Hot Zone by Richard Preston- November Book Club Online

[hysteria2]

The Book Club Online is  the oldest  book club on the Internet, begun in 1996, open to everyone.  We offer cordial discussions of one book a month,  24/7 and  enjoy the company of readers from all over the world.  Everyone is welcome.

November Book Club Online  Will you join us?

The Hot Zone: A Terrifying True Story
by Richard Preston

It reads like a detective thriller, but it's a true story--how the Ebola virus was discovered, and what happened when it turned up in a research lab just a few miles from Washington, DC. "When Richard Preston's novel "The Hot Zone" was published in 1995, it was, for many, their first introduction to the deadly Ebola and Marburg viruses.  Nearly two decades later, Ebola has infected hundreds of people in three countries across West Africa, in what is considered the worst outbreak in history. As fear over the deadly virus grows, we need a reminder of what we learned so long ago from Preston." British Broadcasting Corporation BBC

DISCUSSION SCHEDULE:

PART ONE: The Shadow of Mount Elgon
Nov. 1 - 5~  First three chapters--Something in the Forest, Jumper, Diagnosis (Africa, 1980)
Nov. 6-9~  Next three chapters--A Woman and a Soldier, Project Ebola, Total Immersion (Maryland, 1983)
Nov 10-13~ Last three chapters--Ebola River(Africa, 1976), Cardinal(Africa, 1987), Going Deep

PART TWO: The Monkey House
Nov. 14-17~ First seven chapters--Reston, Into Level Three, Exposure, Thanksgiving, Medusa, The First Angel, The Second Angel (Maryland, Virginia, 1989)
Nov. 17-21~ Last six chapters--Chain of Command, Garbage Bags, Space Walk, Shoot-out, The Mission, Reconnaissnce

PART THREE: Smashdown
Nov. 22-?~ Insertion, A Man Down, 91-Tangos, Inside, A Bad Day, Decon, The Most Dangerous Strain

For Your Consideration
Nov. 14-?

1. As you follow the search for answers at Reston and Fort Detrick, what things did people do wrong?  What did they do right?
2. What did you think of the strange techniques needed for electron microscopy?
3. Could you have faced three weeks in the Slammer?  What makes it so hard to tolerate?




RELEVANT LINKS:
Prediscussion
BBC Ebola Primer
Mt. Elgon National Park

  

Discussion Leader: PatH

I'm not a bit surprised that Fox News had the most viewers concerning ebola. They probably have the most viewers period. But that doesn't mean their viewers are informed. In fact, a study was done a while back which showed that people who watched no news at all were better informed than people who got their news from Fox. Unfortunately I don't remember the name of the study, but I heard it several times. And yes, we will have to agree to disagree. I don't feel people are better educated today. True, a vast amount of information is available via the internet and social media. And so is a great deal of misinformation. Many people who partake of this type of media aren't intelligent enough to distinguish fact from fiction.

[PatH]

I never got around to putting up questions for this section, but you're answering a lot of them anyway.  But here's one: what did you think of that turf war between USAMRIID and CDC, and the clashing  personalities?  Have you experience that sort of thing?  Was the right decision made in this case?

[hysteria2]

Turf wars are nothing new. They have been going on since this government was formed and are certainly not unique to the US. No one wants to be considered subordinate to another entity. That is human nature. Anyone who who has been in the workforce has experienced this. So the fact that turf wars and personality clashes emerged between USAMRIID and the CDC is not surprising. Ideally turf wars should not be occurring when during a crisis situation. Human nature, however, wins out every time.

One other question that I wanted to address is the idea of spending 3 weeks in "The Slammer." I can see how people would go nuts in such a confined environment, especially not knowing if they would become symptomatic and then finally succumb to the disease. Confinement and uncertainty are enough to rattle the most rational person. I know I would have lost it, but then I would have had problems with the spacesuit. Movement within the suit was very limited. On top of that, there was the noise of the air system and the constant worry of a break in the system, such as the one experienced by Nancy Jaax. I take my hat off to those people who put themselves in this position in order to eradicate these dangerous diseases.   

