involved even in the sons activities that were legit - it was made simple in the movie so we could understand but the process was not really explained so that if we were not told in the movie or the headlines from years back we would have no clue just as today we have no clue how the big banks are doing exactly the same thing - it takes reading some of these expose's and even then most of it goes over my head and it takes someone saying out and out that this or that is illegal.

I think for our own feeling of security we would like to think we could be wiser or we could not be fooled - I learned my lesson in life - you sure can be fooled big time - it is called being betrayed - the family was betrayed the investors were betrayed and we are today being betrayed but no one does anything to stop it because the big betrayal means the entire financial system comes tumbling down just as Madoff - the 2004 meltdown was averted but it was a similar tumble to Madoff when he did not have the backing to continue his investment scheme.

From Real Estate loans I know that all loans greater than 80% of value are insured - that is more than half the loans - just in Austin alone we close on average over 29,000 homes a month of which a majority carry loans greater than 80% - once the insurance on those loans are collected over a short time that is large sums of money that is not going to sit in a locked box - so that money is invested and then the profits from that investment is invested on and on it goes - we have a Ponzi scheme -

Then at the bottom of this stack if you have multiple foreclosures you need that money to pay off the loans being foreclosed which were covered by the insurance that was the fist layer however, that money is tied up in another investment and the profit from that is tied up and on and on so that there is no money to bail out the first investor and the whole thing starts to tilt than tumble - That is the way wall street markets work - it is all a Ponzi scheme only Madoff did not join in with the rest of the stock market having created his own investments and so he had no government backing that bailed him out.

ginny · « **Reply #16546 on:** February 11, 2016, 07:29:22 PM »

That's well said, Barbara. I would bet anybody here a lunch that the wife knew nothing whatsoever. These high rollers and movers and shakers are not confiding everything to the "little woman" every night. That's for soap operas. According to the movie he was spending most of his time with one of many mistresses anyway.

She says herself in the movie, "I'm on the Board and all I do is pick out curtains," or something like that, in telling her oldest who was angry he was not being promoted to the point he would have known something. That type of thing was common once a long time ago in business. I didn't know it still was. I think the laws changed. I doubt sincerely Madoff did.

I am not sure if Madoff is capable of telling the truth any time about anything. I think he's what Richard Dreyfuss said: a sociopath. He may have been charming. I don't think he considered anything but himself, I've now got the book, and like Jonathan, I'm reading it to find out what it says.

I think he's a pathological liar and his wife had no idea. How could she know the inner workings of an entire floor that needed a secret password to even enter? And I hate he cheated all those people: so he's in jail for 150 years. She is not. Neither were her children. I don't see compounding the injury by blaming it on those who had nothing to do with it. I really think she has suffered enough.

Dana · « **Reply #16547 on:** February 12, 2016, 12:26:15 PM »

She might have known and not known....like women who give birth and didn't know they were pregnant, I've see a few of these, amazingly enough. That's the most dramatic example I can think of.

If people weren't all consumingly greedy they wouldn't get burned but who can resist making a buck....

Steph · « **Reply #16548 on:** February 12, 2016, 02:15:53 PM »

I think there is a huge gap between knowing and admitting it and knowing and pushing it away. Because of what my husband did, I knew a lot of high rolling types.. The wives love to roll their eyes and go " Oh, poor me, I have no idea how he makes the money" Bah.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #16549 on:** February 12, 2016, 02:50:17 PM »

“For there to be betrayal, there would have to have been trust first.”

“Everyone suffers at least one bad betrayal in their lifetime. It’s what unites us. The trick is not to let it destroy your trust in others when that happens. Don’t let them take that from you.”

“And what does anyone know about traitors, or why Judas did what he did?”

“BETRAYAL... No failure in Life, whether of love or money, is ever really that simple; it usually involves a type of a shadowy betrayal, buried in a secret, mass grave of shared hopes and dreams.

That universal mass grave exists in a private cemetery that... both those suffering from the loss, but especially those committing the betrayal, refuse to acknowledge its existence.

When you realize you've been deeply betrayed, fear really hits you. That's what you feel first. And then it's anger and frustration. Then disappointment and disillusionment."

“Betrayal is common for men with no conscience.”

ginny · « **Reply #16550 on:** February 13, 2016, 10:23:27 AM »

Dana, I have never understood how people can give birth without knowing they were pregnant, does the baby never kick?

On Ruth Madoff, I truly don't see how she could have had the slightest idea. I read something yesterday about the difference in a psychopath (violence) and a sociopath...the article said (and it's probably not true) that the sociopath does not see others, he's focused only on himself. The people who worked there, except for those involved on the 17th floor, didn't know. She didn't come to work there, why would she?

Stephanie, I have a feeling the people who told you that were probably telling the truth. I can't imagine a conversation where that subject would come up, tho.

