The Library

[ginny]

The Library Our library  is open 24/7; the welcome mat is always out. Do come in from daily chores and spend some time with us.

[ginny]

Sorry, had to go out. Well this is new for  us, and a lot depends on how the participants want it to go. I'm open to anything but  I thought for starters,  being a Mini discussion,  we'd read the book in its entirety before the 19th and then, like a face to face book club, we can talk about what struck us, there will be some questions or topics to start, but anybody can bring up anything, and we can go from there. Does that  make sense?

Great question, I should have laid that out first, but this is new to me, too, and I am excited to see how the group wants to design  this first one, and what suits us  the best. There will doubtless be people who participate in face to face discussions who do an entire book in one session who will  have suggestions as well , which we can then discuss and adapt if we like,  to our format here online. It's new, and it should be a lot of fun.

[Jonathan]

'Which of the two, Vronsky or Levin, is best suited for her, Kitty?

Wonderful question, Bellamarie. I've just finished reading the section on the decision-making problem. Great writing. We started out with Dolly realizing she had made the wrong decision by marrying Oblonsky. I'm delighted to find myself reading this book. It will probably take me as long to read it as it took Tolstoy to write it...four years. It seems that complex a society.

You must look for Sofia Tolstoy's diaries. They have quite a story to tell. What an amazing couple. With both wondering, no doubt, if they had made the right decision by marrying each other. What an opening line: '...each unhappy family is unhappy in its own way.'

I'm reminded of reading Educated. For that matter, Tolstoy reminds me a little of Gene Westover, Tara's father, with some of his religious notions, and home education for his children. Sofia taught her large family at home, under father's supervision. I've just put a hold on the DVD based on The Last Station, on the last year of Tolstoy's life, when he left home, leaving a miserable wife behind. He had the whole world at his dying bedside.

[Frybabe]

Ginny, I am back to listening to Goldworthy's Caesar again and am loving going over the campaigns we read about in Caesar's Gallic Wars. With Goldworthy's telling, I actually felt a bit sad about the falling out that Labienus had with Caesar and his ultimate fate at Mundus. Too bad there wasn't more info that survived about their relationship and Labienus' eventual defection to Pompey's camp.

I won't be participating in the mini-discussions as neither book hold any interest to me. My reading plate is pretty full what with the reading challenge, the two Great Courses on Physics I am starting this week, and my monthly Lending Library book. 

[ginny]

 Yes, one of the great mysteries of History, that the general  Labienus, even though rewarded with the Governorship of Gaul, apparently felt that was not enough, and that while Caesar lived his own ambitions to be top man (?!?) would never be satisfied.

Tyrell's account of it is available free  in pdf,
if interested:   https://msu.edu/~tyrrell/Labienus.pdf

[Jonathan]

Hi, Ginny. I'm looking forward to the mini series. I can look forward to rereading both books, churning stomach and all. Educated is still on the bestseller list. And the Ishiguro is such a well written tale. I'm not surprised that you found something new in rereading it.

Bellamarie, I've read the first 25 chapters. What a supreme storyteller!

[Frybabe]

Oh, Thanks Ginny. Tyrell's account was mentioned somewhere when I went hunting for more info. Yes, it doesn't make a lot of sense, does it. Caesar was lining Labienus up to follow him up the ladder. Why would he go back to Pompey unless his political views were more attuned to the Republic and the Pompey faction? I have to find out, if I can, why he left Pompey in the first place. I can't remember if it was a shifting of a legion or two to help Caesar in Gaul, or if he pulled up stakes and shifted over to Caesar on his own. If so, why? I can tell I am on one of my mini-quests again.

Which reminds me, I still have not gotten back to the book on the first Bulgarian Empire which had me on all kinds of searches.

[bellamarie]

Jonathan, you have passed me up by a few pages, I am still on chapter 24, where poor Kitty is enamored with Anna, only now that Vronsky has his eyes set only on Anna, and is seeming to ignore Kitty at the ball, Kitty is finding it very stressful and hurtful.  Oh dear, will Kitty have to settle for Levin?

Ginny, I will be excited for the June mini discussion.  It seems Jonathan and I have our very own going on as we speak, with Anna Karenina, only we are reading it at our own pace, and discussing as we go along.  No set time or sections.  Please remind me of the book we will be reading in June.  I did finish Educated, and yes, it takes a strong stomach to digest that book.  Glad I read it, but would not necessarily recommend it, but yes, it is ALL the rave.  My friend was on the library list for it and was #65, so I let her have mine so she could be ready for her book club discussion.  She was not at all thrilled with the book either.  But, yes, let's discuss it in July.

