Author Topic: The Library (Read 2079716 times)

PatH · « **Reply #20360 on:** September 08, 2019, 10:39:15 AM »

The Library
Our library is open 24/7; the welcome mat is always out.
Do come in from daily chores and spend some time with us.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20361 on:** September 08, 2019, 11:57:12 AM »

You remind me frybabe that youtube is uploading more and more good stuff and there are many who used to post on facebook who have moved over to youtube where there is not the political oversight -

Frybabe · « **Reply #20362 on:** September 08, 2019, 06:52:31 PM »

I have a correction. Kings and Generals does not have the video game, it is Total War that has the Three Kingdoms game. Kings and Generals is, however, sponsored by them. The Invicta channel on YouTube also has a series on the Three Kingdoms which I actually can follow a bit better than the Kings and Generals one. I've watched a number of both channels' short videos on various other ancient groups and battles.

PatH, Reading Romance of the Three Kingdoms reminds me of the Liadens, where melant’i is very important. I assume the characters in "Romance" are a little exaggerated, but these ancients are portrayed in the book like their self-worth, self-esteem was totally wrapped up in correct thinking and acting correctly. One could get executed for embarrassing or contradicting someone else, or make a mistake, or commits a minor infraction in ancient China.

Frybabe · « **Reply #20363 on:** September 11, 2019, 06:26:56 AM »

Project Gutenberg has listed, this morning, a few strange things. One is a volume of Hillary Balzac's verses, none of which I cared for or understood very well. The next is a very short tract on coffee by one Richard Bradley. The title indicates it includes its uses against the plague. In skimming over it, I missed it so he must not have said much.

The third is Charles Kingsley's, The Water Babies. I remember my sister got a volume called that as a gift from one of our relatives in Wales (I got Reggie Rabbit and Marmaduke Mouse). This wasn't it. My sister's book was mostly illustrations and verses, and must have been taken from the original. The original, which includes verses from various poets, is a children's novel which I am not about to try to read. It appears to include lessons in morals, proper conduct, and vocabulary building, and has lots of interesting illustrations. Wikipedia says that it is "part satire in support of Charles Darwin's The Origin of Species " and is loaded with the prejudices of the times against various groups including Americans.

bellamarie · « **Reply #20364 on:** September 11, 2019, 10:41:50 AM »

This is my poem titled, Staying the Faith, I submitted to The International Library of Poetry for the anthology in tribute to 09-11-2001. This book was published in 2002.

God bless all those who lost loved ones eighteen years ago, on this horrible day, and God bless our great country, the United States of America.

Tomereader1 · « **Reply #20365 on:** September 11, 2019, 12:18:37 PM »

Beautiful, Bellamarie.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20366 on:** September 11, 2019, 06:57:59 PM »

Lovely bellamaire - I used to give as a gift to new mom's, Kingsley's Water Babies, frybabe- wonderful 1920s illustrations - rain last night and today , not heavy but the first rain since June.

SouthernLady1948 · « **Reply #20367 on:** September 11, 2019, 09:59:56 PM »

Hello, everybody! I am SouthernLady 1948, born and raised in Atlanta, GA, though now I live in Oregon. I am pleasantly surprised to learn that you have book discussions, as I am totally addicted to books, I have more of them on Kindle than I will ever have time to read, and yet I sometimes reread classics like Tolstoy's books over and over. Which book is next to be discussed?

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20368 on:** September 12, 2019, 01:58:03 PM »

Welcome Southern Lady - so glad you found us - over the years we have discussed many books and you can see our discussion since they are all saved in the archives

Here is a link to some of the more recent discussions - http://seniorlearn.org/forum/index.php?board=45.0

this is the link to the old discussions that were organized by topic http://seniorlearn.org/forum/index.php?board=196.0

Hope there are some of your favorites among those we tackled - after over 20 years we are down to a handful of regulars and as a new reader you are a breath that hopefully you will enjoy your time talking books - let us know what you are currently reading - there is another participant among us, Pat, who has family in your part of the world - she has been traveling back and forth between the northwest coast and Virginia with I believe plans to permanently move to the northwest coast.