[bellamarie]

Yes, I think their decision was the best one after they concluded what I would call a "pissing war."  Excuse my choice of words, but that is what my mother always said, when she saw men arguing over something dealing with power of who gets what.  C. J. Peter and Joe McCormick sure had no love lost between the two of them.

pg.  404 "A compromise seemed to be the best solution. the general and Fred Murphy quickly worked out the deal, while McCormick and Peters stared at each other with little to say.  It was agreed that the C.D.C. would manage the human-health aspects of the outbreak and would direct the care of any human patients.  The Army would handle the monkeys and the monkey house, which was the nest of the outbreak."

As far as spending three weeks in "the slammer,"  I felt it is the responsible, moral and honorable thing any person working with any deadly virus should be willing to do, if they feel could have been exposed/infected with the virus.  Those who sign up to work with the virus know the protocol, rules and expectations.  If they have any problems with any part of following them, they should not be a part of this work.  

The definition of the "slammer" is, (Military slang.)  The Biosafety Level 4 containment hospital at USAMRIID.

By this definition it does not give me any indication it is like a prison solitary confinement, in a small area with no comforts.  It is strictly for precaution and observation.  

The reason the two did not want to reveal they had whiffed or sniffed the tube, which could cause them to be placed in the slammer, was more to do with they would miss the opportunity for getting credit for the discovery of the virus, if someone else were able to be successful in doing so, during their three week quarantine.  Regardless of their reasons, they were taking a huge risk, and possibly infecting others they came in contact with, by keeping it hidden for fear of confinement.  

[MaryPage]

A new book I'd never heard of until Barnes & Noble emailed me this:

http://www.barnesandnoble.com/review/ebola-the-natural-and-human-history-of-a-deadly-virus/?sourceId=L000015661&cm_

[MaryPage]

Wow!  If you go to Barnes & Noble (their official site) and you do their search, choosing BOOKS only, and you put in the Title EBOLA, you get dozens and dozens and dozens of books!  Who knew?

[PatH]

Bellamarie, that's really the appropriate term for what was going on in that conference.  We're hearing it from the side that won, but I agree the decision was correct.  Each side got the part of the action where their strengths lay.

[PatH]

MaryPage, the book in your link, Ebola, by David Quamman, is the one mentioned in a New Yorker article posted toward the start of our discussion.  It's a slim thing, 111 pages.  He pulled some material from an earlier book, Spillover, about a number of animal viruses newly infecting humans, and amplified it to bring it up to date and make it relevant for the current epidemic.  He's scornful of Preston's gruesome description of the disease, saying it's overblown, but other things I've read suggest that mostly the truth is in the middle--Preston describing worst-case scenarios, and Quamman being too dismissive.

Quamman describes a woman having to go into the Slammer.  It's not someone we meet in this book; it happens 10 or 12 years later.  She manages to keep her sanity, with the help of video visits with her family, a fellow worker who brings her donuts when she enters to draw blood, and a dinner of carryout every night from her choice of Frederick restaurants.  (USAMRIID has no cafeteria, so they had to import her meals.)  The experience doesn't sour her on research; she fights her way through re-certification, and goes back as soon as she can.  The Slammer got its name from the heavy door, which slams loudly behind you.

[ginny]

I would like to gently say that although I don't want to get in a long drawn out heated slug fest over this corollary  issue brought up by a poster I really do have to say that I agree with hysteria2  about the state of education today. I also feel that it is  woefully inferior to that of the past. I don't know why. Anybody can see a copy of McGuffey's (sp) Reader and see the difference. Or read Mary Chestnut's letters from the 1800's, and see the difference.