Frybabe, Wow!  You sure sound like your plate is full for the summer.  I am impressed how you have tackled that reading challenge for the year.  I so wish Barb could be with us, I know how she looked forward to sharing this with you.

PatH., So it seems we are to read the entire book, then be ready for what ever format works for us come June 19th.  Sounds like fun!     

 

[hats]

Good morning everybody! Well, I am not ashamed to admit it. I have been reading The Piano Tuner by Daniel Mason. I first read it here or heard of the title here on Senior Learn. I had a yearning to revisit Burma. When I first began the novel, it seemed so familiar. I started to stop reading it. Then, it all seemed forgotten and too wonderful not to read again. Daniel Mason certainly has a way of putting you in the center of a location and feeling it.

I am also reading a Mystery by a Robert Harris. The title is Claude Monet: The Pilfered Paintings. It is delightful. I would love to know what made him think of Claude Monet as a Detective. This is the first case Claude Monet is striving to solve. He has become a bit tired of painting Water Lilies. I hope the author plans to write more ebooks with Claude Monet as the Detective.

[ginny]

Super news, Jonathan and Bellamarie on the June Mini Discussion for June 19.  The name of the book is The Remains of the Day by Kazuo Ishiguro.

On Educated, that's an interesting point, and I think we should start with IT on July 19, because I don't think she expected anybody to like it, actually,  but I'm not sure anybody else agrees with that assessment, so we should really have a great discussion on it. I'm not going to reread it like Jonathan is, once was enough, but am going to do like people do in face to face book club discussions, go on my first  impressions. Why not? It's summer, the living is easy,  and I'd like to try that once, too, just to see how IT feels, lots of experiments this summer.

We will definitely start with a framework for Remains, but let's see how that is received, and we can go from there, off the cuff. I've been looking at all the other book clubs on the internet, there seem hundreds of them. When we started there was us....then there was Oprah and us...actually we started somewhat together,  about a week or so first, but that's all,  and now there are apparently billions:  themed bookclubs, bookclubs with a fee which send you the book monthly,  bookclubs of every kind.  All seem to require registration, without which you can't read them, that's different, but  which seems fair, too many wanted my phone number (nope), several made me nervous but there's no doubt that the world of "bookclubs" has been taken over by people who are making money at it...lots of author participation, it's something else. Tara Westover was interviewed by one, I'd have loved to have been in that one.

At any rate I was unable to even READ an actual  book club  discussion without this login so I turned to a library and got some really good tips on this Mini format which I'd like to start with and see what WE make of it.  WE will decide later on the procedure but we have to start somewhere so we will. June 19.

Hey, Hats! I did not know Robert Harris had written that! It sounds good, and I am glad to see him getting off the Romans for a while! Good to see you!

[ginny]

Oh Bellamarie, I forgot to ask. I have been wondering all this time which countertop you picked? If you have said and I missed it, I apologize, but I saw you say you had made the decision and then wondered what it was?

[bellamarie]

Ginny, Yes, my kitchen remodel is finished and I went with high resolution laminate.  After weeks of research, comparing quality, prices, and worry free living with it, I decided I just didn't like granite at all, quartz did not have the color I wanted (I must have looked at a thousand online and in stores), and then I fell in love with the perfect color for my kitchen.  I watched a video on design and decorating, and what really helped me make my choices on my kitchen was the designer said, "Do what YOU like, don't go with trends because they will fade out, and you will be left with what seems like an outdated room."  I had NO theme, I just wanted simple and serene, after having a Tuscan theme wallpaper, and darker colors.  It's exactly what I hoped for!  Here is the finished look.  Thank you for asking.

 

[bellamarie]

Ginny,  I just joined my fourth online book club yesterday, and yes, there are tons out there.  Mine are all through Facebook, no fees, no infromation, no logging in except for being logged into FB.  I can say the person in charge of a couple do not keep up with it as well as we have here.  They are very flexible in their formats.  I just joined one that is only Jane Austen books, we are discussing Sense and Sensibility presently.  My other one is beginning Where the Crawdads Sing, and the other one, we are discussing Firefly Lane, and of course in this one at present, Jonathan and I are discussing Anna Karenina.

