Author Topic: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online  (Read 36964 times)

Mkaren557

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #120 on: September 11, 2015, 12:25:24 AM »
For Love of Lakes
Author ~ Darby Nelson: Aquatic Ecologist, Prof. Emeritus

"Deep feelings of joy, of belonging, envelop me. Boundaries melt, I seem as one with water, rock, and lily, all part of a magnificent whole. ~ Darby Nelson

Landscape is not "land," it is not "nature," and it is not space...
A place owes its character to the experience it affords to those who
spend time there, to the sights and sounds, and indeed the smells, that
constitute its specific ambience.  And those in turn, depend on the
kind of activities in which its inhabitants engage.
~ Tim Ingold


We are the landscape of all we have seen. ~ Isamu Naguchi


Welcome ~ Pull up your chair and join us.
We are reading the section entitled -
 Mindscapes.


If you would like to join us and do not have your book we found that most of the book available to read from the Amazon preview link: For Love of Lakes

Link to, For Love of Lakes and tell us:
  • Tell us about 'your' nearby lake? How clear is the water? Are there wigglies in the water or floating bits? Has algae fouled the water?
  • Do you have memories of other lakes - what was special, how large was the lake and did you swim from a beach or fish from a dock or boat?
  • What did you know of Lake Agassiz and Louis Agassiz?
       - How does Stephen A. Forbes fit into the story of Lake Agassiz?
  • We learned most of our northern lakes and beaches were covered by an ice cap during the ice age. Water from a ghost lake, the ancient Agassiz surged and topped moraine dams, the result of glacier deposits and torrents of waters cut through the till... "huge boulders too large to be moved" accumulated and stopped the downcutting, forming lakes, ponds and rivers while altering the landscape we live with today.
  • Do you ever remember drinking directly from a river or lake?
  • Is there a quiet spot on your lake where you can hear the wind and the lap of the water?

Darby Nelson is a beautiful writer who adeptly weaves his cast of characters; insects, minuscule lake life, and rocks into a story of interdependence with his cast of birds and plant characters.

One, without the other is not possible and then, he enlightens us to the lake culprits that are draining the oxygen from our lakes, killing our fish and contaminating plants and birds. He tells the story as if a ballet, weaving and floating word pictures that show the beauty of these connections. His book would make a breathtaking movie rather than simply a documentary of facts and problems.

Rather than a list of focus questions, we are reading and sharing the words and information that strike us as well as, photos that further our understanding and enjoyment of the book (as Jane says, of reasonable size - A width of about 400 pixels should do it - need help with that please ask)

Let's continue to share 'our' lake stories and links to sites that make easy the lessons Darby Nelson, ever the teacher, is uncovering in
For Love of Lakes
     

Helpful Links:

Dictionary of Glaciation terms with photos: Landforms of Glaciation
A Glossary of terms: Glossary of Glacier Terminology - Text Version
PDF~The Lake as a Microcosm by Stephen A. Forbes (1887)
YouTube - Darby Nelson Tests Lake Water Quality

librivox-Acoustical liberation of books in the public domain
Walden by Henry David Thoreau (1817 - 1862)

Mindscapes is the section discussed this week of September 16.
Our next section, Futurescapes will be discussed the last week, starting Wednesday, September 23.


Discussion Leader: Barb




Barb, my brother and his wife moved here three years before I did.  I visited them and really liked the city.  It is small enough to be doable (I can drive without fear).  It also has an opera company, ballet, symphony, several theaters, a branch of the University of South Florida. 
Pat H-Funny you should mention the "green flash"  I have never seen it, but last April I went on a long cruise to the South Pacific.  I unhappily report that I was sick and mostly doing the hermit thing in my cabin.  I knew nothing about the the flash until we discussed it one night at dinner.  I tried to catch a few sunsets, but no luck.