It's true that there is so much more now to learn and know, and it's true that the internet and the media bombard us with inconsequential stuff continually (do we really want to see Kim Kardashians's behind? I'm not a proctologist)  but what it seems to mean is that we are inundated with well meaning garbage. This is fed, in large part, I believe,  by our own laziness, and the need to know it instantly, we're an instant culture now,  without much work, and the ready availability of Wiki Wackia. We are too lazy to look for something authoritative, we might have to go in 10 search  pages, let's settle for the first one. If it's online it must be true, right? I know it's true I see it in more than one website. Faugh.

I just came from another Latin "teaching" site where the instructor,  who has no credentials in Latin whatsoever,  but who means well ..I guess...is mispronouncing every other word and making his own unique  contribution to Caesar's Gallic Wars.   It's appalling. It's junk.  But it passes for "knowledge" today.   And it's not just one field, it's all of them.

Maybe there's so much to know now nobody can learn it all? Jack of all Trades, Master of None?

[PatH]

I agree with all of that.  We've gotten sloppy.  People are just as smart as ever, but they are getting out of the habit of thinking things through, and knowing anything in depth.

Ginny, I've always wondered, how do we know how Latin was pronounced?

[bellamarie]

Hysteria2,  

In fact, a study was done a while back which showed that people who watched no news at all were better informed than people who got their news from Fox. Unfortunately I don't remember the name of the study, but I heard it several times.

I would be very interested in seeing this study you speak of, and the people who were included in this study.  I suspect it would include a large number of progressive liberals, who are okay with mainstream media refusing to report anything negative where this administration is concerned.  It's sad to see well educated, respected reporters turn into Obama's lap dogs.  The newsworthy stations have turned into pop culture and celebrity news, since they have chosen to NOT report the real news any longer.  Fox News is a reputable station, and I can say I watch because it is the only station that will cover what really is going on.  They are willing to reveal the dishonesty and lack of transparency of this administration. Last night when Obama gave his unilateral executive amnesty order speech, Fox News is the ONLY channel that covered it, because the other stations found it way too political.  Fox News is the most trusted and leading station watched for news.  

TV Is Americans' Main Source of News
Preferred news source varies by age, education, and politics, among other factors

These results are based on a Gallup poll of 2,048 national adults conducted June 20-24, in which Americans were asked to say, unaided, what they consider to be their main source of news about U.S. and global events.

More than half the references to television are general, with 26% simply saying they watch television or TV news, 4% saying they watch local TV news, and 2% saying they watch the "evening news." The two leading 24-hour cable news channels -- Fox News and CNN -- are named by 8% and 7%, respectively. However, no other specific channel -- including MSNBC, PBS, BBC, and all of the U.S. broadcast networks that once dominated the news landscape -- is mentioned by more than 1% of Americans.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/163412/americans-main-source-news.aspx

Hysteria2,  

Many people who partake of this type of media aren't intelligent enough to distinguish fact from fiction.

It's difficult to respond to such a personal, insensitive statement.  Again, we will have to agree to disagree.

PatH.,

People are just as smart as ever, but they are getting out of the habit of thinking things through, and knowing anything in depth.

I agree, people are not taking the time to really investigate and learn the depth of things.  With Sirus/Google all you have to do is speak into the mic and ask a question and it's instantly there.  This world runs on instant everything.  Calculators replaced doing the math, spell check replaced looking into a dictionary, Wikipedia has replaced looking in encyclopedias, online games have replaced interactive board games, texting has replaced actually hearing someone's voice on a phone, online book clubs have replaced getting together in a room physically sitting with people so you can see their facial expressions and hear their voices, and the list goes on and on.  I feel it is causing our children to become less attentive, and adults to be less sensitive to respecting others differences of opinions. It's so easy to type into a computer insults and false information since you do not actually have to be accountable.  It's out there for all to see, and whether it is true or not, it creates an image in others it is so.  I watch Jesse Waters from the Bill O'Reilly Show  go to prestigious colleges, where parents are paying $50,000 a year for their young adult to be educated, and these students can't even recognize the Vice President of the United States, tell you what Ebola is, thinks ISIS is an app, and don't have a clue where Liberia is located, yet these same students will graduate, many with honors, and go on to become doctors, lawyers, scientists, biologists, teachers, nurses, accountants, computer programmers, architects, etc.  So while they may not be worldly or politically informed, that does not discredit the fact they are educated.  I would like any one of us in this book club try to do the Math problems my fourth grade grandchild is doing.  I can almost bet, because of the method they are using today in the classrooms, none of us would understand it.  So, while there were very intelligent people throughout the centuries, I do believe we have just as many well educated, intelligent people today.