I would love to discuss Educated, when ever you and others are ready.  I will get The Remains of the Day and begin reading it.  What ever format works is fine with me.  I have learned to .... go with the flow!

hats,  Both of your books sound interesting.  I finished a book called Still Life by Louise Penney that sounds similar to your book, Claude Monet: The Pilfered Paintings.  It too was a detective mystery, and art was involved.

There is just not enough waking, free hours in a day for me and my books!  I stumbled across a reality show on Bravo called Southern Charm, which began it's sixth season, so I of course had to binge watch from season one to catch up. I am ashamed to admit I have been up til the wee hours of the night, or breaking morning, hooked on this crazy show.  Watching reality shows are much like reading a series of books, you get caught up in the plot and their lives,  you can't wait to see what happens next.  Ho, hum... and so my summer begins.

[hats]

Ginny and Bellamarie Is he the same Robert Harris??? I am not sure. The kitchen is lovely. Wow! I am so glad you showed it. I hope you enjoy it for many, many years.

[PatH]

Bellamarie, that's gorgeous.  It's exactly what I like in a kitchen: simple lines and lots of lightness.  It's also a nice efficient design for working.  I don't like granite either; it's silly to use a material that's so easily stained and needs so much care for something that gets such hard use as a countertop.

[ginny]

 How pretty, Bellamarie! Thank you for those photographs, I love the color combinations, as Pat says, so bright,  and the shot towards the door looks so CLEAN, which is how one wants a kitchen to look. It's really quite lovely. Looks picture perfect, if you ever wanted to move, that would be a perfect kitchen to present a buyer.

I like white on the counters, too. I was curious because I've  had the white Corian for some time and I like it, you can put a hot pot on  it with no effect (which people say you can't do and has been done here, unfortunately many times). Not what I particularly think should be done but things happen in kitchens over time,  don't they? Especially in farm kitchens, there's way too much going on.

 The only problem I have had is when people for some  unknown reason like to use it as a cutting/ chopping  board, (not recommended by anybody sane) which then has apparently resulted in some faint, very faint,  but visible if you insist on looking closely,  tiny marks on it, but being a solid surface they are easily sanded out. I like that feature: just buff it right out.  The sinks are also part of the counter,  and while pretty, do stain, but they also can be fixed with Soft Scrub. Not sure you should stand in them to wash windows though they have never faltered yet, though  I don't  know why not. I'm pretty sure that's also something nobody should ever do, there's nothing under them as a support.

 I've really had them a long time and they've held up well but I hear some of the stone surfaces do not, so I was curious as to what's the latest thought, and you seemed to have put a lot into it.

With a perfect ending!

[bellamarie]

Thanks all, I really am very happy with the end results of the kitchen. 

Ginny, we looked into the Corian, and I liked it a lot.  For the price difference and quality, the high resolution laminate just happened to have my color, "sand." My floors and cupboards did not need to be replaced, so the light natural colors of browns, tans, off white and white worked perfectly.  It's funny you mention standing in sinks, and how they don't have much support.  When the plumbers replaced my sink, the counter had rotted and crumbled from age and moisture, to the point my sink could have fallen in at any time.  So that is why we had to do new counters/remodel.  I was thinking about resale value, which was a factor in my choice of lighting, etc. I was hooked on watching The Property Brothers, so it helped me in knowing what I liked and did not like, and what buyers look for.  PatH., yes, exactly what I love, "simple lines and lots of lightness."

I downloaded the audio The Remains of the Day.  Going to see how I like listening to it. 

[Jonathan]

A beautiful kitchen, Bellamarie. That was good advice from your designer. May you and yours enjoy that family space for many years to come. I enjoy working at my kitchen table. I have a southern exposure, very sunny, with a good view of all the fresh neighborhood greenery. Spring is always a bit of a miracle in Canada.

And I admire your impressive immersion in books and reading clubs. Isn't it fun. I also had half a dozen books going before taking on Tolstoy. Just back from the library, after picking up the movie based on Jay Parini's The Last Station. And last night I watched another film based on Anna Karenina, with Greta Garbo as Anna. What a heartbreaking story. And I'm getting right along with the book. I plan to reread War and Peace. I can't help thinking that AK should have been titled '...and...' as a reflection of Russian domestic life, as War and Peace was on a much broader theme.

[Frybabe]

Lovely, Bellamarie. I like a bright kitchen to work in.