BarbStAubrey

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #121 on: September 11, 2015, 03:03:20 AM »
whoops I did not catch the page turn so MKaren your post is now part of the heading - it happens and we are used to it - so now when folks check the heading there you will be...  :D  :-*
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

Mkaren557

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #122 on: September 11, 2015, 09:34:12 AM »
     Every time I open this book, I learn something new.  In this section, I discovered Stephen Forbes and his theory of the lake as a microcosm. The waterlillies, daphnids, dragonflies, sunfish, wild rice and even the gray slime together are the lake.  What inhabits the lake gives it its character.  Some lakes like Lake Winnipeg are "mean" lakes, other lakes, like Lake Fox are very sick, and my lake is somewhat sick, and some lakes like Sebec Lake in northern Maine and the pond at the staging area for the climb to the summit of Mt. Katahdin, Chimmney pond are crystal clear but in grave danger from the mercury that creeps into Maine from the industrial midwest. 
     My in-laws owned a large camp high above Lake Cobbossee and I spent many happy hours there.  It was probably forty feet of steps that got you to the water below.  The dock was built beside a huge rock and a big rock pile.  My boys learned to swim off that rock and I would read and think sitting on the rock with my feet in the water.  Light filtered through the pines and the and the birches that surrounded the lake, sunfish nibbled at my feet and after a fashion the lake and I became one.  In the dark of night I would swim and so would the eels; we shared the lake  quite peacefully.  I loved that rock but lost it in the divorce.
    I hate wild rice,  but how it grows and is harvested into the bottom of the boat is fascinating.  It must be a very healthy food(which is probably why I don't like it).  I love that the Ojibwa built their culture around this grain and when they were forced onto reservations they lost access to many of the rice lakes.   
     I love this book!
 

PatH

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #123 on: September 11, 2015, 12:30:50 PM »
I love the way he writes, too.  He's a scientist and poet combined.  He knows all the scientific facts, and gives us plenty of them, but he never loses sight of the beauty and the mood of what he's looking at.

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #124 on: September 11, 2015, 03:16:39 PM »
Yes, I too agree - some of his turn of phrase describing things is pure poetry - it has been awhile that I really love picking up a book and just feeling it because it contains so much wonder and this is very much that book. I thought I liked how Rachel Carson described especially her experience wrapping her grandchild in a blanket and walking along the edge of the ocean but even her book cannot compare to the beauty of reading this -

Forbes' words "The animals of such a body of water are, as a whole, remarkably isolated - closely related among themselves in all their interests, but so far independent of the land about them that if every terrestrial animal were suddenly annihilated it would doubtless be long before the general multitude of inhabitants of the lake would feel the effects of this event in any important way."

His quote remind me of the Cluny tapestries where royalty and nature are one with the senses. I used to know the senses depicted, forgot the 1st tapestry, the 2nd is hearing, forgot the 3rd, the 4th is tasting, 5th seeing, 6th touching - but it is the close up of the background flowers, bugs and animals along with the fruit on the trees - we did know about humans as part of the symphony of nature but we seem to have lost it.

I have not seen them but I understand in NYC at the Metropolitan Museum of Art there are a set of Tapestries on a blue background depicting a hunt for the Unicorn, and they too have a background of flowers, tiny animals and insects. 

“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #125 on: September 11, 2015, 03:28:40 PM »
Which by the way, found a PDF copy of The Lake as a Microcosm by Stephen A. Forbes and it is in the heading.
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

BarbStAubrey

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #126 on: September 11, 2015, 03:48:40 PM »
Close up of Chara and a Chara Meadow with an Ash Meadow pupfish glistening among the Chara that is displaying its orangy-red sperm pockets - did find that another vernacular for Chara is Stonewart. 

“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

PatH

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #127 on: September 11, 2015, 04:46:21 PM »
I've seen the Cluny tapestries, and they're magnificent.  They're so rich in detail, and the many small animals and flowers show such a love for the natural world.  You can sit and stare for a long time.  I see they have been cleaned and restored since I saw them in 2004, so if I ever get back to Paris I'll have to see them again.

nlhome

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #128 on: September 11, 2015, 05:22:58 PM »
We used to harvest wild rice, which is an interesting process. It was a pleasant activity in late summer/early fall. Harvesting involved a canoe, sticks, knocking rice into the bottom of the canoe as we paddled through the water. When I say "we," I must admit that I only went out on the water once to harvest, otherwise I just went out to check out the maturity of the rice. My husband usually went with my dad or another friend. But we all got into cleaning the rice, as there was an art to that and also a lot of work. But we did like it, using it in many different recipes, including stuffing for roast wild mallard and including pancakes and muffins and casseroles. The lakes we went on were shallow and had streams running through.