We are spread out over this land - I live in Central Texas - you will get to meet us as we post - Enjoy!

Frybabe · « **Reply #20369 on:** September 13, 2019, 06:03:26 AM »

Hello, SouthernLady. Welcome!

After a bit of a dry spell, not finding anything of interest on Project Gutenberg, I have found a few things in the last week or so. One of them is Bobbins of Belgium by Charlotte Kellogg. No, Bobbins is not a person, but refers to the lace-making industry in Belgium. While the subject may not hold my attention for very long, I at least intend on reading a bit of the history. There are plenty of photos, etc. and I like Kellogg's writing style. Here is the first line of Chapter 1.

Quote

Lace is the flower of Belgium; the white blossom that springs from the teeming plains of the Flanders, from the agricultural districts, and from the mournful Campine of the North.

I am still quietly winding my way through Romance of the Three Kingdoms with around 200 pages to go yet. Meanwhile, my hold on A History of the Later Han Dynasty 23-230 AD by Rafe De Crespigny came in earlier than expected. The book, published and presented to the Shippensburg University Library in 2017, looks pristine. I must be one of only a few who have borrowed it. As I was hoping, it does have some maps. It is 510 pages not including the bibliography and index at the end. [/size]

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20370 on:** September 13, 2019, 09:01:35 AM »

To add to your lace history frybabe - back in the day - forget now what king put a consumption tax on lace in France - and so to smuggle into France, lace there was a system set up with Belgium - dogs were raised lovingly in both nations and then french dogs were starved when brought to Belgium where they were packed with lace under a camouflage coat from the Belgium dogs that continued to be fed, actually over fed, but where then slaughtered since their coat would be larger to fit over the starved dog and the lace packed around its body - when let loose the dogs went back to where they were well taken care of and fed in France.

And then the young girls who were lace makers - in nice weather they often worked in the doorway of houses but when the weather turned they were all in one room with a candle next to a glass of water, so that the light from the candle was fractured into small spots all over the room - the girls would find a light spot, set up her chair so the light spot would shine on small section of her work - most girls started earning making lace in their very early teens and would have serious eye problems to being blind in some cases by the time they were in their mid to late 20s.

I used to belong to the Needlework Guild - in fact I visited the basements and attics of museums in Britain and Wales to examine their collection of needlework and then, I would teach, mostly samplers, at some of the national seminars - anyhow, we learned of so many of these stories - there was a book I think it was called The Subservient Stitch that included stories how women in the needlework industry and the women who stitched at home were subjected to all sorts of abuse - of course it did not help that women were not permitted to be a member of the Guild - we forget the printing of fabric is a recent phenomenon - to decorate cloth required stitching and lace work - some of the lace work was not separate and applied but the cloth of the item was used by removing some threads and tying others together to form a lace pattern.

Your bringing back to mind a chapter in my life - so much learned during that time - not only history but principles of art and various patterns used in various parts of the world and so many many different stitches. I remember visiting the curator in a museum in Leeds who shared a story of how two sisters were at odds over their mother's sampler - these were the long narrow samplers that were actually the depository of the family's known stitches an patterns - no such thing as a book with patterns or stitches - The sampler was usually passed to the eldest daughter - in this case a younger daughter was moving to Leeds from the family home in the south of England and she convinced the mom that since the older sister lived nearby, the mother would be there to teach the stitches and patterns where as she would have nothing and no one to turn to living so far away - and so the Leeds museum eventually (over 200 years later) received the mother's sampler. Obviously the younger daughter was the most persuasive.

There is another big lace making tradition in Ireland and in Italy - much of Italy's lace was made with silk thread - there was lots of silk coming into Italy along that silk road we read about last Spring as well as, shipped in from the sea trade - fun stuff you are embarking on... I always thought it would be a neat way to learn history by following either cloth and yarn or another, cooking and raising or catching food stuff, rather than one conflict after the next, but then war is men stuff and nation building which said it all.

PatH · « **Reply #20371 on:** September 13, 2019, 01:08:06 PM »

Welcome, SouthernLady1948. It's good to see you here. What part of Oregon do you live in? It's such a beautiful state, with a huge variety of climates. To explain what Barb said, I live in Maryland, and spend a quarter of my time in Portland, in an apartment which will be home when I finally finish clearing out my house and selling it.