This is my current read. Garden of Eternal Mists by Tan Twan Eng  https://www.theguardian.com/books/2012/aug/24/garden-evening-mists-tan-twan-eng-review Responding to the reviewer's last comment, sometimes bland is good. This is one of them .  So far, I have not found the presence of the Pretorius family "awkward" nor the characters overall "unappealing" as another reviewer asserted. And here I find that HBO is making it into a movie. https://bookstr.com/article/hbo-to-adapt-malaysian-novel-the-garden-of-evening-mists/

[hats]

Frybabe, I like the link. The book title is beautiful too. The title is a reminder of The Samurai's Garden by Gail Tsukiyama. I might try and read a few books with garden in the title for the summer. I can't believe summer is only a couple of weeks away. Plans for the summer? No, I will probably just "fall" into summer with a "spring." Get it? I know ; It's corny. I didn't feel well yesterday. I am feeling so much better this morning. Last night I didn't eat a bowl of ice cream. That's shocking! Now, today I will make up for it.

[Bellamarie,] I want to spend a little more time looking and dreaming over your kitchen. Glad to see the photos are still up. What dessert will you bake first? Oh, is there a special place in which you can put cookbooks?

Good morning [Ginny] PatH and All

[ginny]

Hats, aren't you smart, though? You're right, it's another Robert Harris, this one Robert W Harris not the one with the Roman series and the other series!

Bellamarie's quote there is true, I'm just reveling in reading reading reading, it's such a joy. I'm reading one book a day so far, so you know what I'm accomplishing otherwise, but it's SO relaxing. It's a mental holiday, a mental beach trip.

Jonathan, I've been doing the same, I watched, in anticipation of the third and last of the trilogy by Hilary Mantel (Wolf Hall) the Amazon prime showing of Wolf Hall (a LOT is left out, I need to find my DVD set of the whole thing, wonder why they edited it?), so next I want to read the new Thomas Cromwell: A Revolutionary Life by Diarmaid MacCulloch. This book has been it seems years in the making. The author is Diarmaid MacCulloch, Professor of the History of the Church at Oxford University, is the author of The Reformation, winner of the National Book Critics Circle Award, the Wolfson Prize, and the British Academy Prize, and of Thomas Cranmer, winner of the Whitbread Prize, the James Tait Black Prize, and the Duff Cooper Prize.

So obviously he can write, but this book has been aborning a long long time, people would talk about it, you'd hear rumors, Hilary Mantel would refer to him,  and what it would reveal,  and finally it came out last October.  It would not sound like anything anybody would want to read but I read the first couple of pages online and his wit and wonderful way with words and brightness  made me actually want to keep reading the e book and not waiting for  the paper one,  but at last it's coming today. We'll see what kind of silk purse he makes (or will he?)  of the sow's ear  which history has branded Thomas Cromwell, (Henry VIII, dissolution of the  monasteries, getting rid of the first two wives)  he's got access to all kinds of written records nobody else has. Can't wait!

The BBC today has a feature called Does Reading Fiction Make Us Better People? http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20190523-does-reading-fiction-make-us-better-people

 I think is a very interesting article. It quotes Aristotle: "Aristotle said that when we watch a tragedy two emotions predominate: pity (for the character) and fear (for yourself). Without necessarily even noticing, we imagine what it’s like to be them and compare their reactions to situations with how we responded in the past, or imagine we might in the future."

Isn't that interesting?     


Does that imply then that we only read books we can see ourselves in?

Reading fiction, if you continue the article, seems to confer many benefits, better social empathy (they've actually tested for this) and all sorts of things. I had no idea!

Nice to know we're improving ourselves when we read books  such as I am today, museums and monsters, biological permutations,  and creatures underground NYC (Reliquary, my annual read). Now what on earth can that possibly do to give me social empathy?

[bellamarie]

Jonathan,  You and I are not that far from each other, with Canada only being a little over an hour from us.  We've visited Toronto and it is indeed a beautiful city.  I too love working in my kitchen, looking out at my flower gardens and bird feeders.

hats, I have to say I am not much on cookbooks, since I can Google any recipe.  I do have my mother in law's Betty Crocker cookbook, which is in my cupboard along with a couple others.  My first dessert I baked was blueberry muffins, if you consider that a dessert. 