This might be a good time to go on to the next chapters, and back to discussing "The Hot Zone"  

[MaryPage]

BellaMarie, I really so did not want to get into this aspect of our discussion, but feel I must.  I watched the President on PBS last night;  they and most other stations interrupted their planned programming in order to present his speech.  One of the main points he made in that speech was that he is NOT offering amnesty.  No amnesty at all.

There was immediate follow up discussion on many stations, and it went on all night long on some.  When I rose this morning and turned on Morning Joe on MSNBC, it was all they were talking about.  So I do not get it that only FOX was offering any news on that subject?

I, personally, find FOX very akin to a sensational scandal mongering tabloid newspaper, and feel deeply that I cannot trust their allegations.

I also constantly watch David Muir (just recently Diane Sawyer) on ABC and Brian Williams on NBC and Scott Pelley on CBS.  All give constant information about Ebola and all other important news.

[PatH]

This might be a good time to go on to the next chapters, and back to discussing "The Hot Zone"  

I agree.  Lets get back to the main subject, and on to the next chapters.

We have a decision to make.  The next section, Smashdown, is about a hundred pages.  We've been reading 50 page chunks, but this section is mostly one continuous action story, and reads fast, and there is less to say about a lot of the chapters.  Shall we read it all in one chunk?  It makes sense unless you don't want to read that fast, and I think a lot of you have already read ahead.  I'll go by what everyone says by the end of the day.  If we split it, the first chunk will be 4 chapters--Insertion, A Man Down, 91-Tangos, and Inside.

[hysteria2]

Thank you Ginny for providing the facts about my statements concerning American education.

I am finding that the more I get into The Hot Zone, the more I want to keep reading. So my intention is to go ahead and finish the book. (I never was very patient when it comes waiting until the end to find out what happens. I have pulled some all nighters finishing mysteries.) So however everyone else wants to divide it up is fine by me.

[MaryPage]

I am just so excited that you are all feeling so fervent about The Hot Zone,  because I have felt for simply years and years now that it is one of those books that has truly made a CONTRIBUTION to the readers view of this world we all inhabit.

[bellamarie]

Mary Page,

I, personally, find FOX very akin to a sensational scandal mongering tabloid newspaper, and feel deeply that I cannot trust their allegations.

According to the Gallup and other polls, Fox is the most trusted and watched.  You, and others who feel this way are among the minority.  We all have our own personal preferences and that is okay, thanks for weighing in.  

My dvr was set for some of the shows on these stations and they aired as usual.

http://deadline.com/2014/11/obama-us-immigration-primetime-speech-univision-1201289203/
https://deadline.com/2014/11/obama-immigration-primetime-speech-tv-networks-1201291124/

PatH.,  I am okay with how ever everyone decides to continue with the following chapters. I have not read ahead, so I'm going to begin the next four that you have mentioned, and if we go further that is fine with me.

[Ella Gibbons]

Can you imagine living as Nancy Jaxx?   I would be in a mental institution if I were her; not only does she work with life-threatening virus all day - but to go home to her children (forget how many!) and then dealing with cats and dogs plus a screeching parrot.

And then at work she has to worry about the monkeys - they grab at your face and head if you give them a chance, they are intelligent and fast!!

No way!