You found us at a time between discussions, with the usual discussion leaders tied upon with personal affairs, but if you keep an eye on us here, you'll catch the next one. Format varies, from a month long discussion in which we analyze everything we can think of, to much shorter ones, and we're starting to try other forms. We had a wonderful 2 month discussion of War and Peace some years ago, which unfortunately didn't get archived for technical reasons.

Feel free to suggest titles. That's how we get some of our ideas.

bellamarie · « **Reply #20372 on:** September 13, 2019, 09:09:14 PM »

Welcome Southernlady1948, it's good to have a new member to our group. We are not currently discussing any book as a group.

Unfortunately, we no longer follow our previous format for reading and discussing books, and as Pat H., has pointed out, we have hit a dry spell. Our last book we read was Educated by Tara Westover. Our new format for that book, and the one prior, was a week long discussion, where our moderator Ginny, had us submit questions, after we all read the entire book, before beginning to discuss it. Previously, our format was to read a book together sectioned off by chapters, discuss those chapters one week, then proceed to reading the next chapters and discussing them, until we reached the end of the book. Due to illnesses, deaths, and personal life situations we have had less participation, and less moderators. We like to think of Senior Learn now, as more of a book/cafe, where we share what books we are reading individually, and anything else that you would share if you were sitting at a table with fellow avid book readers.

So, as we tell our members, pull up a chair, enjoy your favorite beverage and snack, and let us know what you are presently reading, your likes and dislikes of past books or ones you have on your TBR (to be read) list. Check in daily, weekly or just when ever you feel like it, and hopefully someone will respond, if you have any questions.

I recently finished Leo Tolstoy's, Anna Karenina. Have you read this one of his? I dare say it was quite a depressing book, that stayed with me for a long time after closing, and placing it back on my bookshelf.

PatH · « **Reply #20373 on:** September 14, 2019, 10:38:13 AM »

Bellamarie, don't feel you've seen the last of the old format, or that the recent one is the new normal. We've been experimenting with variety, and are still chewing things over. We'll go back to the old format whenever we're doing a book with enough meat in it to work that way. and you may see some quickie discussions too.

PatH · « **Reply #20374 on:** September 17, 2019, 12:36:55 PM »

Barb, here's a nice picture to illustrate your interesting account of lacemaking:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lacemaker_(Vermeer)#/media/File:Johannes_Vermeer_-_The_lacemaker_(c.1669-1671).jpg

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20375 on:** September 17, 2019, 03:02:06 PM »

Yes Pat - Vermeer's lacemaker - this facebook site has several paintings of women making lace or embroidering - they include photos of historical work as well as the work of some contemporary needle artists - https://tinyurl.com/y6on5zyo

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20376 on:** September 20, 2019, 02:03:56 PM »

Ha talk about coincidence - someone on our neighborhood NextDoor site asked about private needlework lessons - no one was responding so I thought, why not - then another also wanted to join - their schedules are completely different but here I go getting these two women started - if it is only one or two get-together's to get them started then a cup of coffee will do it but if it is more than I need to see what folks charge these days for lessons - and so after all these years looks like I will be back into the world of needles and yarns. Actually I am delighted to see a younger generation pick up the handwork that will live on although no longer a necessity to decorate cloth - the one is even talking about doing a piece to cover a chair seat - how perfectly wonderful...

Well Mother nature teased us yesterday with 10 minutes of rain - the rain had been in the forecast as if a drop of water in a barren desert which is about how the back half of my backyard looks - the cost of watering just got too much and there is a lot of limestone with just a thin layer of soil - looks like we are still in triple digits - summer usually does not break till mid October but it is usually not an entire summer of triple digit temps - it is no longer even a joke - we are simply all in denial... football is played on the weekends and so that says fall.

