Author Topic: Greater Journey, The by David McCullough ~July Book Club Online (Read 10662 times)

JoanP · « **on:** June 27, 2014, 06:13:37 PM »

The Book Club Online is the oldest book club on the Internet, begun in 1996, open to everyone. We offer cordial discussions of one book a month, 24/7 and enjoy the company of readers from all over the world. Everyone is welcome.

July Book Club Online

July 14, Bastille Day! Post below if you can join us, s'il vous plait!

The Greater Journey: Americans in Paris
by David McCullough

"Magnifique! I should have known--McCullough is one of my favorite history writers, and he's writing about nineteenth-century Paris, one of my favorite places to read/think/dream about. When I was young I always wanted to go to Paris--but not Francois Mitterand's Paris. No, I wanted Degas' Paris, Balzac's Paris, Toulouse-Lautrec's Paris. Well, this was an extended visit to that same Paris but through fresh eyes." Goodreads review

"In The Greater Journey, David McCullough tells the enthralling, inspiring—and until now, untold—story of the adventurous American artists, writers, doctors, politicians, and others who set off for Paris in the years between 1830 and 1900, hungry to learn and to excel in their work. What they achieved would profoundly alter American history." Amazon review

Come join us in July as we discover what caught David McCullough's attention about this particular period in history and how it influenced American History.

Discussion Schedule:

Week 1 - July 14 - 21 ~ Part I/ Chapters 1 & 2
Week 2 - July 21 - 27 ~ Part I/ Chapters 3 & 4
Week 3 - July 28 - Aug. 3 ~ Part II/ Chapters 5 & 6
Week 4 - Aug. 4 - 10 ~ Part II/ Chapters 7 & 8
Week 5 - Aug. 11 - 17 ~ Part III/ Chapters 9, 10, 11
Week 6- Aug. 18 - 24 ~ Part III/ Chapters 12,13,14

Discussion Leaders: JoanP, PatH Barb, JoanK, Marci

JoanP · « **Reply #1 on:** June 29, 2014, 12:29:20 PM »

Really excited about this! A big fat book - we'll take our time with it - starting mid-July and going right to the end of August. Can't go wrong with David McCullough's well-researched, well-written subjects. I've always envied Mrs. McCullough, who has often accompanied him to the places he has gone for his books. Paris! While your husband is working, unearthing the delicious material that make up this book!

Do join us in this discussion - it's the next best thing to being young and free in Paris - with Mrs. McC! (By the way, the book is dedicated to David McCullough's wife.)

Let's see if we can determine just why the author chose this subject - the Americans in Paris, at this particular time in history, between 1860 and 1900, as we wait for others to claim lounge chairs for the ship's crossing...

ps For those who are reading Robin Oliveira's I Always Loved You - you will probably enjoy Mary Cassatt in this context. McCullough devotes much space to Miss Mary.

PatH · « **Reply #2 on:** June 29, 2014, 03:23:15 PM »

I'm in. My book comes tomorrow.

mrssherlock · « **Reply #3 on:** June 30, 2014, 11:34:37 AM »

It's available now, I'll pick it up when notified. I love that period when Hemingway, Fitzgerald, etc, were there. The Roaring Twenties-my mother was dismayed when I asked her if she had been a flapper.

JoanP · « **Reply #4 on:** June 30, 2014, 11:38:29 AM »

Er, I don't want to say this too loud, Jackie - but David McCullough's book covers the period between 1830 and 1900 - just before the roaring 20's started to roar - and flap. Don't go away! The book will lay a good groundwork for their arrival. I'm really curious why he selected this time period. You just know he had a reason!

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #5 on:** June 30, 2014, 02:41:43 PM »

This is great - we can have so much fun with this read - Many historical characters to brush up on and see how we are long time friends with the people of France. And starting Bastille Day - what a perfect time to start.