I don't know where in the book we are, I finished it and just made some notes along the way.

[hysteria2]

I agree with you, Ella. Life as Nancy Jaax would be intense but never boring! She is one who really needs to shut the door when she leaves for the day (or night as it usually is in her case) and not take her work home with her. However, keep in mind that veterinary school takes concentration, discipline and intelligence. So her background does lend itself to her chosen career path.

[PatH]

The ayes have it; we'll take all of part three, Smashdown, at once.  (JoanK's vote was received by twin ESP, i. e. telephone.)  The chapters are in the heading.  It's an exciting section, and a fast read.  If we take our usual 4-5 days, that will leave time for the last section plus some commentary about Ebola history since the book, the current situation, and whatever.

[ginny]

I feel it is causing our children to become less attentive, and adults to be less sensitive to respecting others differences of opinions. It's so easy to type into a computer insults and false information since you do not actually have to be accountable.

This is an interesting point, and in the spirit of the coming season,  I  would like to take this opportunity to  gently remind all the participants  involved in this discussion that SeniorLearn  is actually not a public unattended internet site, it is privately held,  and the people posting here do  have to be accountable, not only for courtesy and cordial discussion,  but for lapses in same.

When you registered for this site you agreed to the terms and conditions of this site, and one of them was

Anyone who feels that a posted message is objectionable is encouraged to notify an administrator or moderator of this forum immediately. The staff and the owner of this forum reserve the right to remove objectionable content, within a reasonable time frame, if they determine that removal is necessary

.


Some of us may have forgotten or perhaps we never knew that ad hominem remarks are not desired in any of our boards, a rule which we've had in force since 1986 when the Books discussions were first founded.  This, then, is a reminder notice,  and it will be the only one, that ad hominem remarks   will not be tolerated and will be removed at the sole discretion of the  Admin.

Anyone having a question on this issue  may take it up with the Administration.

[PatH]

MaryPage, I'm sorry, I messed up your post #205.  In the course of selecting part of it to quote, I accidentally pushed the wrong button, and deleted some of it.  It was your reference to the Barnes and Noble review of Quamman's book.  I'm very sorry.  I'm not allowed to do that, and this is the first time I've goofed in that way.

[PatH]

Wow!  If you go to Barnes & Noble (their official site) and you do their search, choosing BOOKS only, and you put in the Title EBOLA, you get dozens and dozens and dozens of books!  Who knew?

It looks like one could spend a month or so reading about Ebola until one's brain popped.  In fact, I'm well on the way to it.  I bought Quamman's slim book, and got his Spillover from the library.  And after telling you I wasn't going to read Virus Hunter just yet, I'm well into it.

[MaryPage]

A month or so!  I've been into viruses for 19 years now, and there is just no end to new information.  No end.

I have two major pillars of fixation about them in my head:  one is that they have been around forever, and we are just now scratching the surface of learning about them.  The other is that we will never be able to destroy them, but can learn to protect ourselves from the ones who are dangerous to our existence.

Microbiology has got to be one of the most fascinating disciplines there is.  One thing I note crops up over and over and yet over again:  too many human beings insist upon being prescribed with antibiotics for sicknesses caused entirely by viruses, and antibiotics cannot so much as touch viruses, but using them makes the bacteria present within our bodies react and mutate and learn to build up defenses against them which ultimately are harmful to the human race because when a disease comes along that IS caused by bacteria, we have no arsenal to kill them and save ourselves!  All because of people, in their ignorance, insisting upon being given antibiotics and doctors giving in to them.  So sad, so sad, how we, as a species, insist upon going around shooting ourselves in the foot continuously.

[Ella Gibbons]

MARYPAGE, my daughter who has a Ph.D. in Nursing Science, attended an all-day conference yesterday on VIRUSES.   In our nightly phone conversation I neglected to ask pertinent questions, darn!   She did say it was an aabsolutely fascinating conference.

You are right there is no end to new information apparently.  