Ginny, I am having a very difficult time getting into The Remains of the Day.  I don't know if it is the audio that is boring, or the content.  I tried it a few weeks ago and found it to be as uninteresting then, as I am now.  I can't see me finishing this book.  I will give it a few more pages.

Does that imply then that we only read books we can see ourselves in?

Oh heavens NO!  I have read many books I would never see myself in.  I do think we improve ourselves in reading, and I also think it helps our social life, I mean what better a conversation than discussing a book?

[PatH]

Nice to know we're improving ourselves when we read books  such as I am today, museums and monsters, biological permutations,  and creatures underground NYC (Reliquary, my annual read). Now what on earth can that possibly do to give me social empathy?

Ginny, you gave me a laugh with that one.  I don't know the answer, unless the contrast makes us appreciate the good.  But it's an interesting question, do we have to see ourselves in a book, or is it enough to have some understanding of the mindset of the characters without sharing it?  Do we learn by trying to understand characters we don't see ourselves in?

[PatH]

I flew back to Bethesda from Portland yesterday, and my reading, in the few hours I wasn't asleep, was The Remains of the Day.That gave me a good start, and after I put myself in the mood, I'm really enjoying it.  It goes fast; if I choose, I'll have time to reread it and see different things in it.

[bellamarie]

Ginny, I was reading Anna Karenina today, and there was a part in the book that made me think of Aristotle's quote

"Aristotle said that when we watch a tragedy two emotions predominate: pity (for the character) and fear (for yourself). Without necessarily even noticing, we imagine what it’s like to be them and compare their reactions to situations with how we responded in the past, or imagine we might in the future."

Anna read, and understood what she read; but it was not pleasant to her to read, in other words to enter into the lives of other people.  She had too keen a desire to live herself.  If she read how the heroine of her story took care of the sick, she would have liked to go with noiseless steps into the sick-room.  If she read how a member of Parliament made a speech, she would have liked to make that speech.  If she read how Lady Mary rode after the hounds, and made sport of her sister-in-law, and astonished every one by her audacity, she have liked to do the same.  But she could do nothing and with her little hands she clutched the paper-cutter, and forced herself to read calmly.

So, I suppose Aristotle has a legitimate point, we imagine what it is like to be the characters in the books we read, and attach and react to their emotions.

PatH.,  So you "put yourself in the mood", to read The Remains of the Day.  Maybe that is what I'm not doing, maybe I'll give it a try.  I just thought if I hear, "My father," one more time I would scream!!  Ooops wrong mood.   

[hats]

Bellamarie That is some quote! I don't remember it. It's such beautiful writing. I think Leo Tolstoy and his wife kept a journal. This might have already been mentioned. I have never seen any part of it or read any part of it.

Ginny I could not help myself. I thought of Never Let Me Go by Ishiguro. I can not spell his first name. Have any of you read it? Did you like or dislike it? I have read a bit of the sample and liked it very much.

I remember reading Remains Of The Day here with the group. Through the night amazingly, I remembered bits of the book and the movie. That novel has great purpose. Perhaps, a hundred years from today there will come a month to reread it. Does it not have the elements of a Classic?

I have wandered around like a homeless book sheep for months. So far, this place is always my first love. Not that I will stop wandering, but I will slow down ; I hope.

[ginny]

I think that's an excellent question, Pat, what ARE we looking for in a book and why do we read? It seems to me that in looking over comments about this or that book that people seem to repeat things that had meaning for them personally, by citing people they have known who had similar situations, or that they could relate to and quote others they knew with the same issues.

Not likely in The Remains of the Day, huh? Or is it?

It's certainly no Game of Thrones, not a potboiler, no barn burner, no Reliquary.  This just hit me, it really did, that there is also dignity in something quiet and still because not many of us in our own lives live in a Reliquary world. My goodness, this  just came to me: that "dignity" that Stevens is talking about is  paralleled, and  achieved by Ishiguro himself in the  way he wrote  the book, isn't  it? Or not?

Oh well, that's what a couple of hours sleep will do for you this morning.

Hats, then why not tag along in the Remains mini discussion on the 19th? I am seeing all kinds of things I did not see then, they are all probably nothing but I'd love to bounce them off others and find out.  Maybe you will,  too, see something new in it, and you always have a razor sharp take on issues which I don't. I have a whole stack here of Ishiguro to read, but have not started any of them. Yet.

Bellamarie,  your remark about "Father" made me think of Robert Frost actually, "He will not go beyond his father's saying. And he likes having said it so well, he says it again: 'Good fences make good neighbors.'"