This book was not my first choice but I am warming to it by the minute - looking at our roots and how we affected France and how France affected our thinking and life - perfect - I am seeing this read as a shot in the arm that will remind us of who we are. Those who we will read about swells my heart with excitement - really looking forward to what everyone will share - this will be a fun summer reading David McCullough

Rather than limiting the time allowed by the library to borrow the book I just got around it spending a penny plus postage on Amazon - Yep, they still have a few used copies for a penny - considering the gas to the library to pick up a borrowed copy this purchase almost wipes out the cost of borrowing versus owning, with no pressure to return on a certain date - who knows, it might even become a keeper.

Let us know if you will be joining the read - this is one of the more exciting reads we have embarked on in the last few months - appealing to historians, those who like biography and a story that reads like an adventure novel. It's got it all - I just know we are going to have a great discussion with a good crowd of folks we have all grown to know and love... please, add your two cents - I am looking forward to hearing what everyone's take is on The Greater Journey: Americans in Paris.

JoanK · « **Reply #6 on:** June 30, 2014, 03:20:06 PM »

I'm in.

bellamarie · « **Reply #7 on:** July 02, 2014, 08:54:09 AM »

Packing my bags, my vacation begins in just two days.....will end just in time to begin this book with all of you. So I guess I will label one trunk "Paris" and wait for the ship to sail. It ought to be a great adventure! See you all on board, or meet you in Paris! Never been to Paris nor read McCullough, so once again Seniorlearn will introduce me to a couple of "firsts."

Ciao for now~

p.s. BarbSt.A. thanks for the tip, I may get my penny's worth + s.h. and own the book.

marcie · « **Reply #8 on:** July 02, 2014, 11:32:22 AM »

I'm in too :-)

mrssherlock · « **Reply #9 on:** July 02, 2014, 11:59:44 AM »

Of course I will join you all in Paris. The Degas/Cassatt story was ill-timed-who can redict family crises? Not serious but my son was the victim of a rogue kidney stone. Bladder stopped working, edema, temp of 102, hospital stay three days. Olivera's prose was no competition. Thanks to Ginny I escaped here-and-now and lost myself in The Divorce Papers which I cannot praise too highly. I'm looking forward to relishing McCullough's skill.

bellamarie · « **Reply #10 on:** July 02, 2014, 12:56:35 PM »

mrssherlock, I am so very sorry to hear about your son. I hope he is feeling better now. I began The Divorce Papers also, it must have been you, or Ginny I saw was reading it. I actually like the email style writing. It is the way the world communicates today. Glad to see someone tackle it. Meet you in Paris.

I bought the book today for my iPad. Was only $11.00 and I like being able to have it and not worry about it expiring in my online library. I got it at ibook, I checked out Amazon and the prices were a couple dollars less for a used hard copy, with notes and highlights. Although some think it would be fun to have others notes and highlights in books, it can also be a distraction and sway my own thinking. I like to start fresh.....and mark up my own.

mrssherlock · « **Reply #11 on:** July 02, 2014, 08:09:08 PM »

Bellamarie: Thank you for asking, he is doing well and will have the devices removed as well as the kidney stone next week, outpatient surgery.

Yes, the email format worked well and, as you say, we all have mail. I enjoyed the intellectual challenge as well, keeping in mind the cast of characters and their different threads. As with my favorite books I wanted more, but I guess it's like eating a guilty pleasure, quit before satiation sets in.

How do you like your ipad for reading? My kids want me to get one.

Ella Gibbons · « **Reply #12 on:** July 03, 2014, 09:48:07 AM »

HURRAY, A McCULLOUGH BOOK - This is one I haven't read and I am so happy this was chosen to discuss. I have fond memories of another McCullough discussion that took six weeks and was an absolute delight; consequently I have never forgotten the book - JOHN ADAMS.

Does anyone remember that one? A few years ago!

I'll be here and in such good company, too.

I thank you for choosing this book to discuss.

JoanP · « **Reply #13 on:** July 03, 2014, 10:57:45 AM »

What an outstanding group! Welcome, JoanK, , Marcie, Bella, PatH and now Ella too! Of course I remember Jobn Adams. Back in 2001. It's safe in the Archives... So glad you will be joining us!

Jackie, I thought you were opting out because McCullough stopped short of the roaring 20's...glad to hear you're still with us. I'm really curious to learn why he chose these particular years, 1860-1900, aren't you?