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #129 on: September 11, 2015, 05:36:09 PM »
oh my nlhome - real wild rice directly from the plant - what glory you have experienced in your life - between ice fishing and now harvesting wild rice - I have never had wild mallard - lots of Deer but few to no birds - my mom used to prepare goose, oh yes, and rabbit that I have not seen available in the grocery in years - you have me hungry for pancakes - another couple of weeks - although cooler today it is still 90. Too hot to heat up the kitchen so early in the day.

Mkaren forgot to thank you for sharing how you came to move to Florida - sounds like you hit a winner with all the perks you mentioned available where you are living.

Pat I have not been back since the 90s and notice the interior photos of the Cluny is much upgraded and more like a museum with glass cases placed in the rooms then the old Abby look with things hanging on the walls that I saw. In the meantime I am becoming more and more curious about seeing some of the National Parks that are all about lakes and rivers. I understand there are day trips on the Grand Canyon now so that you do not have to sign up for an excursion. Just looking at the local lakes with new eyes will be an adventure.
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

ANNIE

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #130 on: September 12, 2015, 10:40:39 AM »
I just picked up my library book yesterday and am way behind in the discussion but here's link to a magazine article from National Wildlife magazine about what is happening to our lakes this year.  Not a pretty picture! >:(

http://www.nwf.org/News-and-Magazines/National-Wildlife/Animals/Archives/2015/Algal-Blooms.aspx

Am only up to Pg. 49 but will continue on reading all the posts and hoping to catch up. I had another website to link you to but maybe its in inappropriate for now.  All about the Alpena and Lake Huron International Underwater Robotics annual competition.  This competition is spawning new scientists from all over the world.  Just an exciting happening in our high schools and colleges of today.  Later 'gater! :)
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PatH

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #131 on: September 12, 2015, 01:28:20 PM »
That's a discouraging article, Annie.  We don't seem to learn, do we.

BarbStAubrey

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #132 on: September 12, 2015, 02:00:55 PM »
Annie yes, scary - I think it was put together to not only alert the public but I think they hoped it would influence farmers.

Looks like from this article we learn that Lake Erie is the shallowest of the Great Lakes and the lake's watershed in not only densely populated but heavily farmed and highly industrialized. As a shallow lake from what we are learning the likelihood of algae growth is a given since a shallow lake will heat up providing an incubator for its growth as compared to a deeper moving lake.

http://www2.erie.gov/environment/index.php?q=lake-erie-watershed-protection-alliance

With the amount of farming alone using fertilizer that drains into a watershed there would be in time a problem - However, the choice of fertilizer is not always in the hands of the farmer - according to where they buy their seed and who is fronting the money for that year's crop, expecting first dibs on the profit if not the crop itself and often expecting the farmer to purchase from a certain supplier, can affect the farmer's ability to 'voluntarily' use less fertilizer.

Example - a farmer using GM seeds, herbicide action is within each GM seed that does wash into a watershed causing a growth of algae in the lake, river or stream that is fed by the watershed.

https://pennstatelaw.psu.edu/_file/aglaw/Impacts_of_Genetically_Modified.pdf

“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

JoanK

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #133 on: September 12, 2015, 04:23:17 PM »
We had terrible algae growths on the manmade lakes in my old neighborhood. And all kinds of stuff put into the water to control them -- who knows what further harm that does.

JoanK

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #134 on: September 12, 2015, 04:35:44 PM »
I'm way behind. I love the book, but have to read it in small bits.

Where I am, he is talking about "planktonic" animals, without defining it. An animal is "planktonic" if it floats or drifts as it's most important means of locomotion. Jelly fish are planktonic, but most p. organisms (plankton) are tiny. They exist in millions in all bodies of water, and are very important because they are the base of the food chain.

He has you imagine what it would be like, being such an animal. The one he talks about can move for short distances on it's own (a kind of hop) but mostly it's just taken here and there by currents and changes in water temperature (which helpfully change its depth during the day and night. I'm pretty lazy, but imagining such a life gives me the "creeps".