I've so many books going at once that are all non-fiction - the one I find fascinating is the bio of Emile Zapata - learning so much about Mexican history - still need to finish The Murmur of Bees which is a novel and talks about how the northeast part of Mexico experienced the revolution but, I got waylaid reading The Traps of Medicare and Dr. Axe's Eat Dirt and The Year of Less and the guide for The Dandelion Insurrection and of course still reading Ultralearning by Scott Young which I am finding fascinating along with a kindle book Achieve Anything in One Year.

With nothing much on TV I'm spending my nights switching from one book to another - although I am watching the Ken Burns Country Music - my childhood - fun seeing how we dressed - I was before Elvis, who I thought was a punk

where as my kid brother and sister thought he hung the moon - then last night on a tribute to Ray Charles, Luke Nelson, Willie Nelson's young'en, did a fabulous performance of 7 Spanish Angles - also noticed last night they picked up the older series with John Nettles as Barnaby in Midsumer Murders rather than the new series with Neil Dudgeon who is supposed to be his cousin - the part has Dudgeon playing Barnaby as a rather pompous 'know it all' who is rather unkind, showing his superiority to the side kick for both, Ben Jones - even if they are re-runs prefer how John Nettles plays the part.

Frybabe · « **Reply #20377 on:** September 21, 2019, 07:28:49 PM »

It has been mighty quiet around here lately. I haven't piped up because I haven't been reading much this last week. However, yesterday I did finish listening to Simon Winchester's The Madman and the Professor. More than the history of the beginnings of the creation of the New Oxford Dictionary, it is a human interest story. It mainly follows the relationship between one of the contributors and one of the editors of the dictionary. A very touching story. I am eyeballing The Silk Roads: A new history of the World by Peter Frankopan for myt next listen, but I may change my mind.

Yesterday, also, I started reading H. Beam Piper's Lone Star Planet. Very funny parody of Texans complete with "supercows", everyone carrying guns, and the Alamo, the real one not a replica. It seems the Texans, most of them, migrated lock stock and barrel to the planet New Texas. Very funny!

The book on the Late Han Dynasty I started reading went back to the library. The book is too material dense (lots of notes and detail) for me to get through before I had to send it back. If it ever comes out in English in Ebook form I will likely get it. Well then again the book is $42 in Dutch/German, so I hate to think what the cost would be here.

Looks like Lucy wants something, so I guess I'd better tend to her. She is holding up okay, but not great.

bellamarie · « **Reply #20378 on:** September 23, 2019, 02:05:44 PM »

Yes, Frybabe, it seems we are having less and less posts from members.

I haven't been reading anything of late. With my grandkids sports, my hubby and I taking off to little day trips, taking in all the Fall weather, and trying to catch up on lesson planning for my CCD (religion) classes which began a couple weeks ago, I can barely keep up. I did go to a very nice English Tea, to kick off the movie Downton Abbey, it was so wonderful. It was at a small tea house called Clara J's in a small town of Maumee. All the teas and foods were named for the characters in Downton, the lady servers were dressed in uniforms, and yes, some ladies were dressed to the hilt, fitting the part. Then on Thursday night, I went to see the movie Downton Abbey when it was released. Oh, oh, oh, I can't even begin to say how much I loved it, and wish they could bring the series back to TV. Maggie Smith plays the best role as Violet Crawley, the Dowager Countess of Grantham. She and Penelope Wilton, who plays Isobel Crawley, lovingly spar back and forth, with the Dowager's one line zingers making you laugh out loud. If you are a Downton Abbey fan, this is a MUST see movie. It warms your heart to be back at Downton, with all the same characters. Jullian Fellows probably had no idea how famous this story would become. I just heard today that Downton Abbey followed the series Cranford when it ended. Imagine that! I had no idea our beloved Crandford by Elizabeth Gaskell was a made for TV series. Looks like I will have to go and find a way to watch this through hulu, or some other form of streaming.

I am sure once the weather changes and becomes cold I will be back to reading again. I mean, how else can you get through a winter.

Here is a link to view my Downton Abbey tea pics.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10220544037374304&type=3

PatH · « **Reply #20379 on:** September 23, 2019, 03:27:40 PM »

Bellamarie, PBS showed a British version of a Cranford series, with Judi Dench, some years ago. If that's the one you mean, it's very good, but they shuffled and redealt the plot some, so it's different from the book. Enjoy.