ANNIE · « **Reply #14 on:** July 04, 2014, 07:24:56 AM »

When I find a book that has David McCullough's name on it,I just know that it will be good to read. So, count me in. Now to find a copy cheap or free for my iPad Mini. Viva la France! My granddaughter will be in Paris next week, visiting her friends who are working there. She was there as a high school student. She will be tangoing across the boulevards!

ANNIE · « **Reply #15 on:** July 04, 2014, 07:46:08 AM »

Well, I ordered a last book available from Amazon's marketplace but was surprised to see that its arrival date is for July 11th-28. I guess I will see what my library has to offer now. Keeping my fingers crossed!
My gosh, that was easy! The library has 41 copies available! I place my order immediately! Can't wait to see this. I am assuming that reading this one in bed will cause one to need physical therapy immediately thereafter! 558 pages? And hardback, too? Good grief!

JoanP · « **Reply #16 on:** July 04, 2014, 12:07:06 PM »

Annie - will granddaughter have Internet access? How long will she be in Paris? Maybe she could be our roving reporter? Shall I find an assignment for her? Wouldn't that be fun?

So happy you will be joining us...and glad that your library has so many copies! (It will be easy to renew!

)
Don't let the number of pages get to you...Lots of pages of photographs are included in the count.

To avoid physical therapy, let's warn not to read in bed! How about short doses - sitting upright - in firm chair?

Glad you'll be joining us, Annie!

Jonathan · « **Reply #17 on:** July 04, 2014, 02:22:44 PM »

Why did the author chooseThe Greater Journey as the title? I would have chosen The Greatest Journey myself. And that's after looking at the magnificent art reproductions and photographs in three sections. And this book will surely set me on another journey, travelling around the U.S.A. looking for Augustus Saint-Gaudens' statues of Lincoln, Sherman, Farragut, and the strange ADAMS MEMORIAL in Washington's Rock Creek Cemetery, and THE PURITAN in Springfield, Mass. And don't miss the photo opposite page 305, of Gus and Gussie aboard ship on a trip to Spain. Judging by Gussie's smile and Gus's scowl this journey was her idea. One could easily make a journey out of the double-page reproduction of Samuel Morse's Gallery of the Louvre. One can quickly lose oneself among those thirty-odd masterpieces. Did I read somewhere that the original is in Chicago? Shucks, that's only a day's drive. I'll be back in time for the discussion. And after that...off to Paris for more joie di vivre as one character in the book puts it.

Jonathan · « **Reply #18 on:** July 04, 2014, 02:30:16 PM »

And what a great portrait of the elderly Andrew Jackson. "I'm too tired to sit for this picture," he said to the painter George Healey. And then he turned on the true grit. And died days later.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #19 on:** July 04, 2014, 02:32:45 PM »

Ok lets look at the number of pages - no it is not 343 pages like I Always Loved You - but its not Gone With the Wind 733 pages or Brothers Karamazov with 960 pages or Opera's Faulkner summer Trilogy, As I lay...The Sound of...Light in August of 1105 pages or our recent read of Bleak House at 1036 pages - this is only 576 pages and that is only 128 pages more than Clara and Mr. Tiffany - subtract the pages with photos and it is probably around 100 page difference between that delightful and engrossing read.

We're fine - just fine and this time there was forethought, thanks JoanP, so that 6 weeks is planned for the reading schedule - remember when we would read till we were done and some books took several months - I hope we are not succumbing to thinking like instant messaging - quick quick quick so that we can savor these books. Let's be dinosaurs as long as we can even if we are on the brink of change as the old order was during the summer of 1914. Getting into a book can be delicious and this author should open us to a lovely time together.

JoanK · « **Reply #20 on:** July 04, 2014, 04:11:51 PM »

Don't despair: yes the book is 500+ pages, but almost half of it is notes and references (as it should be in a serious history book). That won't make it lighter to hold, but should make it quicker to read. And David McCullough is so readable, his books always go fast

I have the book on kindle, so I can't tell you how long the actual text is. Maybe someone else can post it.