BarbStAubrey

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #135 on: September 12, 2015, 04:48:14 PM »
Yes, Joan someone else saying what I thought was age on my part - but the books is so dense without reading densely - his language allows you to glide along but each page is so packed with new information or more in-depth information than I know I ever imagined and so too I read small chunks at a time - Just the concept of plankton and as you say how it hops along dependent completely on a host - never knew that - in fact I just assumed plankton was inert like floating bits of bark not thinking it was a life force.

Been a long long time since I ever read a book twice but I can see this is going to be one of those books - I get it but since so much is new it will take a second read for me to really own that I get it. And so that thought actually freed me up to just read and now ponder every other sentence as if it were the last time I would ever see that sentence or thought again. For sure the other help has been to immediately look up and find another web site that explains further what he is saying. 
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

BarbStAubrey

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #136 on: September 12, 2015, 05:05:41 PM »
Wheee look at what is on YouTube - a video with Darby Nelson - of course it will go into the heading...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6lX0VQkhwA
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

PatH

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #137 on: September 12, 2015, 06:14:19 PM »
I have the same trouble reading more than a little of the book at a time, even though I love it.  It's too rich, and I want to let one thing roll around i my head a while before moving on.  But I'm finally caught up, at least for now.

Barb, do I understand the heading correctly--that we will continue to discuss Lakescapes through Tuesday the 15th, then start talking about Mindscapes on Wednesday?

BarbStAubrey

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #138 on: September 12, 2015, 09:33:13 PM »
Yes Pat - there are four sections to the book and we started our discussion on Wednesday therefore, each Wednesday a new section - as you say the book is so rich so that our usual use of focus questions to guide our discussion almost belittled this book. I do not think any of us have read the entire book and so, it is easy as we come upon these astonishing bits or new understandings to comment and share not only our reaction but anything we find to further our understanding.

Relating what we read to our own lake at this point may be an extra step because I doubt seriously any of us ever thought, much less knew, all this was going on in front of our eyes but it does give us an anchor.  Some of what we are reading we have heard about, just not about our lake. It is an easy step to see with a quick Google if any of what we are reading has been written as part of the story of our lake.

By the way, saw the special on the Florida Everglades last night - in fact there were two back to back specials that featured the land in Florida - the story there appears to be less about industry and more about covering the land with roads that became barriers choking off the whole reason for the swamp and lake system.

The one hour long program did show some Good News of a state agency that has removed just under 300 miles of road built during the 1920s for a Real Estate and Resort boom that went bust, leaving behind this road that they recently removed. And then, one of the shows did show some current Native Indians who live in the swamp and know it like the back of their hand which brought me back to tying in the story of the Creek wars and removal of the of the Creek Nation during the early nineteenth century and the many Creeks who fled to Florida creating the Seminole Nation.

The Cherokee, Shawnee, Muscogee, Choctaw and Seminole are all part of the nation we labeled the Creeks - we got into all of this when we were reading for a month the poetry of Joy Harjo who was kind enough to join us for a bit. Two books that were eye opening are The Road To Disappearance, A History of the Creek Indians by Angie Debo and Deerskins & Duffels Creek Indian Trade with Anglo-America 1685 - 1815 by Kathryne Holland Braund.

Seeing the films of both Florida and Alabama it is easy to contemplate how comfortable the Creeks were in the original environment and how we, the Anglo not only pushed them off the land, discredited their intelligence and then proceeded to defile the land because of our uneducated Hubris. 
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

BarbStAubrey

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #139 on: September 12, 2015, 09:45:23 PM »
I am still conflicted and maybe I just do not yet know enough - but it appears the big culprit to the destruction of the environment points over and over to oil and gas and their by-products. Yes, it is easy to point fingers but then, if we were to live without the by-products of oil and gas I do not think it is possible. Every facet of daily living with the current population numbers and the commerce that supports jobs is dependent on oil and gas. As animals breed when there is a food supply to support them, we too have passed the point where we could manage the welfare of the population living as we did in the eighteenth and even nineteenth century. Even our medicine is a result of oil and gas dependency.

So how do you marry that with keeping an environment pure, clean and functioning as it was intended.

I do think we bought into many products that were not necessary - just because you can do something does not mean we must - little things like bringing our own sacks to the grocery - easy now for me to see since here, plastic sacks have been legally eliminated - Using natural fertilizer rather than oil based fertilizer - and all those plastic lawn chairs that weighed so much less compared to wood but...