I was always told, humorously I suppose,  that when all is erased from the earth (by whatever means) that cockroaches would prevail.  Now perhaps we can say a virus may linger on a cockroach?

[PatH]

Ella, you gave me my laugh for the day.  Yes, I'm sure there will be viruses on the ruling cockroaches.

[PatH]

Pedln gave us a link to an article bringing the Jaax history up to date, which many of us didn't read because it contained spoilers.  Once we've read this section, there won't be spoilers, so here's the link again.

http://www.kansas.com/news/local/article3662605.html

[hysteria2]

A month or so!  I've been into viruses for 19 years now, and there is just no end to new information.  No end.

Microbiology has got to be one of the most fascinating disciplines there is.  One thing I note crops up over and over and yet over again:  too many human beings insist upon being prescribed with antibiotics for sicknesses caused entirely by viruses, and antibiotics cannot so much as touch viruses, but using them makes the bacteria present within our bodies react and mutate and learn to build up defenses against them which ultimately are harmful to the human race because when a disease comes along that IS caused by bacteria, we have no arsenal to kill them and save ourselves!  All because of people, in their ignorance, insisting upon being given antibiotics and doctors giving in to them.  So sad, so sad, how we, as a species, insist upon going around shooting ourselves in the foot continuously.

YES!!!!! I wish more people would realize that antibiotics do not cure everything! When they were discovered (by accident I might add), people hailed them as miracle drugs. Doctors were being inundated by requests for them to treat absolutely everything. And in a sense, they were miracle drugs. People no longer had to worry about rheumatic fever as a consequence of an untreated streptococcal infection. Children no longer had to suffer through repeated bouts of ear infections. STDs could now be treated. But the concept was taken too far. People with colds ran to the doctor for an antibiotic, which of course was useless against a virus. This trend continues today. Even when I was adult and actively practicing nursing, if I made the mistake of mentioning to my mother that I had a cold, she immediately told me to go to the doctor to get an antibiotic. No matter how many times I tried to explain to her that it was a virus which was untreatable with antibiotics, she held firm. The older generation (my parents' age group--I of course will never be considered the older generation!) seems to really be fixated on the miracle of antibiotics. That makes sense, because antibiotics were discovered in the 1940's, purely by accident. A researcher was trying to grow a culture of bacteria that eventually became contaminated by mold. He made the interesting observation that there was no bacterial growth in the areas where the mold was growing. Eureka! Penicillin was discovered. That being said, doctors are not exactly blameless in the excessive prescription of antibiotics. They know if they don't give patients what they want, the patients will take their dollars elsewhere. So antibiotics were overprescribed, and now we are facing some really bad superbugs. Like viruses, bacteria can mutate. I don't know how many of you are familiar with MRSA (methicillin resistant staphylococcus aureus), but it is now a major problem. A simple skin flora bacteria became pathogenic, to the point where penicillin and its derivatives no longer worked. Someone in a weakened condition could be overrun with this, and there would be nothing that could treat it. Now of course we do have antibiotics that work against MRSA, but they are not without dangerous side effects. Thus the cure can be as bad as the disease. Now I do have to say when antibiotics are warranted they should be used. Case in point: my adult son (who knows everything of course!) had what he thought was a cold for over 3 weeks, and it kept getting worse. I told him to go to the doctor because it could be pneumonia, and he gave me the typical "It's just a virus and the only thing that will cure it is time." His temperature was 104. (He has 2 small children at home; I freaked out and insisted he go to the doctor.) The next day when I talked to him it was "(mumble, mumble) pneumonia (mumble, mumble)." After 5 days of treatment with the Z pack, he was fine. So the point is, when antibiotics are warranted, yes, they should be used. Just not for everything. (Sorry this is so long, but this is one of my soapbox issues.)

[Ella Gibbons]

RE:  Above posts:

Don't you think doctors in general are more educated about antibiotics today?   They will not prescribe them for minor attacks of colds, coughs, etc.