(Mending Wall, I am sure that's misquoted but I'm too lazy to look it up).  And that, too, suddenly seems to fit the subject here.

Actually I hate to say this but it's been quite a while since we did a poem here as a "book club discussion," but Mending Wall would make a fabulous Mini Discussion, wouldn't it? 5 minutes to read and forever in your mind.

When's the last time anybody here read Frost? 

[hats]

Ginny, I might fall in love with these mini discussions. You have great ideas always. Probably, I will just tag along. 

[PatH]

Do tag along, hats, we'd love to have your company, and having read the book, even a long time ago, is enough to have fun.

[Jonathan]

Hats, you've contributed so much to the book discussions over the years, I can't imagine one without you. You are the most avid reader I know.

'When is the last time anybody here read Frost?' And the same could be asked about other poets. I've had occasion to talk with others about an elderly person caught between two worlds. I suggested he was caught between  the present and the future, hung up on the bar, thinking about Tennyson's Crossing the Bar. Which we memorized in high school, so many years ago. Nobody knew what I was talking about.

Bellamarie,where in the book did you read that quote? I'm two hundred pages  along, and I'm not sure I read it. But there is so much fascinating detail, I'm sure I've missed some. Already I'm very pleased to think I'll be able to say 'I've read Anna Karenina. A superb storyteller, isn't he?

Of course we're neighbors, aren't we? I could lend you some interesting books on Jane Austen.

I'm sure I have something by Diarmaid MacCulloch in the house. Isn't he the author of the three thousand year history of Christianity. I must look for the Cromwell book. Many thanks, Ginny, for the many reading tips over the years.

[Jonathan]

And you, too, Pat, have been such a pleasant book club member.

[bellamarie]

Jonathan, it was on page 88, while riding the train back to Petersburg, from Moscow, Anna pulls out her book and tries to concentrate on what she is reading, to distract herself from thinking of feelings for Vronsky.  Indeed, Tolystoy is a superb story teller, and I too am thrilled I'll be among the group who will be able to say, I read AK!  I am still a bit behind you, only on page 107, I have begun having my two grandchildren three days a week with some sleepovers thrown in since school is out, so I a bit busier than normal.  So far we have seen poor Kitty having two possible suitors her mother feels will be proposing to her, and yet only one, Levin, has actually done so, and she has turned him down in hopes of Vronsky.  But oh my, Vronsky has only eyes for Anna.  And just imagine how Anna's husband is going to feel if and when he realizes she has wandering eyes, after he made it so clear how infidelity is unforgivable.  The plot has surely thickened, as Vronsky has followed Anna to Petersburg and even in the presence of her husband, has the arrogance to flirt with Anna.  And now poor Kitty has taken ill, and the doctor feels it would do her good to take a trip abroad, when in fact, it is not tubucular, but a broken heart.  Oh me, oh my.

Ginny, nice quote from Robert Frost.  I suppose the last time I took the time to read much poetry at all was back when Barbara led us in the discussion of Shakespeare.

hats, please consider popping into the mini discussion of The Remains of the Day.  With you, Pat, Jonathan, Ginny and who ever else may join us, it will for certain bring much insight to the discussion.

 

[ginny]

Absolutely, Hats! Mini=Fun,  or we will make it so together. I'm getting quite excited about the concept.

I'm sure I have something by Diarmaid MacCulloch in the house. Isn't he the author of the three thousand year history of Christianity.

He did, Jonathan!  I haven't read that but his more recent book is on  Cranmer  which got all kinds of awards. Poor Cranmer, I need to read that next.


Jonathan: "hung up on the bar, thinking about Tennyson's Crossing the Bar. Which we memorized in high school, so many years ago. Nobody knew what I was talking about."

No, nobody memorizes any more, such a shame.  Even if we can't remember now all the verses and lines correctly, we've had the experience and  isn't it amazing what snatches and snips come flooding out (like the Frost quote) however inaccurately, at the strangest times?

Some day just for kicks, it might be fun to see what snatches (and in my case that's all they are) of long forgotten verse or rhymes we can come  up with.

Mine for today would be half a league, half a league, half a league onwards. Or onward? Into the valley of death rode the....uh oh...how many hundred? Fired out by shot and shell,  bravely they rose and well , into the valley of death rode the.....600? 300? It's the rhythm, the sound of horses running in the half a league that makes it stick. I am not sure now actually who or what  it actually refers to?