Found this - a partial list of products made from petroleum - and this list in only a drop in the bucket - Holy Hannah

http://www.ranken-energy.com/products%20from%20petroleum.htm
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

PatH

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #140 on: September 12, 2015, 11:06:23 PM »
Even when we try to cut down on oil, we sometimes degrade lakes in the process.  Nelson points out that one source of the pollution is fertilizer needed to grow the excess corn needed to produce the ethanol that it's now mandatory to put in gasoline to make the oil go farther.

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #141 on: September 12, 2015, 11:11:52 PM »
Ah, JoanK, being a water flea is a life of ease, at least until you starve because the wrong plants are growing or something bigger eats you.

Did you notice the nifty description of the protective shell of Daphnia?  Like the body is stuffed inside a taco shell. :)

PatH

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #142 on: September 13, 2015, 11:45:50 AM »
Barb, thanks for that link to the article about the pros and cons of growing GMO crops.  It's very even handed and complete, not taking sides or getting emotional.

The thing I distrust most about them is that many of them have been modified to be resistant to the herbicide glyphosate.  The active ingredient in Roundup, it's a pretty nasty material, toxic and carcinogenic.  The farmers use large amounts of it to kill everything but the crops, and there is a residue in the crop.  Studies are incomplete on the safe limits of it, and the FDA allowed amount in food may well be too high. (Glyphosate is misspelled in the article--a typo of transposed letters.)

But, as spelled out in the article, we are messing with the environment in all sorts of unpredictable ways, without really knowing what we're doing, and the only plus side is to make more money off the crops.

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #143 on: September 13, 2015, 01:44:39 PM »
Hesitate to get too far away from Darby Nelson's book but when you look at the business of farming and the expectations of all those who have a finger in the success of a crop again, just like oil and gas it is difficult to find a clean answer.

Few farms are paid off - those family farmers are few and far between - so there is a mortgage of some sort - the cost of equipment that just like a business is often purchased with a loan and has a life cycle so money needs to be available for replacement. The cost of water is astronomical, the cost of labor is not like years ago with day labor that did not have to show up on the books.

Plus, all the manufacturers of annual products from seed to herbicide and fertilizer want their percentage - Monsanto is the one we hear about who expects the farmer to exclusively use their products once you sign on. Also the seed, fertilizer etc. is purchased with a loan so the farmer cannot afford to loose any of the crop and then on top, most farms have multiple owners, investors all expecting their investment to pay off because if it does not the farm owners are either searching for new investors or the farm is sold off and everyone involved loses.

I can see taking care of our lakes, rivers and streams needs to come from the heart and until you know something about someone or something there is no heartfelt connection however, from everything I see and read the fix is a series of 'no good' choices - difficult choices we may not be willing to accept or willing to push Congress to make those choices if we do not have a deep and abiding love for the ecology of the water ways beyond a place to play and relax.

We do not like it when our neighborhood changes so we hardly recognize it or the place on the lake we always went for fun, fishing or to retire no longer provides that kind of opportunity so we pick up and move or find another place to play or retire - we are not attached to staying as we hold fast a family heirloom or for that matter our children. 

From the little I know and I know very little about industry the changes are not easy and these changes affect far more than the water ways. The change effects, for instance to anyone like ourselves, living on proceeds from investments. The greater the cost to produce a carrot, the greater the cost in the grocery market but more, the less profit for any investment that goes into the production of that carrot from, those invested in iron and steel that is part of farm equipment, to those invested in labs that come up with the latest medical breakthrough but also, part of their work is developing a safer and as effective a herbicide and fertilizer.

All I see is the more additional fingers in this pie, the final product becomes too expensive, as onions and other low value crops are no longer grown in the US because of a lack of enough profit to balance costs. Now they are all grown in Mexico, on miles and miles, as far as the eye can see of what was desert and where there are few controls. If there is not sufficient profit for an investor they will switch investments just as if our neighborhood dramatically changes we switch neighborhoods. If many pull out of either an investment or a neighborhood it leaves behind a shell that becomes a burden to those managing the investment or the neighborhood. 