I'm delighted to see a relative will be on the trip: Samuel Morse is a (very) distant relative of PatH and me. I've always been intrigued by the fact that he was both an inventor of note (the telegraph) and a respected painter. In my invention-oriented household (our father was a patent lawyer) we always thought of him as an inventor -- I'm anxious to meet the painter.

ANNIE · « **Reply #21 on:** July 05, 2014, 10:12:58 AM »

JoanK, Did you ever visit the Morse Museum in Orlando?Interesting place all dedicated to the Morse family and its painters. Samuel is represented there,too.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #22 on:** July 05, 2014, 12:17:17 PM »

Did y'all see the hour long David McCullough interviews with Charlie Rose last night - he briefly mentioned this book that those who went to France did so to bring back to America knowledge and culture as well as more advanced political skills - some "things" but more of what they could soak up that would change their appreciation of life. He also said his favorite book was the Adams book. He gave a beautiful description of both Adams and Hamilton, they're differences and they're similarities. He compared Truman to Adams since both became presidents following a strong and popular president.

The hour long show was snatches of past interviews - well done, informative and knowing we are reading one of his books it was a joy to see the author - some PBS stations repeat at around noon the last Charlie Rose show - you might want to see if it repeats in your area on Monday.

ANNIE · « **Reply #23 on:** July 05, 2014, 02:08:53 PM »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBl2EfToTCs

Here's 58 minutes of a CSPAN interview.

About our title, its really worth watching and thanks, BarbStAubrey, for calling it to our attention.

JoanP, would we maybe all want to see this while we are discussing the book or even before? Maybe you could put a link up in the title? One of the best interviews that I have seen on PBS.

JoanP · « **Reply #24 on:** July 05, 2014, 09:23:24 PM »

JoanK - Samuel Morse is your cousin? Several times removed? This is wonderful! Maybe we can trace your family tree? Samuel figures prominently in this book!

Jonathan...delighted you will be joining us in The 'Greatest Journey'! Welcome!
Yes, you're right - Morse's Louvre is part of the Terra Foundation of American Art in Chicago. I'm sure we could find it. Wanna go?

uh oh - Don't pack your bags just yet. I just read this -

"Despite the closure of the Museum in 2004, the Foundation continues to actively collect paintings, sculptures, works on paper, and other objects representing achievement in American art from the late eighteenth century to 1945. The collection currently comprises hundreds of works by artists such as John Singleton Copley, James McNeill Whistler, Mary Cassatt, Winslow Homer, Marsden Hartley, and Edward Hopper. The Foundation lends these works to institutions and exhibitions worldwide and maintains a comprehensive database of the collection. A selection of Terra Foundation paintings remains on long-term loan to the Art Institute of Chicago, and the Art Institute also houses the Foundation’s collection of works on paper. "

Let's try to locate Morse's Louvre painting before the discussion is over, okay?

JoanP · « **Reply #25 on:** July 05, 2014, 09:33:02 PM »

Thanks for the link to that interview with McCullough, Barb. I'm a bit confused when it was on TV...thought it was an interview from 2011, right after The Greater Journey was published - wondering why it was on TV last night.

Annie, I agree, this interview - and another with the Books TV guy - Brian Lamb will go into the heading once the discussion begins. Since both interviews get into the details discussed in the opening chapters of the book - Let's wait until everyone gets his/her book and McCullough has had a chance to present his story first. We'll start on July 14 with Part I.

I think this is going to be a rich discussion. Rich and enjoyable!

ps How long will your granddaughter be in Paris?

mrssherlock · « **Reply #26 on:** July 06, 2014, 02:34:07 PM »

Got my book!

JoanP · « **Reply #27 on:** July 06, 2014, 08:39:13 PM »

Great news, Jackie!
How are others doing?

We'll be starting a week from tomorrow...here's the discussion schedule if you are ready to start reading. Please don't get overwhelmed with the number of names McCullough includes in the opening chapters. They will start taking on personalities of their own - and if they don't, they either weren't important - or the author is saving them for later. Please don't try to memorize the names whatever you do!!