When the Bond movie Skyfall came out I was so impressed by Judy Dench's recitation of Tennyson's Ulysses ("and though we are not now that strength which once moved heaven and earth")...etc., I thought I would memorize it.  I have to say that was the HARDEST thing I have done in a long time. It does not rhyme!  I need rhyme!!! Or at least rhythm!  And it doesn't have either,  and I thought I would NEVER get it. The words are different than I would have used, I kept missing it, messing it up, but I kept trying week after week  and finally to be honest,  kind of gave up, had other things to do, and found to my astonishment several months later that I did have it (sort of) and when I went back most of it was there and it was then easy to finish off. The brain is a very interesting thing.

(I'm not sure how many other sites one could post something like that in without being committed to an asylum, so I'm very glad we still  have this one.)

[hats]

All of you have been more than kind. However, I know each one of you are more knowledgeable about Literature and visiting parts of the world than me. Tut! Tut! It's true. So, I will draw up a seat from time to time and listen without commenting. Besides, at this age I am as fussy and slow as an old cat. As Martha Stewart would say, "It's a good thing."

[hats]

Hey Reading Gang!

I hate to admit it. I did not keep up with The Game Of Thrones. I can not stay away. "Quiet Dignity", Ginny's words stay with me. PatH and All, I need some direction for the mini discussion about "Remains Of The Day."  "Duty" and "Honor" are the words I remember from that past discussion. I had forgotten the butler's name. Bellamarie and Jonathan, how should I handle it? Frybabe, maybe a link or two? Help! I am wounded and stranded in nowhere.

I am very excited about Robert Frost. No more long discussions? I have missed reading all the comments. I need to go back over those again.

[bellamarie]

Ginny,  Funny you should mention memorizing, I attempted the first part of Lincoln's Gettysburg Address last week to my grandson, and felt a bit embarrassed when I couldn't even remember the first score.  Here was my feeble attempt:

Fourscore and seven years ago, our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, under God that all men are created equal.

Don't laugh ya'll......

hats,  I have never watched one episode of The Game of Thrones.  I know that doesn't seem possible, when it was such a rave.  Don't worry about how to proceed with the mini discussion, you have plenty of us to guide you.  It's a new format for all of us, so we will muddle through together, and leave no one stranded or wounded.  Like I said before..... In for a penny, in for a pound!

[PatH]

I never watched any of Game of Thrones either.  I watched some trailer or other, and saw that it was going to be too brutal for me, and that it was going to have a gigantic cast of characters, and factions, and I didn't want to invest the effort to keep them all straight.

[ginny]

You'll be great, Hats, just as you are. Come as you are.   If you can't remember stuff about the book (and it's been quite a while since we did such an exhaustive discussion of it, a really good one, if I may say so)  this will be a bit different. And, as always, many of  the points raised  will be about broader things than the book and that's where you can  shine, if you like,  I predict.

Not all movies are the same as the books they are based on,  either. I'm thinking of the movie Remains of the Day with Anthony Hopkins and Emma Thompson who of course are both wonderful.  I still see HER as Miss Kenton but I don't see him, for some reason and he was incredible.

I  watched a discussion with Mark Rylance and the producer of Wolf Hall for PBS yesterday and Rylance  said that he imagined it was very difficult for Hilary Mantel (the author of the two books we call Wolf Hall)  now to write the 3rd book in the trilogy since she had seen the stage and film adaptations of the books and it must influence her a bit. And apparently it did because she's been a long time with this last one. So sometimes it helps to see the film maker's slant and sometimes it doesn't.

Rylance  is a very powerful understated actor. His performances are  hard to get out of  your head. At one point in the film a character called George is telling Cromwell about the death of  Cardinal Wolsey (played to a wonderful turn by Jonathan Pryce)  whom Cromwell at least in the books was devoted to.  "George" has just said he prayed  that God would take vengeance on them all and Cromwell turns and says in that  quiet sweet kind of voice that Rylance  has, "There's no need to trouble God, George, I'll take the matter in hand," as if  he were saying he'd set out dessert plates,  and boy did he. 

My biography of Cromwell has come at last. I can't wait to get into it and see who he really was. Right now I have to finish Reliquary which I had to put down for a day or so, because of  the description about  the late night subway train which was WAY too real for me. (I guess you could call it a  horror/ thriller/ musty old museum/ monsters type book) You can tell Preston and Childs have taken many late night NYC subway rides, thing is absolutely terrifying. Needs to be read in the day time.