My instinct tells me we, the buying public will have as great an impact on farming methods as anything because when we stop buying, lower profits force change - we see it already in fast food and it is why getting labeling has become such an issue. And in fact our buying habits may be all that is left - I will gather the information for another post but Congress has been hog tied to legislate any change to the use, manufacture and advertising of fertilizer.   
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

ANNIE

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #144 on: September 13, 2015, 03:42:40 PM »
Another link to my National Wildlife magazine about the droughts and loss of water:
http://www.nwf.org/News-and-Magazines/National-Wildlife/Animals/Archives/2015/California-Drought.aspx

Part of this article mentions the problems that occur with drought.  The loss of certain kinds of fish and the saving of the salmon.  Sad story.  I have good friends who live on the mentioned Lake Meade.  They have sent us pictures of the falling lake for the past four years.
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JoanK

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #145 on: September 14, 2015, 04:45:13 PM »
I live in Southern California which has been terribly affected by the drought. I notice it most in the birds, we had almost no nesting birds this year. The nearby wetlands, which the towns people worked so hard to save from development, has been completely dry forever.

JoanK

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #146 on: September 14, 2015, 04:56:41 PM »
Now Darcy is talking about the plants in the lake. Since I live near the ocean, I have become fascinated by kelp (what we used to call seaweed).  I live near one of the two great kelp forests in the world, here off Southern California. Every time I go to the little inlet where I love to hang out,  I see a new different species, green, red, or brown. All different but all with the little air bladders we used to pop as kids.

Biologists have decided they are not plants, but a separate category. But, like plants, they "breathe" in carbon dioxide and "breathe out" oxygen. I'm told that kelp do more to keep  the air oxygen rich than trees do.

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #147 on: September 14, 2015, 05:05:25 PM »
Watched the Darby Nelson video. he looks just like a guy who spends his time canoeing around lakes ought to look.

I was interested in what he said about watersheds. What happens at the lakeshore depends on what happens at the watershed: those often little tiny creeks that feed into rivers that feed into lakes. We need to protect all water sources then: not just the biggest, but the smallest as well.

BarbStAubrey

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #148 on: September 14, 2015, 05:51:01 PM »
Wonderful additions Joan to our conversation - been busy today and will be back later this evening - just wanted to pop in for a second - I did not realize Joan that seaweed was kelp. I wonder how it is dried so that it does not lose the good - I have used Kelp as a daily herbal capsule for years and never knew it was seaweed. Interesting...
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #149 on: September 14, 2015, 07:29:39 PM »
I really enjoyed the section on harvesting wild rice.  It's a wonderful technique, involving a careful rhythm.  The one poling the canoe has to gauge both the proper path for getting the best yield and the right speed at each moment to coordinate with the beat of the harvester (who also has to have a proper rhythm), so (s)he can beat with maximum effect.  It seems almost zen like; I can imagine the feelings for the process that would develop if it were a major source of food.

Here's an Ojibwe site describing the significance of wild rice for their people, with a good picture or two, plus some details of technique.  Notice the parallel beating sticks.

http://www.manoomin.com/harvesting.html

Here's an NPR link with a good picture, some more description, and a comment about the threat of genetically modifying the rice.

http://news.minnesota.publicradio.org/features/2005/09/19_robertsont_wildrice/

Two interesting facts I learned in my browsing: The choice of wood for the beating sticks is important, as it must be both very strong and light enough not to tire the beater.  The lakes impart a taste to the rice, not duplicated in commercially grown rice, and those who  really care about such things claim they can tell by taste which lake the rice comes from.

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #150 on: September 15, 2015, 11:26:56 AM »
So many thoughts and questions come to mind reading the book - back to Joan's watershed bit - looks like we all probably live in a watershed - got online- of course, where else, it has become our up to date finger tapping encyclopedia - anyhow found this cartoonish but nice explanation of the watershed that does say any area higher than the lakes, rivers and streams is part of a watershed since water from the higher spots drain into the rivers, lakes and streams

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f63pwrMXkV4
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

JoanK

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #151 on: September 15, 2015, 04:04:31 PM »
PAT: it was good to see what the sticks used for harvesting wild rice actually look like: I didn't quite understand the process from reading Darby.