Discussion Schedule:

Week 1 - July 14 - 21 ~ Part I/ Chapters 1 & 2
Week 2 - July 21 - 27 ~ Part I/ Chapters 3 & 4
Week 3 - July 28 - Aug. 3 ~ Part II/ Chapters 5 & 6
Week 4 - Aug. 4 - 10 ~ Part II/ Chapters 7 & 8
Week 5 - Aug. 11 - 17 ~ Part III/ Chapters 9, 10, 11
Week 6- Aug. 18 - 24 ~ Part III/ Chapters 12,13,14

mabel1015j · « **Reply #28 on:** July 07, 2014, 12:28:29 PM »

I read this many months ago. I can't get it from my library at the moment because they are moving and are closed. I may remember parts of it as you discuss it and i'll get it as quickly as i can.

Jean

Jonathan · « **Reply #29 on:** July 07, 2014, 02:22:26 PM »

"When I was young I always wanted to go to Paris." From the Goodreader Review at the top of this page.

What could this 'young' reader have read that made Paris an attractive destination? The Hunchback of Notre Dame? All This And Heaven Too? The Tale of Two Cities? Our Hearts Were Young and Gay? The Last Time I Saw Paris? Is Paris Burning? Don't we have them all, and more, on our shelves? Nothing surprised me more than the reaction of some to this book proposal. It seems they would rather go to the beach!!!

Just recently I read of the strange experience Billy Graham had in Paris when he was starting out on his evangelistic career. More correctly, his mission. Let the details remain secret. Unless you want to look for them in Charles Templeton's An Anecdotal Memoir. It put me in mind of the riddle that preoccupied the Parisian males: What has more lovely curves than a woman? The answer? Of course...their very own sensuous river Seine. For many artists it was the line that conveyed the artistry And who provided more of those than their models?

I think I'll go to the beach this afternoon.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #30 on:** July 07, 2014, 03:00:54 PM »

My book has not yet arrived - it is scheduled for delivery this week - just checked and no mail yet - it has been awhile since I was actually impatient waiting for a book delivery -

Reminds me of being a kid and waiting impatiently for Saturday to roll around when my Mom and I walked a couple of miles together to grocery shop which included my going to the library while she shopped - I loved seeing all those stacks of books -

I remember skimming each book to see if there were words I did not know and then would ask the girl behind the polished mahogany desk how to say the word - all was well and I chose my three books before mom came to get me but one day a new librarian - oh lordy - she was bound and determined I should really know the word and could sound it out and all sorts of calisthenics using the word in a sentence etc. - I was panicked she took so much time that I would be able to get my three books before Mama came.

Needless to say I never again asked how to say a word I did not know and just skipped it when reading - for years the various character names, especially the Russians were reduced to - oh the guy with the cigar or the guy that gets mad or the women who has the fur coat. Years later I would surprise myself when associating their names with my childhood descriptions, oh ya that it the one that smokes the cigar etc. fun and games but that anticipation of choosing new books each week filled me up.

mabel1015j · « **Reply #31 on:** July 07, 2014, 04:23:13 PM »

I am probably checking out the Better World Books store tomorrow. I just discovered there is one not too far from me. They have the book on the national website, maybe the store will have some.

Jean

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #32 on:** July 07, 2014, 06:02:11 PM »

Well it came - I've already read most of the first chapter - yes, lots of names - but what is making this read even more interesting for me - delivered in a separate envelope is my copy of "For the Soul of France, Culture Wars in the age of Dreyfus" by Frederick Brown -

Fascinating - he goes from 1848 and concludes in 1908 - this is the era when France became a secular nation rather than a Catholic nation, schools were freed from tuition and eduction became mandatory, divorce is legalized and public prayer abolished - during this time published is Vie de Jèsus one of the two or three best-selling books published in France in the nineteenth century. Popes issue encyclicals addressing the gamut from capital and labor to affirming the doctrine of papal infallibility. Hordes, millions of everyday folk pilgrim to places like Lourdes, and La Salette. There are several governments and a corrupt attempt to build the Panama Canal. Several important French Leaders taking extended trips to the US to learn from us. I am thrilled with this reading combo - looks like another side of the picture can be filled in.

pedln · « **Reply #33 on:** July 07, 2014, 08:14:38 PM »

Happy 81st Birthday,David McCullough!