I haven't been saying much because I haven't been reading much, but now I'm in Portland for two weeks, and will soon load up at Powell's.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20380 on:** September 23, 2019, 04:27:33 PM »

Oh I did not know the movie was out yet - need to find where and when it is showing here - what a series that was - even though they play it over and over I keep enjoying it - sounds like a charming tea room experience.

Ah Powell's - used to stock up at their airport shop that was better than anything we had at the time here in Ausitn - only one time while my son and family were living in the Portland area did we go to the used bookstore - overwhelming - but still one of the better book stores that it is easy to not only loose yourself but too easy to spend a fortune before you realize it... but still ahhhh

Everyone is just plan ignoring it - we are still triple digits or at best maybe a 99 or wow gosh a 97- we have broken the record for September - the record was 14 triple digit days and here we are up to 19 - we note the season by football - high school on Friday night - tailgate afternoon and night collage games on Saturday - there are several small collages nearby so it is not just UT then many drive to Collage Station for the A&M games or up to Waco for the Baylor games and of course the big UT Oklahoma shoot out on October 12 in Dallas - Willie Nelson's On the Road Again seems to say it during the fall weekends- then the TV brings folks indoors, many meeting at coffee bars or cafes for the professional games on Sunday and Monday night - some are still with the 'boys of summer' since it is a couple of weeks till the World Series but minor league is just about over. We have a great minor league team in Round Rock about 30 minutes away.

I had all these clearing out plans but it is a challenge to feel up about clearing when the AC has to pump all the time to keep comfortable and yet, for the last few weeks I too have not been reading that much -I've a bunch of books going and try to do a bit each night but I am not into it with feeling I can't wait to get back to see what happens next.

Frybabe · « **Reply #20381 on:** September 24, 2019, 06:16:36 AM »

Okay, so now I have gotten into Quantum by Patricia Cornwell. I am not sure what to make of it. The narrative is interspersed with flashbacks/memories and I have a little trouble believing that at least one major character could even be in the job she is in because of her extensive phobias. The narrator character exhibits some OCD as well as guilt/fears of her own while she holds down two jobs at NASA. The animation/video bits are short and sparse. So far, they are an interesting addition, but very short and not all that impressive. At least not for this book. I think the idea will work well in a non-fiction book such as history, biography or science/tech.

I did indeed change my mind on which audio book to listen to, and am now listening to Adrian Goldsworthy's How Rome Fell. I only got as far as his forward and am already impressed.

The third of Martha Wells Murderbot series, Rogue Protocol, is ready for me to pick up. Guess I will go do that now.

Frybabe · « **Reply #20382 on:** September 24, 2019, 06:47:35 AM »

I Project Gutenberg find: Old Buildings of New York, With Some Notes Regarding Their Origin and Occupants with short dialog and lots of pictures. I wonder how many of these buildings still stand, or how they have changed over the years. I may do a little investigating later.

http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/60342

bellamarie · « **Reply #20383 on:** September 24, 2019, 12:44:26 PM »

PatH., Yes, I believe the Cranford with Judi Dench is the one I saw mentioned. I am still trying to figure out this streaming. I got myself into a bit of a jam in the summer streaming, not realizing I was using cable data, went over and got charged extra. So I may need to call my cable company before I proceed to watch the series. I hope you can finally take a little time to rest and read, while you are in Portland for the two weeks.

I can't imagine living in a state where temps are in the triple digits for so many months, Barb. I am loving my morning walks with my hubby and dog with temps in the 60s and 70s. We hit 90 degrees on Saturday, and it was a scorcher on the cross country fields. Our leaves are just beginning to change colors, and I am inhaling every second of the first days of fall.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20384 on:** September 25, 2019, 12:59:07 PM »

OK after much gnashing of teeth as to how to go forward, in the spirit of Robbie here is our plan - instead of trying to make a commitment to finish a book in a month or even 6 weeks this time we will be reading over weeks and weeks, one chapter a week - and to go back to the stories that are the myths for most of western society.