He also implies there are two things that might have prevented wild rice from becoming more commercialized up to now: the fact that the harvest is very variable, and the fact that the grains don't mature at the same time, so you can't have just one harvest. Looks like scientists are trying to overcome these and grow it commercially, even clone it.

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #152 on: September 15, 2015, 04:12:52 PM »
Thanks for the description of watershed. Where I used to live In Maryland, even though I was miles from the Potomac River, and a hundred miles from the ocean, the water in the tint creek behind my house was in the Potomac watershed, and eventually flowed into the ocean, as did the water from the storm drains in front of my house. 

JoanK

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #153 on: September 15, 2015, 04:15:31 PM »
The second of the watershed movies reminds us that it's not just debris left in water that pollutes our watershed. Debris left anywhere on the ground is carried by rain into the nearest water and beyond.

JoanK

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #154 on: September 15, 2015, 04:20:31 PM »
We're venturing on a different water adventure next month. The pre-discussion for "Dead Wake", the story of the sinking of the Lusitania is now open. come check us out :

http://seniorlearn.org/forum/index.php?topic=4811.msg261618;topicseen#new

BarbStAubrey

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #155 on: September 17, 2015, 04:10:13 AM »
Perfect description for this section because I sure was stretching my mind trying to get a handle on this section's first chapter - I could not figure out if Cyanobacteria was a good thing or a bad thing. And the talk of various chemicals making things like Turquoise was a challenge since I did not take chemistry while in school - however, once he likened it to making muffins I was on more solid ground and understood what he was saying.

Found a few links that assured me Cyanobacteria was both - a good thing and a bad thing - because I thought he was suggesting the what induced growth was Phosphorus which I understood was the nemesis to the creation of algae of which too much algae robbed a lake of oxygen reducing the ability of fish to survive.

Took a bit but that is exactly what he is saying however, I was surprised to learn how Phosphorus is necessary for growth, including growth in humans. That meat and dairy are the best sources of Phosphorus which maintains our bones and teeth, clears up indigestion and generally tones up the digestive system.  Also, it is a link to heart health, meaning that with a proper intake, you can better protect yourself from a range of cardiovascular diseases.   

I liked this link about Phosphorus and health benefits for humans -
https://www.organicfacts.net/health-benefits/minerals/health-benefits-of-phosphorus.html

This site corroborated for me what was explained in the book. I needed a second go round using different words to catch what was explained about Cyanobacteria.
http://www.ucmp.berkeley.edu/bacteria/cyanolh.html

So far I have read this chapter twice and I need one more go round to be sure I understand - each section of this book has one chapter that is a real challenge and then the other chapters in the section are a piece of cake that are off shoots of the chapter that is grounded in science. Sure glad I am reading this - I have learned so much that is probably typical science learned by the average student in High School today.
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

BarbStAubrey

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #156 on: September 17, 2015, 04:21:02 AM »
Aha - here we go - this site explains more about restoring a lake that was over-run with algae and how Aluminum, iron, or calcium salts can inactivate phosphorus in lake sediments. It also talks about dredging a lake - whew can you imagine if that is the cure required for lake Erie???

http://www.ecy.wa.gov/programs/wq/plants/algae/lakes/LakeRestoration.html

Now I do like this web site - things we can do to help maintain our lakes and rivers. Maybe not a big fix but there is that theory about the tipping point - so if enough of us act with restoration in mind we may see some results and these are pretty simply habits to adopt.

http://floridaswater.com/waterbodies/whatyoucando.html
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

BarbStAubrey

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #157 on: September 17, 2015, 04:25:56 AM »
Wow - bingo - this is a great PDF booklet with photos of Blue Green algae

http://healthvermont.gov/enviro/bg_algae/documents/BGA_guide.pdf
“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #158 on: September 17, 2015, 04:48:47 AM »
A photo of Diamond lake Michigan from the air

“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe

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Re: For Love of Lakes by Darby Nelson - Sept. Book Club Online
« Reply #159 on: September 17, 2015, 04:53:08 AM »
And Diamond Lake County Park

“A man should hear a little music, read a little poetry, and see a fine picture every day of his life, in order that worldly cares may not obliterate the sense of the beautiful which God has implanted in the human soul.” ~ Goethe