Bellamarie, that's more than a lot of people could do.

[Jonathan]

'I'm only on page 107....'

Wonderful comments on the book, Bellamarie. I'm tearing along, half-way through, and believe me it keeps getting better.

'And just imagine how Anna's husband  is going to feel if and when he realizes she has wandering eyes.' ... He's a government bureaucrat. He has no feelings. Just a calculating brain.

Wonderful thoughts, Ginny, about poetic snippets that pop into one's head at the oddest times, depending on mood or need, I suppose. The lines from The Charge of the Light Brigade inspired a nation at war (Crimean war). My favorite Tennyson line is 'Come, my friends, Tis not too late to seek a newer world.' From his Ulysses.

But everyone's favorite must be that first line of the 23 Psalm: 'The Lord is my shepherd, I shall not want.'

[bellamarie]

Jonathan,  "He's a government bureaucrat. He has no feelings. Just a calculating brain."

Oh how I must beg to differ on this  assessment.  Aleksei did his due diligence as a husband, in warning Anna of why her behavior is inappropriate, and how it could not only hurt herself, and their son, but also their family and marriage.  He was hoping to stop anything before it happened.  She chose to ignore his warnings.  I think he truly loved her, she is a woman who does not believe in love, and resents any man for even speaking the word to her.  I'm seeing Anna as the one with no feelings, and a calculating brain. 

So.....  now I am at Pg.  143,  and the deed has been done between Vronsky and Anna.  Funny how flirting with someone, whispering sweet nothings in their ears at social events, and even touching a person's hand in passing in public, can spark excitement in two people who know what they are doing is not only inappropriate, but is also infidelity, yet they cannot stop themselves.  But..... what happens once the two finally give into their temptations?

Pg. 129 But he felt like a murderer must feel when he sees the lifeless body of his victim.  This lifeless body was their love—the first epoch of their love.  There was something horrible and repulsive in the recollection of the terrible price that they paid for this shame.  The shame in the presence of their spiritual nakedness oppressed her and took hold of him.  But in spite of all the horror felt by the murderer in presence of the body of his victim, he must cut it in pieces, must bury it, must take advantage of his crime. 

And, as with fury and passion the murderer throws himself on the dead body and drags it and cuts it, so he covered her face and shoulders with kisses.  She held his hand and did not stir.  “Yes, these kisses were what had been bought with shame!  Yes, and this hand, which will always be mine, is the hand of my accomplice.”

She raised his hand and kissed it.  He fell on his knees, and tried to look into her face; but she hid it and said nothing.  At last , as if trying to control herself, she made an effort to rise, and pushed him away.  Her face was still as beautiful as ever; even so much more was it pitiful.

“All is ended,” said she; “I have nothing but thee, remember that.”
“I cannot help remembering it, since it is my life.  A moment before this happiness. . .”
“What happiness?”  she cried, with contempt and horror.  And horror involuntarily seized him also.  “For God’s sake, not a word, not a word more.”

She quickly got up and moved away from him, and with a strange expression of hopelessness despair, such as he had never seen before, on her face, she stood aloof from him.  She felt that at that moment she could not express in words the sense of shame, rapture, and horror at this entrance into anew life, and she did not wish to speak about it or vulgarize the feeling with definite words.

Pg.  130 Anna, “No, I cannot now think about this; by and by, when I am calmer.”
“By and by, by and by, “ she repeated, “when I am calmer.”

This was truly powerful to read!  Anna reminds me of the black widow spider,  1. A girl who makes a guy fall in love with her and after he does, she loses interest and breaks up with him.  2. A female who feeds off of the mental, physical and material means of a male and then leaves him for dead.
www.urbandictionary.com

Speaking of remembering famous quotes, where else have I heard a protagonist say something like this?

Anna, "No, I cannot now think about this; by and by, when I am calmer.” [/i]

Why of course, one of my all time favorite quotes from literature:

Scarlett O'Hara, "I'll think about it tomorrow."[/i]

I may be getting ahead of myself in judging Anna at this point in the book, but up to this point, she has given no other reason to see her differently.  Half way through..... oh my goodness, it must be getting better.  I am finding Levin and Stepan's shoots boring.  Ho, hum....