I have this book on my Kindle, picked up when the price was right. It was useful for me when we read I Always Loved You, fortis additional info about Mary Cassatt.

Annie, the Morse Museumis on my bucket list -- has been ever since we read Clara and Mr Tiffany. It has the largest Tiffany collection in the US, maybe world.

I he to join in here when I return home and am not playing board games,etc. with our 7- year-old. Or watching soccer.

JoanP · « **Reply #34 on:** July 08, 2014, 05:12:13 AM »

Jean - you're serious? You have a Better World Books near you? I'm really looking forward to hearing about it - physically, a giant used bookstore? - and also if you were able to find the book, of course.

Barb - the Brown book sounds fascinating. I never fully understood the brouhaha over the Dreyfus affaire, though can see it was bitter and divisive. Will be interested to hear how the Americans in Paris got involved with the debate. Glad your McCullough book arrived in the same mail.

Pedln, you do get around! Who are you routing for World Cup today? Germany? Brasil?
We'd have missed David McCullough's b'day yesterday...if you hadn't remembered! Thank you!

What a life he lives - doing what he loves, with his family involved. He says in this biography that he'd pay to do what he does if he had to -

Biography - David McCullough

ANNIE · « **Reply #35 on:** July 08, 2014, 11:09:59 AM »

joanP, back a few posts ago, you ask about my granddaughters time in Paris. She doesn't leave until July 11 and has only one week there when she joins her intended. He is still researching and teaching at one of the universities in Paris. She will be home on July 18th. So not much help there for our discussion. They plan on tangoing across Paris! That's how they met three years ago. And they are good! VIVA LA TANGO AND PARIS!

I picked up my book on my way out of town. We are visiting my brother who is ill.

mrssherlock · « **Reply #36 on:** July 08, 2014, 12:51:34 PM »

Well, I've just spent 30 minutes writing a reply with carefully researched references to obscure websites which would have surpassed very other reply on the Seniorlearn site but it disappeared in the blink of an eye. It will take me some time to recover and attempt it again.

BarbStAubrey · « **Reply #37 on:** July 08, 2014, 01:37:42 PM »

Don't you just hate it when that happens - Happened to me the other night when writing to my grandson - it was a long message helping him to cook a chicken in a way that created 9 meals - he is trying to reduce his cost of eating and I even shopped for what he would need to see if it would fit his budget - to loose all that work is maddening.

Just hit me - you know who would have been changing, simplifying and coding French Cooking at this time the great Georges Auguste Escoffier - his cookbook is still basic to many. He and his partners transformed the Savoy in London in 1890 and the Paris Ritz in 1898. I did not know but he was in the army during the Franco Prussian war and from the experience wanted to learn and perfect the canning of food.

Jonathan · « **Reply #38 on:** July 08, 2014, 02:36:39 PM »

That's wonderful, Barb. Nine meals from one chicken! My reaction to that is IMPOSSIBLE!! Said in the French way. Try to recover that post. Do you start with having the chicken lay a couple of eggs first for a souffle? And then boil up the puddle it walked through for chicken soup? Do you have ckicken Kiev in there somewhere? Six to go....

And I do believe we could make 9 discussions out of this book with your help. As for capturing the soul of France, I do believe Frederick Brown could do that. You're sure to enjoy the book. I have two of his: Theater & Revolution, The Culture of the French Stage, and Pere La Chaise, Elysium as Real Estate. Brown does very well at finding the French soul. Shall we get him to find us a plot in that other Paris? What could they be going for, now. Do you have a preference for certain arrondisements?

JoanK · « **Reply #39 on:** July 09, 2014, 04:23:54 PM »

Alas, my memory of Paris is that it poured the whole time we were there. Hope I get a chance to go back in another life.

Morse is some sort of cousin, nth cousin, m times removed, where n and m are large numbers (which I don't know). But I still take a proprietary interest in him. Can't wait for the second week when we paint his painting!

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Author Topic: Greater Journey, The by David McCullough ~July Book Club Online (Read 10662 times)