I can't tell you how many people have said my doctor won't give me anything for this (cough, cold, slight fever, whatever).

I think the facts are getting out, perhaps I'm wrong.

[PatH]

I think it's a soapbox issue for a lot of us.  It's too bad the doctors aren't firmer about not prescribing inappropriately, but I can see why they give in.

The other soapbox issue is giving antibiotics to animals being raised for food, not to treat them, but because they grow faster.  That's HUGELY inappropriate.

Ella, I think you're right.  Whenever my doctor gives me an antibiotic (usually for bronchitis) she explains carefully why it fits the guidelines to do so.

[Ella Gibbons]

A quick aside:  years ago, when we attended Elderhostels we went to the historical site on the Brandywine River  in Delaware where the Dupont brothers had brought gunpowder to the USA from France.  Couldn't get my husband away from this historical little place - cobblestones streets where horses had to wear plush soft boots as to not cause a spark and displays and displays.  They had a little restaurant where I sat for a couple of hours waiting.

And now I read that the biohazard space suits  were made of Tyvek, a Dlupont product.

http://www2.dupont.com/Tyvek/en_US/

Get rich, buy a share of Dupont, look at all their products!   (And youo can watch the movie FOXCATCHER when it comes out soon as it is about one of the Dupont brothers)

[hysteria2]

RE:  Above posts:

Don't you think doctors in general are more educated about antibiotics today?   They will not prescribe them for minor attacks of colds, coughs, etc.

I can't tell you how many people have said my doctor won't give me anything for this (cough, cold, slight fever, whatever).

I think the facts are getting out, perhaps I'm wrong.

No, Ella, you're not wrong. Things are definitely getting better. However, while they were getting better a lot of bacteria had a chance to mutate and become superbugs. We may be dealing with this for a while. At least antibiotics aren't advertised on TV like many medications are. I really think it should be illegal for Big Pharma to advertise their meds on TV to the uninformed public. The idea of course is for the patient to run to the doctor and request the advertised medication, which may or may not be appropriate for the patient. Hopefully the doctor will not be swayed. However big Pharma spends megabucks trying to influence doctors to prescribe their products. Before I retired, I would go to luncheons sponsored (and completely paid for) by drug companies. I have all kinds of pens, tablets, calculators, etc., given away by drug companies. Sorry, this is another soapbox of mine. I bought into their advertising for many years. I'm sure many physicians did too, though they received the more expensive perks, such as weekend trips. OK, enough of that.

I finished The Hot Zone. I didn't want it to end. Now that I know about all the other books out there that cover the ebola virus, I will be immersing myself. Thanks to everyone for mentioning the additional sources.

[MaryPage]

Oh, Pat!  You hit a nerve with ME when you mention our purchasing and eating beef and chicken and pork chock full of antibiotics and HORMONES!  Scary, scary stuff!  We do terrible harm to our very own homo sapiens in order to MAKE MORE MONEY.

And yes, Ella;  many doctors are too scrupulous to give out prescriptions for antibiotics willy nilly, but there are many others, unfortunately, who cannot withstand the nagging and are terrified of having their practices ruined by dissatisfied patients who take THEIR dollars elsewhere and complain loudly as to how bad a doctor the one they have left is. Reputations suffer from word of mouth, especially in smaller communities and one-hospital towns.

The one unfailing rule of Life is "Follow The Money, Follow The Money, Follow The Money!"

I read in this mornings paper that the World Health Organization (WHO) says the Plague has just killed 40 out of 119 confirmed cases in Madagascar.  The roller coaster ride never ends. I know I have also read recently that a whole lot is going on ecologically in that island nation of unique life forms.

[JoanK]

Oh my, two f my hot button issues. My-daughter-the-doctor used to work with another doctor who informed her matter-of factly that he DID prescribe antibiotics for colds! I thought that was irresponsible.