There is a selection and we need to choose one - any of the five, reading one chapter a week will have us reading through part of the winter months -

The plan is to start in mid October - take a two week break for Christmas - maybe 3 week if the week of celebrating the New Year is more than passing change of uploading a new calendar -

We'll treat the discussion just as Robbie did the Civilization books. It will be ongoing chapter by chapter - each chapter for a week to add our thoughts and found information, to think about, remembering the myths were put on paper hundreds of years after the time of oral tradition but still have value and importance in the minds of all who read them, while the romance stories were written in their time when different concepts of love and romance held sway.

All 5 of the choices are all online so there is no need to purchase a book. WE NEED TO CHOOSE ONE OF THE FIVE BY THE END OF THIS MONTH, SEPTEMBER 30.

The chooses are...

The Champions of the Round Table (https://www.sacred-texts.com/neu/eng/crt/index.htm) Written and Illustrated by Howard Pyle [1905] This is Howard Pyle's retelling of the legends of three of the most illustrious knights of the Round Table, Sir Lancelot, Sir Tristram and Sir Percival.

Four Arthurian Romances: "Erec Et Enide", "Cliges", "Yvain", And "Lancelot" (https://www.gutenberg.org/files/831/831-h/831-h.htm) by Chretien De Troyes
This versions is written in prose form however, these characters bring us back to the beginnings of the Arthur legend and these 4 exclude the 5th by De Troyes, the unfinished tale of Sir Percival - De Troyes died before he could complete Sir Percival.

The choice of Parzival, a Knightly Epic by Wofram Von Eschenbach -
(https://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/e/eschenbach/wolfram_von/parzival/complete.html)
This German telling of the Parzival story continues past the De Troyes storyline. It was used by composer Richard Wagner in his opera Parsifal as well as used as the basis for the blockbuster, Raiders of the Lost Ark

Then the one I would really like to tackle the Welsh epic - The Mabinogion translated by Lady Charlotte Guest.
https://www.sacred-texts.com/neu/celt/mab/index.htm#contents of which the first 5 tales are part of the Arthur legend.

And finally The Lays of Marie de France - https://www.gutenberg.org/files/11417/11417-h/11417-h.htm
Lays means short stories or poems usually with a religious connection - Medieval poet, Marie de France first published in 1160. The poems are tales of love and adventure. The collection was extremely popular in royal circles at the time. Although it is unclear who de France was, it is likely that she was the abbess of a late twelfth-century abbey. She was probably the illegitimate daughter of Geoffrey Plantagenet, which makes her the half sister of Henry II King of England, Duke of Normandy and Aquitaine, Count of Anjou, Maine, and Nantes; at various times, he also partially controlled Scotland, Wales and the Duchy of Brittany.

Frybabe · « **Reply #20385 on:** September 26, 2019, 06:31:03 AM »

Ambitious, Barb.

It is almost a no brainer for me. Being of Welsh descent and already having The Mabinogion in my Ebook pile and on my bookshelf of Welsh related books (P.K. Ford's version), it has to be my first choice. Otherwise, it would be a hard decision for me.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20386 on:** September 26, 2019, 09:56:10 AM »

oh Good because I have not read it and always wanted to but it is one of those books I just never felt good about picking up on my own - Talked to Pat and where she did not make a choice she was game about the plan - ambitious only that the books are long but chapter by chapter and week after week - we should be OK - without our being conscious of the influence these myths have on our lives it will be neat to look at the stories of early western society.

Your Welsh background may come out as we read, to better understand the traditions - Only visited Wales one time back in the early 80s - goodness that is nearly 40 years ago - visited Cardiff and outside the city there was a recreation, or maybe they brought to the site, old timber buildings. Most were small. It was the recreation of an early maybe sixteen century village - wonder If I still have any of the photos I took - the big thing then was slides - hmm wonder what condition they are in after all these years of being in carousals in my closet. However, the myths in The Mabinogion go much further back in history than the recreated village represented.

I've read a few of the Irish myths and I'm anxious to see the difference. Both nations are part of the most western part of Europe with St. George's Channel between and Wales also overlooking a piece of the Atlantic. Seems to me I recently saw a documentary about they finding what could be Arthur's castle area, high and overlooking the Atlantic.