I'm enjoying the book. It's not a puff piece, it's serious journalism so it's taking a while to get through. Ponzi schemes apparently by their very nature are secretive, as they keep saying one phone call would have exposed the entire thing. I don't think he told a soul except those needed to carry out the fraud. I am interested to find out how many of them were fined or sentenced. I think the man who headed it up who thought he was Bernie's friend (and who had a rude awakening when it all started to slide) died. I wonder exactly how many on that 17th floor knew?

The movie acted like the woman who was the "runner" from Bernie's office to the guy in charge did know. She shot anxious looks at the oldest son when he sort of forced his way in there right behind her and her secret password when the door opened to try to see what was going on. But he saw nothing more than an entire floor of people working at their desks, nothing unusual.

Robert De Niro is about to do a version of this too. The Dryfuss one beat him to it. He's a tremendous actor, wouldn't it be something if both of them were up for Best Actor for the same portrayal? I haven't seen DeNiro's yet, but he's never bad. But Dryfuss would be hard to follow. Turns out Dryfuss and Madoff were originally from the same place in Brooklyn: Bayside, if I have that right.

Dana · « **Reply #16551 on:** February 13, 2016, 10:57:10 AM »

Most people are able to hold two contradictory beliefs, to know yet not know, about painful stuff.
The denial of pregnancy is a pretty extreme example. Pregnancy might be rationalized as putting on weight, and abdominal discomfort as indigestion. Surprisingly family often collude, a kind of folie a deux or trois or whatever.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #16552 on:** February 13, 2016, 12:10:34 PM »

Betrayal is difficult and few of us like to acknowledge that we could be a victim so we are certain we could detect a secret held especially by a close family member - watching the mother of one of the Columbine killers on the Diane Sawyer interview last night it was easy to see how we do not know - she struggled all these years to examine every aspect of her life mothering her son trying to see the how and why, assuming it was because of her mothering and yet, she had no idea of his private diary brought to her years later by the FBI after they were finished with the investigation or that he and a friend had a stash of guns purchased by a fellow female students for them, again learning of this from the photos taken by the FBI and not shared till the investigation was complete.

Those who act in ways that they want to hide are very secretive and often create some sort of other issue that keeps the real secret from detection.

Mrs. Madoff was more outraged when she learned of his unfaithful behavior - my guess is that it was easier to feel wounded over than the complete shock of the financial scheme -

There is a great book about this that I read some years ago - Too Scared to Cry - the book followed for years the lives of the 20 some folks in California who as children were in a school bus that was kidnapped and buried under tons of earth - forgot how long it was before the bus and the children were found - some of the children had an immediate reaction - some felt guilty they froze and did nothing to stop what was happening - some never acknowledged what happened as if their memory was wiped clean, some only felt and showed difficulty years later when they had their babies - on and on the various ways that these now grown up children reacted to this trauma - and so it soon became apparent that we can only imagine and therefore expect another to react as our imagination allows where as in reality there are so many ways to react that we could never guess all of them.

Steph · « **Reply #16553 on:** February 13, 2016, 02:59:14 PM »

I still think that you know but dont know is the answer for a lot of bad stuff in life. I always knew what my husband did,, he loved to talk of it.. I also was in one heck of a lot of conversations over the years where they all discussed what they did. The interesting thing about Mrs. Madoff.. Did she give up the apartments, houses and tons of money that he gave to her??? I dont honestly know, but if she voluntarily gave it up, then I would be willing to agree that she did not know and was trying to do better..

ginny · « **Reply #16554 on:** February 14, 2016, 10:37:27 AM »

Happy Valentine's Day, everybody. What a fascinating thing this Madoff case is.

Stephanie, she was offered a civil suit (because they had nothing criminal against her) in which she would give up all her properties and houses, 80 million dollars in assets, the boats, the cars, the furniture, the art, her handbags, her jewelry, her china, "She would be giving away every treasured thing she had thought was hers."

They were married almost 50 years. The Ponzi scheme had run for 20. In return for her total surrender of everything she owned she would hand over 80 million dollars in assets. She would be allowed to keep 2.5 million dollars from the first 30 years of her marriage.

Everything personal down to hankies, etc., socks, bedroom shoes, anything that would sell, was auctioned off by US Marshals. All insured and uninsured personal property: everything they owned was auctioned. She kept used golf shoes, three used golf gloves, 30 miscellaneous used golf balls, 7 Ella Fitzgerald stamps found in a purse, and a 30 year old fur coat the US Marshal said they didn't think they could get a dollar for. The US Marshals made the decision on what sold.

She lost both her sons, one to suicide, one to cancer. She lost her husband when it was revealed he had lied to her too about mistresses. She lost her grandchildren because her sons sided against her for visiting her husband when he was attacked in prison, and told her to choose between them.