And the chemicals that are put in our foods! Most foods have become completely tasteless, even "fresh" fruit and vegetable. Who knows what stuff we are eating? My theory is that the reason spicy and over-salted foods are so popular now is that the spice disguises the fact that the food underneath has no taste left. 

[hysteria2]

Oh my, two f my hot button issues. My-daughter-the-doctor used to work with another doctor who informed her matter-of factly that he DID prescribe antibiotics for colds! I thought that was irresponsible.

And the chemicals that are put in our foods! Most foods have become completely tasteless, even "fresh" fruit and vegetable. Who knows what stuff we are eating? My theory is that the reason spicy and over-salted foods are so popular now is that the spice disguises the fact that the food underneath has no taste left. 

I stopped eating salads at the cafeteria in the hospital. I swear I could taste the preservatives in the lettuce. I thought maybe it was my imagination until someone else mentioned it too. Now that I am retired I try to make as much from scratch as possible. When I pick up a container at the store and it has more ingredients than a chemistry lab, that sends out a red flag. In the old days (I mean really old days) salt and spices were used to preserve food (and cover up the taste of spoiled food).

[PatH]

Yes, that's why fortunes were made importing pepper.

[Ella Gibbons]

HYSTERIA, I cannot eat salads anywhere; I fix my own at home also.   There is something they spray on the lettuce that my digestive system rejects in the very worst way.  It took me awhile to figure it out, but the FDA should be notified.  These salad bars in grocery stores are full of sprays to keep them looking fresher and the fruit and vegetables we bring home should all be washed, everything washed.

Oh, the more we read, the less we should eat; then why can't I lose a few pounds?

[Jonathan]

I feel overwhelmed by all that I've learned by just following this stimulating discussion. Thanks to all of you. It has made me more optimistic about the future to hear about the successful research efforts into the medical problems that come along. Three cheers for all the professional health care people out there.

And the many provocative observations from all of you have so gently disturbed my state of blissful ignorance. The burden of many years have left me with the feeling that I may be losing it here and there. I've certainly lost some confidence in my tastebuds. What a relief to hear it's not me after all:

'Most foods have become completely tasteless.'  And in another post:

'I swear I could taste the preservatives in the lettuce.'

That's it!! That's why we're all living so much longer!! It's the preservatives. Let's give thanks.

[bellamarie]

Jonathan, welcome, it is good to see you have been following the discussion.  It seems these next chapters are more suspenseful than the others, so hold on to your hat and get ready for some intense things to happen.  If you don't wear a hat, then grab a cup of Joe and get comfy.  No aspartame please!   

I saw this and wondered, is it better to downplay the seriousness of something like this, to calm the public and appease the media? Even though I am someone who wants to know everything possible, especially if there is any danger involved, there is a part of me that maybe would be a little okay with the down playing, to prevent panic. 

pg. 435  "A military biohazard operation was about to go down in a suburb of Washington, and he (C.J.)sure as hell didn't want the Post to find out about it.  Half of this biocontainment operation was going to be news containment.  C.J. Peters's comments to The Washington Post were designed to create an impression that the situation was under control, safe, and not at all that interesting.  C.J. was understating the gravity of the situation." 

[PatH]

Yes, this section is mostly an exciting and dangerous chase.  Notice, though, how many times, in how many ways, the virus puzzles them by not behaving as expected.

[ginny]

I do hope to catch up today,  especially if exciting and well written, so I can experience the issues you all are bringing up. But in aid of the subject of  antibiotics, since it was brought up, such an interesting discussion of it, I have often wondered what did people do for UTIs (urinary tract infections) before antibiotics? Have you never wondered that?

Did they just die? I have no doubt it  can kill you. It almost does, anyway, right?  I have always wanted to know.

Jonathan, I've been thinking about you and am glad to see you here.  We've got something coming up in the Books that has your name, and I hope a lot of other people's names,  all over it in February! Or so I hope.