Frybabe · « **Reply #20387 on:** September 26, 2019, 12:59:07 PM »

Barb, I watched, some months back a five part series on YouTube called The History of Wales. It is quite interesting. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfKYqjempvc

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20388 on:** September 26, 2019, 01:06:41 PM »

Thanks frybabe -

PatH · « **Reply #20389 on:** September 26, 2019, 01:30:02 PM »

I'm still looking at the contenders to see if one is a clear choice, but I'm in no matter which one we choose.

Frybabe · « **Reply #20390 on:** September 26, 2019, 02:01:51 PM »

I know practically nothing about Sir Percival. Parzival, A Knightly Epic is nicely rendered, but I think I will be rewording or translating the translation to truley understand what is being written..

I finished Quantum a little while ago. Darn! It is going to get a sequel.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20391 on:** September 26, 2019, 04:23:01 PM »

Actually there is nothing stopping us from doing 2 - granted The Mabinogion chapters are each like short stories but there are only 11 of them - where as the Parzival, A Knightly Epic chapters are much shorter although there are 18 plus an intro and another for all the appendixes so 18 weeks in total added to 11 weeks - with a two week break during the holidays - that is a total of 31 weeks

If we start October 14 there are 9 weeks till the 2 week break - pick up on the 30th that brings us till the end of April - They are predicting a cold winter and so for some it could still be cold till the end of April - something to think about.

Jonathan · « **Reply #20392 on:** September 29, 2019, 02:29:31 PM »

What a coincidence, Barb. I too was in Wales in the eighties. Taking slides. So many glorious things to photograph. I don't remember too much about Cardiff, but Llangollen comes to mind. And I have a magnificent, enlarged photo of Chirk castle on my wall. Llangollen, of course. was the home of The Ladies,(in the 18c) whom all travellers in Wales wanted to visit. I have the book, The Ladies of Llangollen, by Elizabeth Mavor. I'd be very happy to propose the book for discussion.

I've just finished The Divine Sarah, the magnificent theater superstar in the 19c. What an honor to be played by her. And yet this amazing actress had a glorious life of her own. Part of the Paris scene that Proust tried to capture in his memory book.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20393 on:** September 29, 2019, 03:00:05 PM »

Hope you can peek in and add to our discussion Jonathan - we are deciding between these book all of which are online - do you want to add your pick -

The chooses are...

The Champions of the Round Table (https://www.sacred-texts.com/neu/eng/crt/index.htm) Written and Illustrated by Howard Pyle [1905] This is Howard Pyle's retelling of the legends of three of the most illustrious knights of the Round Table, Sir Lancelot, Sir Tristram and Sir Percival.

Four Arthurian Romances: "Erec Et Enide", "Cliges", "Yvain", And "Lancelot" (https://www.gutenberg.org/files/831/831-h/831-h.htm) by Chretien De Troyes
This versions is written in prose form however, these characters bring us back to the beginnings of the Arthur legend and these 4 exclude the 5th by De Troyes, the unfinished tale of Sir Percival - De Troyes died before he could complete Sir Percival.

The choice of Parzival, a Knightly Epic by Wofram Von Eschenbach -
(https://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/e/eschenbach/wolfram_von/parzival/complete.html)
This German telling of the Parzival story continues past the De Troyes storyline. It was used by composer Richard Wagner in his opera Parsifal as well as used as the basis for the blockbuster, Raiders of the Lost Ark

Then the one I would really like to tackle the Welsh epic - The Mabinogion translated by Lady Charlotte Guest.
https://www.sacred-texts.com/neu/celt/mab/index.htm#contents of which the first 5 tales are part of the Arthur legend.