She lost her entire world.

ginny · « **Reply #16555 on:** February 14, 2016, 12:46:15 PM »

In other news, yesterday my grandson came and later happily seettled down in the living room with my Ipad and FIFA 16 and so I thought well why not me, too, so I sat down too with my new Little Dribbling by Bill Bryson and what an enjoyable vicarious jaunt that was. I laughed out loud so many times he looked up but what I really enjoyed most were the descriptions of his walks throughout England and the memories it brought me and the simultaneous desire to pack my bags and go .

I love the way he sprinkles throughout things I did not know. For instance he visited the home of Lord Leighton, the painter, gave a history of it, and it was absolutely fascinating.

Then he took off on Mt. Everest and the man it was named for, George Everest, who did not pronounce it like we did but rather like EVE as in Adam and Eve if I understood that properly, EVE vrest. He never got near Mt. Everest and the reason it's named for him is a Valentine in itself: a little thing you now know that most don't.

He travels like I do, wandering thru the pathways of the UK with the walking guides in hand, getting lost. If I had a dollar for every sheep fold of....er...muck...I've slopped thru and every farmer's barn I ended up in and every dead end I've gotten lost in, I'd be rich. He talked about attack cows, too.

He points out the UK is the only country (is he right? ) with these public footpaths. I must get in shape and walk them again. Even if I don't get to do it tho, his book is as good as being there.

Tremendously enjoying it.

Steph · « **Reply #16556 on:** February 15, 2016, 08:42:59 AM »

Thanks Ginny. I am glad that at least some of the money lost by so many good people could be returned. She sounds like a good woman, who did not notice and really should have.. But that is over and I feel sorry for her grief over her children. The grandchildren may return to her when they get older. Many many grandparents that I know who have had problems with their children discover that the grandchildren have minds of their own and seek out their grandparents as they grow older.
Ah, the back paths of GB.. I have also heard they are the only country to have this, but never checked.I do know a couple who spent every summer when they were younger is a teeny caravan trolling the back roads of Scotland all free except for gas.

JoanK · « **Reply #16557 on:** February 17, 2016, 04:46:04 PM »

I was impressed when I was in England at what walkers the English are. that was a generation or two ago: I hope it's still true. (Not so good for us American slugs. I learned the hard way that when a Brit said "oh, it's not far -- you can walk", to find out exactly how far it was).

rosemarykaye · « **Reply #16558 on:** February 18, 2016, 03:00:34 AM »

Well there are plenty of couch potatoes this side of the Atlantic, unfortunately - but also plenty of walkers. Maybe it's easier for us in that distances between places are generally shorter?

In Edinburgh almost everyone walks everywhere because driving is horrendous and very slow, and parking is almost impossible and hugely expensive - plus our traffic wardens are notoriously keen! You even see smartly dressed women marching into the centre wearing their trainers or running shoes, with a pair of stilettoes in their bag for when they get there - no-one sane would walk in heels in Edinburgh, as we have so many hills and staircases, and so many cobbled streets.

Organisations like the Ramblers Association have always been strong throughout the UK, and I've noticed that there's been a big renewal of interest in them recently - there are lots of walking groups in the city and many of them are so oversubscribed that they've started extra groups or closed their lists - people (including young people, whereas before the Ramblers - a radical group in the 1950s I believe - had become the preserve of the middle-aged/elderly) want to get out of the city, we all have these dreams of living in a rural idyll (one which no longer exists unless you have a lot of money and probably also a flat in town).

Walking holidays are also extremely popular, both in the UK and abroad - again things like Holiday Fellowship used to be seen as slightly geeky and middle-aged, but all these companies have reinvented themselves, and many more have appeared on the scene, and they all seem to be doing well. I have several female friends who go on these trips regularly - they are also great holidays for single people, and as the proportion of people living alone continues to grow they are bound to become more and more popular - it's something you can do without feeling the need for a partner. I'd do one myself if I had the time! I'm also slightly worried about the toilet arrangements...

Having said all this, the UK (and especially Scotland) has a massive problem with obesity and obesity-related disease, same as most other Western countries. Many people are taking no exercise at all, and I have to say a lot of these walking groups and trips are still largely made up of the more affluent/better educated sectors of society, which is a shame. There are, however, health initiatives in the less affluent parts of the city that have started up local walking groups, and I've heard these are getting popular too.

And Ginny I love Bill Bryson! Also, we've just had a very interesting series on TV about the making of our canal system (which had fallen into disrepair after the war, but is now enjoying a great new life as a holiday option) - I bought the book for my husband and now he's very keen to do another narrowboat holiday this summer. It'll be just me and him, so I'd better get my lock-opening skills up to speed...

Rosemary

Steph · « **Reply #16559 on:** February 18, 2016, 09:01:30 AM »

I had the narrowboat routes on my bucket list for years, as well as the canal boats in France and Holland, but alas with just me, not going to happen. We saw a lot of fun type holidays on the barges in Holland. They take bikes with them and you can bike to the new destination each day as you want or not.. Looked like a lot of fun.

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Author Topic: The Library (Read 2084677 times)