And finally The Lays of Marie de France - https://www.gutenberg.org/files/11417/11417-h/11417-h.htm
Lays means short stories or poems usually with a religious connection - Medieval poet, Marie de France first published in 1160. The poems are tales of love and adventure. The collection was extremely popular in royal circles at the time. Although it is unclear who de France was, it is likely that she was the abbess of a late twelfth-century abbey. She was probably the illegitimate daughter of Geoffrey Plantagenet, which makes her the half sister of Henry II King of England, Duke of Normandy and Aquitaine, Count of Anjou, Maine, and Nantes; at various times, he also partially controlled Scotland, Wales and the Duchy of Brittany.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20394 on:** September 30, 2019, 01:11:02 PM »

Can you believe it is the last day of September - the days just flew by - OK it is probably going to be the three of us - if others join that will be great - we will focus on one chapter a week - and yes, it appears we will read The Mabinogion - having two different translations frybabe will only make our discussion richer - it will be interesting to learn the differences.

I have not read The Mobinogion and so it will be each of us sharing our views and what we find that will allow us more insight - our schedule will be one chapter a week starting Monday October 14 which is exactly 2 weeks from today and continue through the second week in December - we'll take a break for two weeks and if y'all prefer we can start back up on the 30th or wait and start back on the second of January - we will cross that bridge when we're there - with 9 weeks in one chunk there will only be 2 or at most a 3rd wrap up week in January - if we decide to do another prose narrative from this list of 5, we can make that decision in January - we may want something else by then.

The version online from Sacred Texts includes pages of additional notes and so it appears it's been made easier to go deeper into the story and how it is told, along with learning some historical traditions -

OK there will be another discussion site prepared for our reading The Mobinogion starting Monday, October 14

PatH · « **Reply #20395 on:** September 30, 2019, 01:44:22 PM »

Great. Count me in.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20396 on:** September 30, 2019, 04:00:55 PM »

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #20397 on:** October 01, 2019, 08:44:21 PM »

Oh my I think we are in for a wonderful reading experience... found this written as a summation of The Mabinogion

"The Mabinogion is to Welsh mythology what the tales of Zeus, Hera, and Apollo are to Greek myth. these tales constitute a powerful work of the imagination, ranking with Tokien's Lord of the Rings novels and T.H. White's The Once and Future King. Evangeline Walton's compelling rendition of these classic, thrilling stories of magic, betrayal, lost love, and bitter retribution include the encounter between Prince Pwyll and Arawn, the God of Death, which Pwyll survives by agreeing to kill the one man that Death cannot fell, and the tale of Bran the Blessed and his family's epic struggle for the throne. The Mabinogion is internationally recognized as the world's finest arc of Celtic mythology; Walton's vivid retelling introduces an ancient world of gods and monsters, heroes, kings and quests, making accessible one of the greatest fantasy sagas of all time."

Frybabe · « **Reply #20398 on:** October 02, 2019, 06:26:59 AM »

Barb, this is particularly auspicious because today we start the Fall season meetings of our local Welsh Society. The Society has been going for about 65 years, but now seems to be on its last legs. Most are older than me. One member, unable to attend, is 105. They sing the Welsh national anthem at the meeting and have the priest/minister say a prayer at the beginning and end. Sue and I recently joined. We are hoping to revitalize the group, but that is highly improbable. Part of the problem is that the meetings are held during the day when most of the younger set are at work. Also, I think they need to make the meetings more appealing and relevant to they younger set. I am not an organizer, so I don't know how much I can do to help the group. I may mention our upcoming discussion at today's meeting. Who knows, there might be a reader or two among the group who are interested.

PatH · « **Reply #20399 on:** October 02, 2019, 11:44:25 AM »

It will be interesting to see what happens if we're all using different versions. I think they aren't just different translations of one Welsh document; the stories were hanging around, in different forms, and different authors wrote down different ones. I own the book too, picked up used somewhere and not yet read. I'm pretty sure it's not any of the authors mentioned here, but I'm still in Portland, so can't check. I'll get back to Bethesda tomorrow night, and I think I know exactly where it is.

Although I haven't read the original, I'm familiar with some of the stories by a different route. Lloyd Alexander, author of children's books, wrote a five volume series, the Prydain series, about the adventures of Taran, who starts out as an assistant pig keeper, and ends up as king of Prydain, having saved it from the forces of evil. Alexander says he luted most of it straight from the Mabinogion, even an oracular pig, who reads the future with the aid of thrown sticks.

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